For their politics, they were put in prison. Some died, some were released, and some are still there. But when others looked out from the same prison bars and saw mud, they saw stars. From a Korean dissident to a nuclear scientist, via Vaclav Havel, we look at some of the world’s most famous political prisoners.

Kidnapped from a hotel room in Tokyo by members of KICA, General Park’s notorious spy agency in 1973, Kim Dae-Jung was brought to his Seoul residence, only to be placed under house arrest. Through his decades long struggle for democracy and human rights in his homeland, Kim saw his country swap one dictator for another, until the great liberator, financial crisis, brought him to power. The years of exile in America had secured him many admirers, and he tried to use that leverage to bring about that same fate for his brothers in the north, but not even an embrace from Kim Jong Il at Pyongyang prevented him from being voted out.

No one person could inspire such conflicting feelings like Mohammed Abdel Rahman Abdel Raouf Arafat al-Qudwa al-Husseini. To some, he exemplified resistance, a man who turned a fledgling, rag-tag movement into a world renowned organisation, with sole responsibility for the Palestinians. To others, he was a vile terrorist with little respect for human rights. Towards the very end, though, his inability to make peace jeopardized his credibility as a statesman and the Israeli government besieged his home in Ramallah. It was from there that the gallant leader, once the face of a dispossessed people, still defiant, led his people . He was allowed to go to Paris for medical treatment, but he returned home only to be buried.

A modern day cross between the zeal and idealism of Che Guevara and the courage and integrity of Nelson Mandela, Xanana Gusmao spearheaded East Timor’s independence movement from Portugal, and later from Indonesia. Arrested in November, 1992, on charges of subversion and illegal possession of firearms, Gusmao began on a journey to free his people from Indonesian occupation. Superbly aided by Jose Ramos Horta, Gusmao was able to bring the plight of his people to worldwide attention. No amount of torture and intimidation could break the man, and he came out stronger than ever. His release, in 1999, was the precedent to a referendum and, eventually, to independence.

For a man of such rigorous discipline, Mordechai Vanunu was trapped by the most elementary of methods. The trial was a clandestine affair and, not surprisingly, landed him in prison for eighteen years, eleven of which were spent in solitary confinement. His release has not brought about much relief, and a broad array of restrictions are imposed on his speech and movement. What did he do? He exposed Israel’s nuclear program.

“If you want to see your plays performed the way you wrote them, become president” said Vaclav Havel. If anybody would know, it would be him. Vaclav Havel transitioned from a writer of plays to the writer of his country’s destiny. When the Prague Spring ushered in Czechoslovakia’s winter of discontent, Havel scripted the Charter 77 manifesto, co-founded the Committee for the Defense of the Unjustly Persecuted and endured imprisonment with fellow artists. It is from prison- ‘the great school of self control’ – that the man demonstrated the potential of artists to shape the collective consciousness of a people, and thus alter the direction of a country for posterity.

‘Yeravda’ was the reply given by Mahatma Gandhi when asked about his address by a British interrogator. He wasn’t misinformed. In fact, India’s independence struggle was forged from the prison walls by the political mastermind, whose ideals of non violent civil disobedience brought about the end of British imperialism. Gandhi was unfazed by mortar, brick and stone. He successfully transformed the prison from a place of derision to a center of festive reunion, never flinching to return to captivity.

Invasion of the British consulate in Ghent. Balloons filled with tomato sauce hurled at the queen. Condolences from Tehran and Delhi. Just some of the many reactions observed when a twenty seven year old Irishman died of a hunger fast after sixty six days in Long Kesh. The whole objective of the fast was to get political prisoner status. Margret Thatcher thought otherwise, branding the IRA sympathizer as a rabble-rouser, and Bobby went to his grave smiling.

