Etiquette used to be the glue that held society together. It enabled people to get on with friends and neighbors without causing offense or harm. Sadly, these days it has mostly gone by the wayside. This list is of 10 of the best rules of etiquette that have now vanished. Perhaps it will inspire some to revive them!
I have made this item 10 because it is more a case of correct dress rather than manners. First off, if your wedding is before 6 in the evening, you should not wear a tuxedo (black tie) or tails (white tie). You should either wear a formal suit or – if you want to be very proper – a morning suit. There is an excellent article here that will explain the rules of wedding dress for men. It is customary for the groom to give a tie to each of the men in the wedding party. If you are wearing a morning suit or a formal suit, give your wedding party ties that are similar but do not match. You want the party to look similar – but not like members of a choir. The photograph above shows you how this can be done to very good effect. It is, of course, Prince Henry and Prince William at their father’s wedding. If you are getting married after 6pm, you can wear a tuxedo or tails as these are evening clothes. Here is a guide for wearing tails.
In days gone by, a gentleman would always open doors for ladies. Whether it be the lady they were driving, or a stranger entering a building, it was always the done thing. This has now almost entirely vanished – and it is not entirely the fault of the men. I have seen women sneer at men for opening a door for them. They seem to be confusing manners with chauvinism. My advice in this case is to smile at the sneering lady and open the door anyway.
In days gone by, whenever a person received a gift, they would write a thank-you as soon as possible. This rule was true even if the giver was a relative. Parents would sit children down after a birthday or Christmas and coach them in their first thank-you notes. It is a shame that gift giving has now become a virtual obligation and the idea of a thank-you note would be scoffed at. If you ignore every other item on this list, at least try to teach your children to write thank you notes – they will have a greater appreciation of gifts they receive.
When people had a wedding or a special occasion party in the past, they would never have considered having a “gift registry”. To do so would be tantamount to asking people for a gift – which is extremely rude even today. It would also have been considered rude to say something like “no gifts” as it implies that gifts are an expected obligation. I can honestly say that I have never received a wedding invitation that didn’t also invite me to purchase a gift at my friend’s favorite shop. People seem to think it is okay as long as they include a few “cheap” gifts to balance out the extraordinary number of incredibly expensive gifts that I can’t even afford for myself! I have seen wedding registries that contain gifts valued in the thousands of dollars. Wedding invitations did not mention gifts – they did not ask for them and they did not include such silly things as “no gifts!” or worse still “donations to [insert charity no one cares about except you] in lieu of gifts”
We seem to have completely lost the concept of correct timing when it comes to parties these days. People leave when they are bored, when they want to go to another party, when they are too drunk, when they are not drunk enough, the excuses are endless. First of all, a party normally has a guest of honor – this is usually the oldest woman present. It was considered extremely rude in the past to leave a party before the guest of honor – and once the guest of honor left, it was a signal to all that they should begin their own preparations to leave. The loss of this etiquette rule is because we have largely thrown away the concept of a guest of honor.
This seemed a fitting item to follow the previous: in the olden days it was rude to arrive late. There was no such thing as being “fashionably late”. Lateness was rudeness – always. In most houses, if you were invited to dinner and turned up 15 minutes late, you would end up eating alone in the kitchen surrounded by the household staff, only to be allowed to join the party when the polite guests (who arrived on time) had finished and were retiring for the evening’s entertainment.
I could write a whole list on the lost etiquette of dinner – but I shall simply abridge it for this list. First of all, people used to dress for dinner – and they would all eat together at the table. Dressing for dinner emphasized the importance of family and healthy food. It is no wonder that now that we scoff food down in front of TV and all eat at different times, that we are becoming fatter as a race. This is one area where I try particularly hard to follow the rules. I don’t dress for dinner, but I sit with my family every night at the dinner table. I strongly recommend it as a good way to build up a good family spirit.
I had to add this item because there is a brilliant and funny quote relating to it. Let’s start with the quote (it is from “Everyday Manners” by Emily Post):
[P]arents must never disagree before the children. It simply can’t be! Nor can there be an appeal to one parent against the other by a child.
“Father told me to jump down the well!”