History will be kind to Andrei Sakharov. Indeed, he had the advantage of scripting it as the father of the Soviet H-bomb, dissident and a political prisoner. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, a man who knew a thing or two about the prison system in the Soviet union, wrote that a “miracle occurred when Andrei Sakharov emerged in the Soviet state, among the swarms of corrupt, venal, unprincipled intelligentsia.” Growing increasingly disillusioned with the incompatibility of the state mechanism, with the principles of individual liberty and human understanding, Sakharov made his ideas known to the world.’Our country, like every modern state, needs profound democratic reforms.’ he said, ‘It needs political and ideological pluralism, a mixed economy and protection of human rights and the opening up of society.’ The party exiled him to that obscure city of Gorky, but his legend only aggravated, culminating in his release in 1986. By then, Andrei Dmitrievich Sakharov had paved the way for the democratization of the Soviet Union by simply refusing to yield.

If success is a journey and not a destination, then Suu Kyi is a living embodiment of accomplishment. Because, through her two decade long struggle to bring democracy to Burma, she has maintained that the quintessential revolution is that of the spirit. Branded as a ‘terrorist’ by the junta and placed under house arrest since 1990, the leader of the National League for Democracy has handled her ordeal with extraordinary grace and dignity. At the age of sixty four, her zeal has not diminished, and her people march to that elusive quest of freedom and democracy.

‘Bring Back Nelson Mandela, Bring him back home to Soweto, I want to see him walking hand in hand with Winnie Mandela’, sang Hugh Masekela, a renowned anti-apartheid artist. Tried and convicted in the Rivonia trial for sabotage against the apartheid government, the black nationalist leader was deemed too dangerous to walk the streets of South Africa for twenty seven years, his demand for a non racial South Africa too much to bear. Masekela got his wish on the 11th of February, 1990. Mandela emerged from Victor-verster prison, a face until then unrecognizable to most South Africans, to a warm welcome from the teeming multitude who had come to catch a glimpse of their messiah. He then addressed a crowd at Cape Town by raising his arm and clenching his fist-the power salute which the world is now so accustomed to-and cried ‘Amandla, Amandla.’ The Jordan it seemed, had been crossed.












2 thumbs and 2 big toes up!!! =)
Good list as always.
Yasser Arafat was never imprisoned in Ramallah. The Israeli government always allowed him to leave, but he refused to leave because they didn't promise to allow him to return.
Who cares,he was just an evil bastard…..
I'd call that a type of imprisonment just like threatening to stop making sure you don't come to harm is considered the same as threatening to do harm. An example of that would be protection rackets where mobsters would take money to protect stores from crooks.
Israeli government to Arafat: You can go to any one of something like 200 countries in the world. Or you can stay right where you are. But if you go to one of the other 200 countries, we might not let you back where you are now. So that's your decision.
Mobster to shopowner: You can sell anything you want. Or you can keep selling switchblades and brass knuckles. But if you open a grocery and start supplying the neighborhood with fresh vegetables, we might not let you supply weapons any more. So that's your decision.
Yeah, Israel really comes off like a mobster in this *****ogy.
Did that even make sense in your head?
Of course it didn't. See the comment to which I was replying: spiderbait compared the actions of the Israeli government to mafia protection rackets. I don't think that's a strong comparison, and I tried to demonstrate it by teasing it out a little and letting everyone see how ridiculous it is.
Judging by the red "-81p" symbol next to my name, it appears that not a lot of people understand this kind of logic. I suppose I could write something like "spiderbait wrong, spiderbait bad" and I'd get a lot more approval.
this list is retarded
no, not the list.
All Palestinians are prisoners in their homeland! Yasser Arafat was a symbol for this political persecution. Recent investigations shows that Arafat was murdered in his Ramallah home by Israeli spies.
@wang: "First, great honour"
hahaha — this is getting funny
(first posts that are 2nd or 3rd, or 15th, that is)
how much more dumb could this be?
and the answer is none.
none more dumb.