“Then you must do it, dear,” is the mother’s only possible comment. When the child has “jumped down the well,” she may pull him out promptly, and she may in private tell her husband what she thinks about his issuing such orders and stand her own ground against them; but so long as parents are living under the same roof, that roof must shelter unity of opinion, so far as any witnesses are concerned.
That is how a strong a rule it was! I bet you won’t find any parents today who agree strongly with this one.
This is probably the rule most ignored these days: in the old days, people walking on the street would dress discreetly, talk discreetly, and never do anything which would draw attention to themselves. It was forbidden to mention names of friends as it is indiscreet. The gentleman always walked on the road side of the sidewalk – to protect the lady or ladies from passing traffic (which the two fakes in the photo above appear not to know). People would not look or talk to strangers passing and would never call out to a friend on the other side of the street.
This is another large topic. Let’s give a quick rundown: A gentleman would have never:
1. Borrowed money from a lady
2. Borrowed money from a man without security and the intention to pay it back as quickly as possible
3. Discussed money
4. Discussed his possessions or their cost
5. Name dropped: “When I was dining with Mr Rich…”, “I am great friends with Miss Gottabuck”
On the other hand, he would have assumed the debts of a deceased family member as it was a debt of honor. How far we have come! Money and the pursuit of wealth has become so obvious these days that a whole new term has been coined because of it: conspicuous consumption. There was once a day that we did not try to keep up with the Joneses – because we didn’t know what the Joneses had and no one knew what we had.
Contributor: JFrater
A wonderful little aphorism by, I think Oscar Wilde (who else could it be?) sums up how etiqette exists (or existed) at once as a social badge and a lethal social weapon:
“A gentleman is a person who never deliberately offends.”
Just note that marvellous little word “deliberately”.
Etiquette is the very basis of class security, insecurity, dominance and social pretension. Anyone who has merely dipped a big toe into British literature, filmography or TV comedy and drama has to know that. “Vanity Fair”, Jane Austen, “Upstairs, Downstairs”, “Gosford Park”, “Keeping Up Appearances”, “Angels and Insects”, “To The Manor Born”, “Only Fools and Horses”, “Fawlty Towers”, … well, the best part of Brit comedy is based on that premise.
Gee why don’t we all just live like the exact same perfect flawless person?
“It would also have been considered rude to say something like “no gifts” as it implies that gifts are an expected obligation.”
As a mother of four, I always include “no gifts” on my children’s party invitations and know many other mothers that do as well. This isn’t done out of a belief that gifts are expected but as a way to ensure that no child is forced to skip a friend’s party because they couldn’t afford a gift. I know some families that only allow their children to attend a certain number of birthday parties per year because they can’t afford (or choose not) to buy presents for all of them. This ends up being upsetting for the child unable to attend as well as potentially devastating for the birthday child who can’t understand why one of their friends would refuse to come to their party.
Oh dear God… What is with the aggressiveness? How in the world can being polite contribute to the inequality between genders?!? It´s not that I, as a woman, cannot open a door and I KNOW that my fiance doesnt do it because he has a penis and he thinks I might faint from the exertion.
Here´s a novel idea. Instead of thinking of it as a degradation of the female gender, consider the opposite as true. Men will grovel at our feet… WE HAVE ALL THE POWER!
Those who have suggested holding doors open for everyone rather than nobody (for fear of insulting women) have my sympathy. I have no problem walking through a door held open by a woman if it’s appropriate to the flow of movement. And I hope I would no more rudely push in front of another man than a woman. But you would be surprised how nasty regular women shoppers can be in supermarket checkout queues trying to sneak in front what they probably regard as a soft *inexperienced male shopper*. That gets from me the verbal treaqtment it deserves!
Graciously declining is another social skill that is sometimes lost in favour of unnecessary outrage. Into my seventh decade, I’m still perfectly capable of hitting the summit of a 2000 m plus mountain and back in day from well below 1000 m. Nevetheless, young people occasionally look with pity on my wizened features in buses and trains, and may be known to offer up their seats. Even young women have done that. Now I might react with indignation as “WTF do think I am, some One Foot in the Graver you insolent young so-and-so.” But I smile gratefully and decline politely. What else?
Here’s a thought: the word ‘etiquette’ is French, and the wiki article says that our modern concepts of etiquette generally derive from the court of Louis XVI.
Some of these rules need to be reinstated, but the rest are just nitpicky. The wedding dress rule is just an outdated custom.
GTT:
You just said the following.
“How in the world can being polite contribute to the inequality between genders?!”
and then:
“Instead of thinking of it as a degradation of the female gender, consider the opposite as true. Men will grovel at our feet… WE HAVE ALL THE POWER!”
I think I’ve made my point. Now go find a man to do all of your thinking for you.
Alextenn: Wow… Did you not see the smiley face? As in, a light-hearted comment to take the edge off? I guess you must have missed it in your hurry to to be as disagreeable as possible…
the author of this list has traveled forward in time from the late 1800′s, leaving his town of toffeeville!
I always offer up my seat on the bus, it’s something I’ve been raised to do, and as a young woman in my early 20′s I’d hate to offend an older man, but it’s done in a courteous spirit? I never realised anyone felt indignant because of it, if anything here, in Ireland, it’s considered the only polite thing to do. I’d expect a young fella to offer his up first, and I’d offer more automatically to an older woman, but but it’s what’s always been considered the nice thing to do. And that’s why I do it, to be nice, and as a sign of deference and respect.
And just to add a little to this talk on etiquette contributing to gender inequality; I’ve never been expected to be treated the same as a man. Equally, yes, completely, it’s my entitlement, but not the same. We are different beings, with different strengths and weaknesses, and different things to offer to a given situation. If a man wishes, being the more physically (body mass-wise) hardy of the two of us, to undertake to put himself before me in case of an accident, I am ok with that. If he doesn’t, I’m equally ok with it. I don’t expect the behavior, but I do appreciate it when it is extended, because it’s nearly always extended in a manner of respect. I’ve personally never known it to be extended in a subjugating way.
Oh Lord…I was taught most of these from a very early age. Always open doors for people, ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY women. If you don’t open a door for a woman, it’s like slapping them in the face (or so I was taught…). Always walk on the street side to protect a lady. ALWAYS write thank you notes, even if you profusely thanked the gift giver upon receiving the gift. Always stand up whenever a lady sits down/stands up at the dinner table. Never ever EVER begin eating until EVERYONE is seated; don’t even touch the silverware. ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS be on time; be early if you have to, but never ever ever be late. Never. The way I was taught, lateness was the 8th deadly sin. I could go on and on and on, but most of the rules concerned treating women with respect (My mother is the only woman in my family of a father and 2 brothers, and she rules us with an iron fist, haha!).
This is my fist time commenting~^_^
I liked the list! Although some seem a bit old-fashioned. I definitely will try to have my future children write thank you cards. Its a great way to have more interaction with kids and teach them at the same time.
Great list! Reminds me of the the rules we think we forgot!
Dayum!
I almost suffocated because of how stuffy this list was!
As Ned Flanders once said something along the lines of: “I wish we were still in the good old days! That time that exists only in the minds of conservatives!”
Don’t forget, that with all those “manners” and “etiquette” also came “double standards” and people thinking they were “better” then the next guy…
Give me modern equality any day!
How I miss these important points of civility and good, old-fashioned respect for others. Having been brought up in the U.K. these things were ingrained into my upbringing and it’s only now, across the pond, that I realize what valuable life lessons they were. There is no substitute for good manners, however fashionable it may be to eschew the old ways for sloppy modernity and the “anything goes” attitude which is depressingly prevalent these days.
Hiamn- My thoughts exactly.
Number 6 still happens in some parts of Korea. A few months ago my wife and I had a group of colleagues for dinner. Soon after dessert the principal stood up, said pleasantries and headed for the door. Within 5 minutes, everyone was gone.
Koreans are a curious mix of formality and downright rudeness. At every Korean wedding I have been to (except mine), the groom has done the full ritual bow to both sets of parents, and the bride has bowed as low as possible from the waist. At my wife’s uncle’s 60th birthday various relatives had to do the ritual bowing to him (including me, under protest, but when in Seoul etc).
Contrasted with this are drivers and subway travellers. Seoul metro stations have footmarks and a line to indicate where to stand, people mostly do, until the train arrives, then everyone piles on any old how.