*thank you spinal tap*
Vanunu was a political prisoner? His only principle is hatred of Jews and Israel, and he was sentenced to normal prison after committing a real, actual crime. This is like calling Klaus Fuchs a political prisoner.
Hatred of jews? His father was a rabbi. Are you saying that if a jewish person converts to another religion, then that person is a nazi? He did say that a jewish state is not necessary (but he didnt say that isreal should disappear). While i disagree with that statement, id also be a bit *****ed if i would have been arrested for saying that my country has nuclear bombs.
Are you saying that if a jewish person converts to another religion, then that person is a nazi?
Come on, let's not lose perspective here. It's possible to hate Jews and not be a Nazi. It's possible to hate Jews and still not want to exterminate every single one of them. Mordechai Vanunu hates Jews, and he's done terrible things out of that hatred, but of course he's no Nazi.
Hatred of jews? His father was a rabbi.
So what? My father is an accountant. If I express strenuous opposition to the existence of accounting as a profession, and I take measures to ensure that accountants are harmed, and I am rewarded for it by people who profess to hate accountants, can't we just go ahead and say that I have a hatred of accountants too? What else would it take?
Everything Mordechai Vanunu has ever done in his adult life has reflected a deep anti-Jewish sentiment. When the USSR had a state policy of anti-Zionism combined with very harsh treatment of its Jews, and any expression of Jewish culture was illegal, Vanunu was a Communist. When Israel (allegedly) developed a nuclear arsenal to prevent its own destruction at the hands of enemies who genuinely wanted to erase it from the map, Vanunu was an anti-nuclear activist (I guess it didn't matter that the Soviet Union also had nuclear weapons). When in prison, he didn't just say, "I don't want to be a Jew anymore" and start considering himself a Christian – no, he picked one of the most anti-Israel churches and converted to that one. He's not fooling anyone – there's nothing he would not do to harm Israel and Jews, if he had the opportunity.
Regardless if its true, divulging a state secret is a crime. In any country.
“When Israel (allegedly) developed a nuclear arsenal”
Allegedly? You sir living in the land of bisounours like the french would have it. This discution ends right here. Thank you. You have confirmed that there are extremists on both sides.
Haha, I was being facetious. Everyone knows that Israel has had nuclear weapons for more than 40 years.
Wouldn't it have been better instead of singling out Sands, to just have had an entry for all hunger strikers who did change the course of Northern Irish politics and conflict but have been forgotten?
he was such an ass that he deserves to be singled out
he doesnt deserve to be on a list of political prisoners, but thats another issue entirely
This list is not complete until it includes entries for Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn and Natan Sharansky.
Bobby Sands? Bobby *****ing Sands? Are you actually retarded? The guy was put in prison for firearms possession and attempting to murder police officers in a gun battle! He was NOT a political prisoner. In the words of the Chicago Tribune: "Mahatma Gandhi used the hunger strike to move his countrymen to abstain from fratricide. Bobby Sands' deliberate slow suicide is intended to precipitate civil war."
Yet another dip***** American on the internet who blunders into the troubles. Please do not venerate the I.R.A.
Gandhi was a racist that trampled over the rights of Africans if I remember correctly, Arafat was the leader of a terrorist cell, Vanunu compromised national security by leaking classified information, Gusmao was also arrested for firearms possession and Mandela was arrested for sabotage. Those are only the ones I know anything about but I'm sure that a quick search would reveal that none of them were saints.
Even if he was arrested for blowing up Parliament he would still be classified as a political prisoner as he was fighting for a political belief of his. Saying that he isn't because of how he was arrested or because you don't believe the cause was just is like saying that ketchup doesn't count as a condiment because you don't like it.
You forgot to mention Gandhi slept with underage girls, and Mandela was head of a terrorist organization.
What you said about Gandhi isn't even relevant to what I am talking about. Mandela and Gusmao were given extremely harsh sentences by their respective judicial systems because their political beliefs were considered dangerous to their ruling governments. Bobby Sands got 14 years for firearms possession. That's fairly reasonable when you consider he had previously been convicted for the same offense. He was locked up because he was a danger to the public. Mandela and Gusmao were locked up because they endangered their governments.
Mandela was head of a group that was on US terrorist watchlist because they bombed bars and offices. How is that not a danger to society? And paedophilia? Gandhi should be locked up too. Gusmao got 20 years for 2 combined offences. So that's reasonable too then, isn't it?
But what I think spiderbait was trying to tell you, is that you can't deny someone political prisoner status because you don't agree with his views.
I agree with you about Bobby Sands. However, it makes you look like a *****ing idiot when you call people "dip***** Americans." Seriously, lighten up. Why can't he just be a normal dip*****?
Why can't he just be a normal dip*****?
Lol, every dip*****’s dream. I know it is mine. Thank you for validating me.
*****ing idiot
Bobby Sands was fighting against the occupation of his homeland by a foreign power. That is what he was jailed for. You may not agree with his methods but he was not the common criminal the Thatcher administration made him out to be. He died as an elected member of Parliament of the government he opposed, elected in what a very political act by the opposition to the Thatcher government.. His death brought international attention to the unfair and discriminatory conditions faced in NI by the Catholic (and indigenous) population. Housing, employment, violence. Given all that I think its fair to call him a political prisoner.
History has further shown that Sands act of non-violent opposition against the occupation of Ireland and all the fallout, including his election, was a watershed event in the conflict, which culminated in the good Friday agreement more than a decade later. Maybe the Chicago Tribune editors should print a retraction.
Emphasis on the words "a DECADE later". He had no effect on the good Friday agreement at all. The real turning point was the IRA murdering 12 innocent people (7 of whom were pensioners) in the Enniskillen bombing on rememberance day.
I would argue that he had a profound impact on the key players in the cease fire and GFA. they were his contemporaries in the IRA during the hunger strike, were his outside contacts in some cases and that political fall out of the hunger strikes had considerable impact on all of them. Clearly the IRA did lots of nasty things in the interim and there were many other critical events that led to the ceasefire and GFA but I think its fair to say the Hunger Strikers changed the tone and planted the seed that there was a political solution to the troubles, in part because of the outpouring of sympathy and support worldwide for Sands situation.
More importantly, the quote from the Tribune proved short sighted and dead wrong. It should be noted that Sands and company never viewed it as a Civil War either – they were not fighting against their own countrymen.
Far more than those who put Bobby Sands in prison (erroneously charged as he happened to be in the same house/vehicle as a gun and "tried" in a Diplock court with no jury), the man had strength, courage of his convictions, honesty, a remarkable talent for writing, self-education and teaching others. In the short amount of time he was out of prison, he worked to gain benefits for the people of his section of Belfast. He withstood an amazing degree of torture for years and before that, in his childhood, his family was run out of their home twice by loyalists and he was threatened out of his job. Think what you may of hunger strikers but very few people possess the strength to live as he and his mates did for years and then to die slowly and painfully using the only weapon of protest left to them – their bodies, their lives. All those who have died in defense of a humane cause deserve veneration. But Bobby did have a special qualitiy that set him apart. England's government still needs to be brought to task for the 800+ years of antagonism and horrible manipulation, attempted genocide, theft, murder, rape, denial of human rights and humane treatment it has heaped upon the Irish and their land.
Sorry no. 9 you used the wrong picture , thats actually Ringo Starr on holiday in Morocco last year .
i always thought they were seperated at birth.
but they cant be
theyre not even compatible.
whatever that means ..
see?
http://www.facade.com/biorhythm/relationship/?Cel…
True,i think your right their…
Ringo WAS a political prisoner of the LMMG (Lennon-McCartney Monopoly Game)
Another great list, why can’t you make a list of top 10 beautiful feets,i think it will be a very good list!
beautiful feet?
random.