In Korea it is acceptable to ask someone you’ve just met “How old are you?”, “What is your job?”, “How much do you earn?” and “Are you married?”. Traditionally Korea had a very rigidly structured hierarchical society, where the ‘higher’ and the ‘lower’ person had distinct roles to play and things to say. In a village, you knew everyone anyway. In a traditional city, you could tell by their clothes or how many servants they had. Now, age, job and money have (generally) taken over that role.
As well as teaching English, part of my job is to give some knowledge of western customs. You’d have no idea of how many students greet me cheefully “Hello, ‘Smith’”, unaware of how monumentally rude that is. (I hope that they’re unaware and are not doing it deliberately!)
I’m sure that I transgress against Korean etiquette all the time!
Let me tell you about parental unity. IT WORKS!!! My husband and I were brought up the old-fashioned way and still follow many of the above examples. As regards to parental unity, our boys are now 16 and 14 and I cannot tell you how many people compliment us on our “wonderful” children. So polite, kind, generous, gallant. We have always sat down to dinner together and eaten healthily and with conversation and another comment we received was sheer amazement that boys this age still want to “hang out with their parents”. I truly believe a little etiquette goes a long way and helps build lovely people.
Overly formal and ***** retentive much, Jfrater?
jfrater: That’s what I get for trying to remember my 9th grade history class 7 years later. I cede the point to you
Though, as a philosopher(yes I do have a degree in philosophy!) I must dispute your use of the term fallacy, my logic was flawless, it was my information that was wrong. A formal fallacy points out a flaw in ones logic between their premises, not the premises themselves. An informal fallacy points out a flaw between ones premises and their conclusion, though not necessarily due to logical components. The term has taken on a popular and nonetheless incorrect meaning of being mistaken in idea or reference (aka ones premises) this is simply not true. And that point I could give you many sources for!
Also, who cares what white commonwealth people did a hundred years ago?
REALLY?
Panic (113): I am sorry you think I am pompous and more so that you think I ought to shoot myself in the face. I wrote this list – as I have done with so many of the others, so that I can provide varied and interesting entertainment via this, my site. You don’t have to like everything I present here, but to suggest that someone shoot himself is very unpleasant and not something that the majority of the readers here would say. Furthermore, if I did, there would be no more site and lists – so we would all lose!
joeyjoejoeshabadoo: many of the people who have written the 140 comments on this list? Just because you are only interested in things that happen to you in your life, doesn’t mean everyone else wishes to be narrow minded.
Bah… Sorry for the overall unpleasantness of my comment, I suppose I could have toned that down a bit. I realize it’s your site, and you should post whatever you please, this list just hit me wrong.
I apologize for asking you to shoot yourself in the face, but not my opinions.
The girls-sneering thing happens to me all the time. Of course, if someone they’re attracted to opens the door, they want to talk about how they have great mannners. Of course, I do live in the south and there are a lot of shallow people here.
As I was reading these comments, I kept waiting for someone to point out the blatent rudeness of jajdude in #10: “Seems the best way would be to act like Koreans as they have a culture is absolutely devoid of manners and social graces.”
I hope he meant his comment to be “tongue in cheek,” but that was not at all clear. Astraya helped a lot by explaining some of the differences between Korean and western customs. I still think jajdude’s remark was rude and racist, and so would my Korean friends.
To me, and to the family in which I was raised, etiquette and good manners were very important, and were seen as a basic tool with which to get along with one’s fellow humans.
There was one change, though. My father, a colonel in the Air Force, never allowed us to call him “Sir.” He would say, “I’m your father, not your commanding officer!” So it was “Yes, Dad,” or “No, Dad.” I still find this charming.
Basically, if one follows the Golden Rule, good manners will be the result.
Would it have been adhering to the “Rules Of Etiquette” if he asked you, politely, to wear a Kevlar mask before said face shooting?
I hope it wouldn’t be as horrendous as wearing a black tie before 6 on your wedding day. God forbid, am I right fellas?
I scoffed as I scarfed down this list.
Number 2 is interesting. In Mexico, if a man and a woman are walking down a sidewalk, the man must also walk on the street side. If the woman is on the street side, it means that she is a prostitute and the man is her ***** or a “john”.
the reason those rules died out is becouse they are all obsolete. to bring them back would take humanity a step backwards, move on with your life.