???
weve had weirder lists, i suppose, but this came outta nowhere.
Beautiful feats, maybe?
My inner fetishist, however, prefers your interpretation!
feets …. feats….
f e e t — neither one of em make any sense in the context of this list.
feats is something that could either be very informative or very not. — presented well, it would make for a great read (blogball, randall, flamehorse — hell we have a bunch of people that could do that) — we also need to put tylerb on animal feats. or feet.
–presented poorly — i wont name any names *achem!!armadillotron — then it would suck. you know — like that list of political prisoners — uh…this morning, or that list about warrioirs when tstrubi tried to tell us that "apaches were the ninjas of america" along with other dumb *****.
as for feet
inner fetishes qualify you to attempt this list.
sandra bullock, artist chick from 'bones', dakota fanning, olivia wilde all have pretty feet. so does brooke burke (but her toes are really really pink)
…have fun with this one
feets …. feats….
f e e t — neither one of em make any sense in the context of this list.
Maybe he meant “fetes”…it would be quite a feat to have a fete in honor of feet.
I challenge you to write that list, complete with pics.
Great list..as South African i never knew dat Mandela was 's time on Robben Island was so Recognised,,,GreatList..u Even threw in Bra Hugh Masekela 's name in there..great list
i spell checked "dat" no such word moron – and this list is not great
Your ‘i’ should’ve been capitalized and you missed the full stop at the end. But, if you had spell-checked your comment, maybe you wouldn’t appear so hypocritcal.
Also perhaps a comma may have made more senese, placed in between the words ‘dat’ and ‘no’. If you’re going to troll, be good at it. If you’re going to be a grammar nazi, know some grammar. If you’re going to call people morons, check yourself first.
Bobby Sands was not a political prisoner, he was sentenced to prison for armed robbery not for any political reason.
One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter, he was a member of the ira whos sole aim was to fight the forces of the british crown and the british government, the ira's war was completely political. its aim was to unite ireland. just because you dont agree with this fact doesnt make it any less a fact, ireland and half of northern ireland would consider him a prisoner of war, and history WILL see him as a political prisoner.
He and those arrested with him were exonerated of robbery, bombing and having a shoot out with police. They were sentenced for being in close proximity of a weapon. They were very political as they were supporting the removal of invasive English controlled military/para-military in their country and for the union of all Ireland in a free self-governing existance. The English government wanted all Republicans to shut up, get out of the way and be nice little slaves. If that is not political, what is ? Wars are made for profit for the few, oil, gld, diamonds, ego and many other reasons. The Irish fought for their freedom not unlike a burgeoning America or the Scotland of William Wallace's and Robert the Bruce's time. Atrocities are committed for no reason but a whim or proof of power. What the English government has perpetrated on the Irish would fit that category.
***** Bobby Sands, he was nothing other than a criminal and terrorist, he died with a grin on his face because he knew he was going to get a nice hot meal in hell.
he was included in the list because of the political beliefs of the author
beliefs of most people who like to look at situations from a neutral perspective. again just because you dont like the fact doesnt make it any less a fact.
You sir obviously have no capacity for reason or logic. No sense of what it is like to be terrorized by a foreign occupying power all your life. No comprehension or ability to tolerate years of the exremely brutal and inhumane treatment the Republican prisoners lived with on a daily basis. Some spent half their lives in prison for far far less than the actions of their oppressors.
If Bobby went to hell, I'll gladly join him – for intelligent conversation if nothing else.
But then where does that leave for those such as you to go when you shuffle off this mortal coil ?
Martin Luther King would have been an ideal addition.
seems to me that jalil abdul muntaqim would be a better example along these lines. http://www.prisonactivist.org/archive/pps pows/ja…
mlk is more popular, yes, but muntaqim is one of the longest serving political prisoners this country has seen
I dont get why everyone loves Nelson Mandela,ok fair enough he helped bring the end of apartheid but South Africa is still one of the worst places to live due to crimes,murder,rape,HIV and AIDS etc.Since the end of the world cup the rate of HIV has risen and the amount of people getting the HIV morning after pill.
everyone loves nelson Mandela because unlike our other piece of ***** politicians he's really humble and sincere in other words cause he is a really nice guy . Just coz our countries in the *****ter doesn't mean he's a bad guy blame every other politician but not him . You wanna see the face of African incompetence and deepest stupidity , look up Malema maybe he's under dip***** as well Im not sure .
I agree but why hasent he tried to sort the problem aswell if he loves his people so much.
the guys old he spent so many years n jail , he should be able to retire in peace . Also by African stupidity i dont mean black i mean continental African , something in the context of Mugabe .
Where the hell do you get your information from??
its a common fact and also goverment statistics and leaflets that been issued.I do like the bloke though for the fact he helped end apartheid.
I'm not so sure i heard that our HIV infection rate has stabilized for the first time in over a decade . But crime did shoot up after the SWC because the Intl community isn't spotlighting us anymore no-one(goverment) cares .
There is only so much one man can do in his lifetime I'm sure if he could he would cure aids- maybe he would have done if he didn't spend so long locked up
But seriously, he did his best to put a stop to some pretty bad stuff and although the country isn't perfect, he set it on the road to recovery and he didn't give up despite that fact it must have felt like he would never have freedom again. In my opinion that is definitely worth my respect
Nelson Mandela took a country controlled by racists and helped turn it into one of, if not the, greatest countries in Africa. South Africa has the largest African stock exchange in Johannesburg, and, if I'm not mistaken, one of the highest GDPs in Africa.
Yes, there is a high AIDS infection rate, but the government is trying to do all that they can to stop it. But, due to poor infrastructure and other complications, it is very difficult to combat.
Ending apartheid without vast bloodshed is a pretty amazing accomplishment in and of itself. The country certainly has its problems, but expecting all of those issues to have disappeared in less than two decades isn't realistic.
The guy accomplished more in his lifetime than you, me and all of the other commenters put together — in light of that, it seems rather unfair to expect him to do more. It's time for someone else to step up, so he can life out his days in peace.
*live
Somebody's also never been to South Africa. South Africa is one of my favourite countries in the world. Yes, bad stuff happens, but if you think about it, it happens everywhere else too. I, personally, feel much safer in South Africa or Namibia than in any other place I've been.
Nelson Mandela was a hero. If you have studied apartheid properly, seen what everybody was put through during those dark years… heck, even lived through it yourself, you would understand. Mandela did a lot for his country, much more than anybody has accomplished for South Africa before or since. You can't expect one man to fix the problems of such a huge nation, but he definitely set South Africa in the right direction. Honestly, he is the best president South Africa has ever had (that I know of). He is part of the reason why SA is one of the greatest and fastest developing countries in the world. Because he is such a great role model and he stood up for his rights and beliefs and those of everybody else in the face of great adversity, I feel he is a great man.
yaay!!! and i get to comment second on your comment (which by the ay is 8th. So no great honour for you i see.).
100% agree with Crimzon. I nearly choked on my morning coffee when I saw Sands name on here. The man was part of an organisation that indiscriminatly killed innocent men, woman and children. Don't tell me the British did the same during the conflicts – bull*****. We never planted a bomb in a pub or in a civilian area. Some Irish Americans (lol) never been to the emerald isle in their life -couldn't find it on a map, have supported and defended the IRA. Call them freedom fighters! Whats the difference between Bobby Sands and his mob blowing up a pub / shopping mall and Islam extremists blowing up a bus in the middle of london. Of-shoots of this lot are still killing people on a large scale – even though a peace agreement is in place. To finish my rant I will just say the Unionists weren't any better so I am not taking sides.