“Manners” has to do with forks etc.
“Courtesy” has to do with consideration of other people.
If you are unsure about the “rules”, be considerate, it’s hard to go wrong that way. At the root of most of it is avoidance of grossing people out, insulting them, or hurting their feelings. I brought up my sons to be courteous when they were tiny (do not think you can impose civilization on preteens, too late). I got them used to wearing formal clothes when called for so that they were not wearing them uncomfortably or stiffly on a job interview or their own weddings! They can be easy in a suit or a tee shirt. Big bonus: Their manners and courtesy have opened up worlds of opportunity and adventures to them…people want to be around them. They fit in with their peers but also are comfortable with other groups, ages, environments, courtesy helps with teachers and employers. I also trained them on the basics of customer service as that is a disappearing art and is also based on consideration and courtesy. Guess you can’t teach it in the schools, but this may be the most important thing they have learned. It all comes down to kindness.
Times change. Cultures change. Every epoch laments the passing of “the old ways.” I’m all for listing lost rules of etiquette for posterity, but the tone of this article approaches admonition. To suggest that some of these (like #10) should be revived is a bit absurd. For others, I can’t help but agree.
As for opening doors for women/protecting women from traffic, I believe they show a dedication to practices that hark back to a time when women were “delicate flowers to be protected by powerful men.” It’s a vestige of gender inequality that’s disguised itself as common courtesy. I have no doubt that the man who opens doors for women is well-meaning, but the assignment of males or females to either of the afore mentioned roles is something I oppose. Holding doors only for women is a nod in that direction. The truly considerate person opens doors for BOTH women and men.
Holy cow, what’s with all the comments about how “elitist” this list is? I almost forgot what list I was reading. This isn’t about bowing to people at high tea or anything, it’s “showing up on time”, “not over/understaying a welcome”, “don’t argue in front of your kids”, and “don’t borrow money you can’t pay back.”
I don’t think I’d like to know the people who find that kind of behaviour “snobbish.”
True, some of the details are archaic, but this was intended to be a history lesson as much as anything else.
As for the thoughtless comment about Koreans lacking manners- have you *met* a Korean person? I’m assuming you believe you know something about the culture, but it’s not rudeness, it’s a different set of manners. Trust me that I’ve caught hell for several breaches in “manners”, including:
Not properly greeting my principal.
Wearing shoes in my own apartment (the night I was first taken there after 26 hours of flying).
Letting my shirt ride up, exposing my lower back.
Refusing food offered to me (the hosts didn’t act offended so much as hurt, as their first assumption was that I didn’t like the food. The second assumption is generally that you’re feeling ill).
I’m trying to learn the Korean language now, and there are twice as many personal pronouns as the English language- because you need to use one set for those younger/inferior to you, and a different set for those older/superior to you. There are two ways to say hello/goodbye depending on rank, and almost daily when I try out Korean on a student, I’m told that “for children, you say it this way…”
As to what makes them appear rude: as Astraya has said, they think nothing of asking about your age, weight, blood type, or marital status, and the American “personal bubble” simply doesn’t exist. Strangers touch you (one woman grabbed my breast to push me down when I tried to give her my seat on the bus, then she dropped her purse into my lap), and my co-workers read the computer screen over my shoulder all the time.
Final bone: To Anon, who becomes offended when younger people offer their seats on the bus: I’m sorry you’re made to feel that way, but the fact is many of us are taught from a very young age to give up our seats to older/infirm/pregnant people, or those with many packages. We think it’s rude *not* to.
Ah, that was the other jajdude. Guess I’ll have to be jajdude#2 now even though that guy is using my name.
I don’t believe ‘conspicuous consumption’ was much less common a hundred or more years ago. Someone just coined the term to explain it, but it has always been around. There have always been snobs who like to show off, and others who resent and envy them. Old movies and novels point this out.
A lot of this list reads like “the good ol’ days,” and how society has become ruder. I don’t buy it. The good ol’ days had some really big problems. I think we live in better times now than people did 50 or more years ago.