Argreed, all IRA are *****ing lowlifes. Why is it, that David Cameron said SORRY, for shooting dead those people on Bloody Sunday? I know he meant well, but for Gods sake. When are the IRA going to say say sorry, for blowing up pubs, the Arndale, assassinating Lord Mountbatten.. You can go on and on. And please, don`t give me this *****, about how, "the IRA are different from al Qaeda, because they give a warning." so if Osama Bin Laden, had phoned George Bush and said, "I`m going to fly planes into the world trade centre, White House and Pentagon. You`ve got a certain ammount of time to leave," or if the Bali, Madrid and London bombers had done the same thing,That makes it alright then? Don`t be stupid. All terrorists are cowards.
There is a huge difference between trained army officers shooting unarmed civilians in the back, including children and terrorist activity.
The whole point of terrorism is that they are not sorry- they kill people because they think that those people need to die in order to get their message across and to bring attention to themselves.
The army is not a terrorist organisation- they are supposed to protect civilians against enemies not shoot them without reason and that is why they got the apology and I personally think that David Cameron was damn right doing it it's just a pity that there was not an apology from the government 30 years ago.
But I agree with you on the latter part of your post- terrorists are terrorists whether or not they give a warning.
I don't know if he should have said sorry but the British soldiers shot themselves in the foot on Bloody Sunday. Im sure that night 100's of young angry men joined the IRA that night. The IRA will never say sorry because they don't have the same political pressures placed on them like David Cameron had
The IRA won't say sorry because they aim to kill people and the army are supposed to protect people.
On Bloody Sunday the IRA had snipers ready to shoot people- their intent was to kill people. It often is their intent to kill people. They are not paid to protect people. They never pretend to protect people, they want to get their way and they have no problems about how they get it.
The army were there to try and prevent conflict but yet they completelyignored that and killed people in the back, many of whom were trying to help those already been shot by the army. The government employs these people, and we the taxpayers pay their wages- including those taxpayers who live in NI! An apology was needed there is no doubt about it.
I`m not defending the Army and the Paras, not by any stretch of the imagination. But put yourself in THEIR position. You`re trained to kill people, and then all of a sudden, some cocky young bastards, start throwing stones at you, it`s like asking for trouble. And of course, it was a foolish thing to do. because after that, loads of people flooded to join the IRA. And remember when William Calley massacred over 500, Vietnamese in cold blood? HE was also defended-people said he was in a war, and war makes you do terrible things. And I haven`t seen him, or his soldiers saying sorry-they said-"we were following orders." Sounds like something that Nazis or Khmer Rouge said, doesn`t it?
But there is little if any evidence that they were attacked- The army was attacked by some people when they broke through the barrier at Guildhall- the army used rubber bullets and tear gas to get rid of them.
At some point (details of the events are disputed) the army were told there was a sniper at Bogside and were given permission to shoot. The army advanced down Bogside and protestors ran away.
Twelve people died- of those four people were shot from behind, four were shot whilst trying to help the wounded. One of those killed was wounded and shot again at close range. All of those killed are said to have been running away and trying to get to safety. No one has proved that any of those killed had weapons on them and in the case of the first person that was shot- soldiers said he was brandishing a weapon but photos from a journalist proved that he was not.
Whether or not the soldiers had stones thrown at them- these are people trained to fight under stressful circumstances so that is no excuse.
And I don't believe comparing them to others who have killed makes any difference because a) just because someone else hasn't apologised doesn't mean we can't apologised and b) the soldiers were not ordered to shoot innocent protesters. They were there because of an IRA sniper.
i didnt realise you where present in derry on bloody sunday? and clearly it would be pointless to try and explain what happend on bloody sunday to you as the 12 year enquiry results found by a british court are obviously not good enough
Have you actually read the results of the enquiry? Here's the website if you haven't http://www.bloody-sunday-inquiry.org/
I think this paragraph from chapter 3 say a lot: None of the casualties shot by soldiers of Support Company was armed with a firearm or (with the probable exception of Gerald Donaghey) a bomb of any description. None was posing any threat of causing death or serious injury. In no case was any warning given before soldiers opened fire.