My parents are actually VERY united. I’m 18, and I have maybe twice in my life seen them argue. I know this is rare, but I’m just saying that there ARE still some parents who do this.
Get off your high horse, you’re probably not old enough to have enjoyed that list. you can just read about it and dream about it. But you’re missing out on a whole slew of other issues that were around in the “good ol’ days” that don’t aren’t as prevalent now. Women didn’t disagree with their husbands because they had no rights, you really want to bring that back?
You’ve never lived in a time that wasn’t marked by conspicuous consumption, and the phrase “keeping up with the Jones” was created around 70-80 years ago… so learn your history before running your mouth about the glory days that weren’t that great either.
I will now shoot myself in the face to prove I disagree with comment #113 and to also prove I have a penis.
Seriously, I was a little surprised how much emotion this list stirred up from such a harmless subject matter. I read the list in the spirit of are we better off now with the present day etiquette (or lack of it ) or would we be better as a society to try to get some of the traditional etiquette from yesteryear back into our lives.
I personally feel some of these traditions have sadly become a lost art. Others I feel are destined to become obsolete because the changes that have taken place (good and bad) in our societies.
I couldn’t agree more with no. 5. I absolutely detest people who can’t be bothered to turn up on time. If you are running late a phone call is the least you can do, and these days that is easier than ever.
Tell me ringo 710, what is your alternative to turning up on time. Talk about humanity taking a step backward.
And maybe this is going to sound anti-feminist or some stupid thing, but I love it when a man holds open a door for me. It is always a pleasant surprise, and one that is always answered with a smile and a thank you.
Common courtesy should never become a thing of the past.
And this is my electronic ‘Thank You’ card. Fantastic list.
I have to admit I knew about the gentleman walking the lady on the inside since an ex of mine was raised to do that by his dad.
Interesting and great list to read.
I must be incredibly old fashioned! I not only knew all of these, but adhere to most of them too. I was under the impression that America was the only country having problems with this though. Am I wrong?
In Hispanic countries, many of these still stand. I grew up thinking it was extremely rude to not send a thank you card, or to have bad manners during dinner. I was often scolded if I didn’t follow these rules.
The only thing I would say isn’t true in this case is the on time thing. Whenever we went to parties, everyone would arrive late. Even the people who were setting up would arrive late. It was just something people did, it wasn’t rude by any means. This isn’t true for obligations, however. If you have a business appointment, never arrive late. Ever.
This afternoon a colleague was driving me to a teachers’ workshop when I let out a huge yawn. I said sorry. She glanced at me sideways and said “In Korea, you don’t have to apologise for yawning”.
Which explains most of my students!
I always walk on my wife’s right, but I’m partly deaf in my right ear, so I have to be on that side.
Once upon a time a young woman on a train asked a man to give up his seat for a pregnant woman. He looked at her midriff and said “You don’t look pregnant. How pregnant are you?” She said “About half an hour, and god it’s tiring”.
I was first offered a seat in a bus while I was at university. I used the (true) excuse that I was getting off at the next stop.
It should be “open doors for other people”. Otherwise it’s just stupid.
To Jessy, (153), in particular,
“Final bone: To Anon, who becomes offended when younger people offer their seats on the bus: I’m sorry you’re made to feel that way, but the fact is many of us are taught from a very young age to give up our seats to older/infirm/pregnant people, or those with many packages. We think it’s rude *not* to.”
Thank you for taking the trouble to read and consider what I wrote. However, do please read CAREFULLY. In fact I was making the exact reverse point to your conclusion: that one should cultivate the art of graceful refusal rather than outrage. Please read again and I hope you will realise that. If not, tell me so, in case I phrased the illustration ambiguously.
In fact I consider it a shining light of hope that young people give up their seats. One day I may even need it! However, at present I often find myself, who has passed the biblical lifespan, offering MY seat to the needy while many surrounding healthy young people remain stolidly seated (even trying to pretend to be immersed in a book or newspaper). They include schoolkids or other youngsters taking up seats next to their parents. My mother would have been ashamed even to remind me when I was that age.
To sum up. Always assume that any gesture is kindly intended, rather than patronising or insulting on a *****ism, agism, invalidism, or any other -ism basis. Unless you are quite sure the intention is malign, that is. Inevitably, this is addressed to feminists. By all means refuse gestures you consider unconsciously humiliate women. Just do it graciously. Remember, kindnesses are like Peter Pan’s fairies. If you stop *believeing* in them, they die for everybody. You have no idea what mental effort it takes Anita and I to continue being courteous with Chilean drivers in general. Rude rbuff after rude rebuff … But we do.
Hispanic manners,
Ah, yes. Chileans never turn up on time (which they regard as a quaint but admirable British speciality!). But since we run a rather chaotically overstretched and overfilled household and gardenhold, this can often be a considerable relief. Like Jaques Tatti’s “Frappez lá” to the squint-eyed mallet-wielder, one makes the necessary adjustment, so that it can actually be a problem if anyone does turn up on time (well, not really: they just have to pitch in and help)! One adapts, especially in the matter of what food to prepare and when, etc. Personally, I get far more offended that they bring along their nasty little uninvited guests, those mobile – cell – phones.
Yo, JFrater… the #2 picture (Discretion on the street) is correct positioning of the man and woman – they are simply not on the proper side of the street (as it were). The gentlemen always has the lady at his left-hand side, as the sword arm is then free to engage an opponent without the likelihood of him slashing her on accident. There’s more to it than that, of course, though this is the simple gist of the custom.
GTT, (97),
I’m prepared to believe you. We’ve never had the dubious pleasure of driving fist-hand in Peru, and most of our sorties there were out into the wild, wilds, However, I’ve heard tales from a colleague of Columbian bus drivers racing one another side-by-side, neck-and-neck the full width of winding mountain cliff roads. Statistically, I do believe Chile has one of the worst per cap. road accident records going though.
Correction. Much as I like the accidental typo *fist-hand* (white knuckle drive?), the intention was first-hand!
Okay, not having had time to read all the comments so far, I may be doing the ‘mynah bird’ thing, but here’s my take on the 10 rules of etiquette (in my semi-modern mind):
10 – Dress well, and in good taste. Keep the sequins and hot pinks AWAY from the wedding party and/or reception.
9 – I open the door for anyone and everyone when I am able. It is simply a common courtesy that we should all (man or woman) practice.
8 – A proper ‘thank you’ in any form is a good thing. It need not be written. Though it must be said, a thank you given 30 or 60 days after the fact has very little good effect – be timely in your thanks!
7 – In the modern era, gift registries can be a good thing, as they give your guests an idea of what you actually like and would want to put in your home (don’t be greedy!). If we get a random bunch of oddities that we never use, we are likely to give them to someone else (second-gifting, ew!) or simply box them up and never use them. I for one don’t expect gifts, but if I get them, I’d like to be able to say to the givers that I use their gifts every day!
6 – When there is no matron of honor, it’s hard to know when to leave. Best bet for the party host is to have already set a timeframe for the party… then people know when they should be getting ready to head for the hills.
5 – I’m old-school and military: to be early is to be on time, to be on time is to be late, to be late is pretty much inexcusable.
4 – Let’s simplify this by simply saying “get DRESSED for dinner”… don’t waste time getting dressed up. But yes, ALWAYS eat dinner as a family – this is often the only time of day that you will ever be together as a family unit, and have the opportunity to head what everyone has done that day.
3 – Let’s call this ‘unified front’, and yes, we parents need it. Cannot let the kids play us off each other (but dad said… well, mom said I could…), no way no how. Yes, we can discuss the battle plans after the kids go to bed…
2 – I can’t help but wonder if a lot of the quietudes involved here were nice ways of allowing us to ignore each other on the street… hmm…
1 – A great man once said, “Neither a borrower nor a lender be…” or something to that effect. Truth is, you gotta really really really know the people you borrow from or lend money to; debts owed can ruin friendships and tear family apart. Just be careful, and don’t lend more than you are willing to give freely in the first place.
umm…duh, spelling errors. …opportunity to *hear* whate everyone has done that day. eh?
Oh, and my husband wore a tux at our 3 pm wedding even though I knew the rules… So sue me, I knew he would look super *****y in it and when was he going to wear a tux again? I can barely get the man to wear a shirt half the time
Now we’ve reached Post 170, it might be interesting to draw up a new set of *2008 LV Concensus Etiquette* rules. Or consideration for others, if you prefer. I think they’re beginning to shine through pretty clearly.
Addendum
Including other neglected ones like giving up a seat where necessary, which weren’t on the original list. And new ones concerning disagreeable intrusion into the lives of others via street graffiti, cell phones, car alarms, bass heavy music from vehicles and neighbour’s houses, etc.
How about some “found” rules of etiquette? Those things we didn’t used to do, but we are good about doing now?
-Smokers being more considerate of non-smokers
-Racial, gender based, and ethnic slurs being almost unheard of
-designated drivers, no more “one for the road”
-Football coaches and baseball managers acting like grownups when they argue with the ref or umpire (think Woody Hayes or Billy Martin for examples of the so-called “good old days”)
..this rule also applies to sports broadcasting,.. no more Johnny Most
-Parents listening to children if they complain about an adult touching them in the wrong way (actually we might overdo this one a little bit nowadays)
-date rape accusations being taken seriously, no more.. “she was asking for it” I’m not saying the gal is always right, but at least nowadays we take her seriously enough to investigate
dave4248, (174),
Good points.
I would like to add the way, broadly speaking, adults take younger people and their interests much more seriously nowadays when merited. Youngsters are not just looked at and knee-jerk assessed according to how old they are or appear to be. Indeed, most of us recognise that if we have problems with out computer, a sub-seventeen-year-old is as likely to be able to fix it as anyone! Admittedly that can go to the other extreme of adults making fools of themselves by trying not offend youth culture or even desperately and absurdly trying to be part of it. In my day every child was desperately trying to be a *grown-up*!
Unfortunately there is also a more sinister element to this. At one time (including the epoch of the heading list) standard social manners and etiquette tended to favour a certain type of male being able to dominate in an explicit or implicit classist and socially bullying way. Adults had almost unhealthy control. The wheel has turned 180%. A year or so back I was in a surbaban train-carriage standing-full of assorted working-age city people coming home from an exhausting day’s work: tired, stressed out, trying to unwind. A couple of teenage louts started playing rap on some portable as loud as possible, and capered and chattered away raucously, punctuating their crude talk with obscenties that were indirectly aimed at some of the younger women present. They were given hard looks, which did not stop them, but nothing else. Hardly surprising. On that same line a fortnight earlier, a quiet 50-something city gent had politely asked a similar bunch if they’d mind turning down a similar offensive row. They got out at his station, followed him to quiet spot and knifed him to death. Although not unique, such an end result of murder is mercifully rare. Being beaten up on occasions, or obscenely insulted regularly, and certainly almost invariably insolently ignored all the time isn’t though. Youff culture noise (by youffs of all ages) and graffiti in all parts, as well as obscene language shouted in public by kids scarcely out of the cradle has all but run out of control in several places I know. Thank Goodness some of the sweetest, most intelligent people I know in Chile and Britain are also under 20.
I wrote an article some time ago on the one person who had affected my life the most. I can’t say it was strongly, but I chose my high school music director. He REFUSED to give up on us and demanded respect and manners. To this day I automatically check behind me when entering a building to see if I need to hold the door open for anyone (even though I am a woman, I try to be a polite woman). He also made us look at him when he talked and would interrupt lectures to yell at us to do so. And you HAD to be early for events. My favorite quote by him was “To be early is to be on time, to be on time is to be late, and to be late is to be forgotten.”
Somewhere down the road, parents forgot to teach their children certain fundaments in life. And kids just never knew. My mother brought me up Catholic, with the associated morals, and they didn’t skimp in many other manners. I just wish they had gone over car care because I’m such a ditz when it comes to cars!
Anon- huh, now you made me curious about the statistics! All I know is:
Could you create a list of the top 10 *new* rules of etiquette? I wonder if there would be any
Anon- huh, now you made me curious about the statistics! All I know is:
1- driving in this country will ABSOLUTELY give you road rage (and a raging headache after a 10 min drive)
2- I cant remember the last weekend when I DIDNT hear of a passenger bus going off the road/crashing/etc. It´s terrible…
And by the way, your story on the 50-year-old being knifed to death by a bunch of miscreants just for asking them to keep it down literally made me cry…