And also: Despite the contrary evidence given by soldiers, we have concluded that none of them fired in response to attacks or threatened attacks by nail or petrol bombers. No-one threw or threatened to throw a nail or petrol bomb at the soldiers on Bloody Sunday
Cont… And the final paragraph of the report: The firing by soldiers of 1 PARA on Bloody Sunday caused the deaths of 13 people and injury to a similar number, none of whom was posing a threat of causing death or serious injury. What happened on Bloody Sunday strengthened the Provisional IRA, increased nationalist resentment and hostility towards the Army and exacerbated the violent conflict of the years that followed. Bloody Sunday was a tragedy for the bereaved and the wounded, and a catastrophe for the people of Northern Ireland.
If you read the report you will find a very detailed picture of what happened that day. You will also probably see that what I said agreed with the enquiry. And yes it would be pointless for you to try and explain what happened because I have read the report and actually seen the facts. I doubt you have.
i was agreeing with you, my comment was aimed at the guy who said there was IRA snipers aiming at soldiers, which is bull*****,
Actually you are wrong. The Dublin and Monaghan bombings have long been considered as having been coordinated with British Special forces. Those were the largest single acts of violence during the conflict. That does not justify the murder of innocent people by the IRA but get your facts straight.
And to say that extremists elements of the IRA are still killing people on a 'large scale' is just not true either.
Dude you want to ***** about an organization killing civilians? Try the goddam UVF you Unionist scum. IRA wouldn't be killing anybody if the English ended their occupation of a foreign country.
he gave his life for his beliefs, which wer to unite ireland and fight the oppression of the british, irish people had suffered for 800 years under british occupation, its really rich when brits come along with their great historical figures and talk about the glorious days of rule, when infact they raped robbed and enslaved every country their ever set foot in. Oliver Cromwell swept through ireland murdering man woman and child leaving thousands dead,,,,,was he a great man, cos your history books say he is! the problem between the english and the irish is that the irish never forget their history and the english never learn it! i suggest you go and discover bobby sands reasons for choosing armed struggle, mainly because the brits had to be beaten out of every country they occupied.
From reading the title I expected this to be an interesting list. I was disappointed, more detail about their terms of imprisonment could have been included.
leonard peltier —
—-i know about the shootout at pine ridge, but i believe he'd count as a political prisoner anyway.
I agree……..Amensty International has a lot of information about his case. If anyone took the time to read about it they would be appallled that it's happening right here on US soil. I consider it a great shame.
The media always spins it in such a way as to glorify the state. Remember the "Christian Terrorists" in Michigan a few months ago; the charges were dropped and the government got off without even a ill word being said on the news. It would have been a show trial if they actually had enough evidence or if the militia was actually guilty of a crime.
where is ossama bin laden
Are you trying to start a flamewar, or are you just an idiot?
what you mean he's right there …… between Jeffery Dhamer and Bozo the clown ?
oh wait yeah my mistake lol
In a cave.
Haha, hes not a political prisoner until hes caught.
If he's on there we might as well include Tupac Shakur.
Margaret Thatcher*
Im glad to see Mandela at no. 1 – as bluesman has already mentioned, and he expressed it well " sincere and humble "with him around we still stood a chance, now we are going Zimbabwe style.
Nicholas II and his family and to stirr things up Napoleon I
GWB was forced into forced labour at his ranch, denied contact with reality
Is drinking unholy amounts of whiskey considered forced labour or is it considered malnourishment?
its called "heaven" in my religion .
Er-Isn`t Vanunu one of the good guys? He proved that israel has the bomb! They bombed Saddam`s nuclear reactor, and then go around saying, "Iran shouldn`t have the bomb." YET they had a secret nuclear programme. And they denied it for years. They still deny it now. IF it`d been North Korea or Iran who`d done this, the world would be going crazy, saying release him now.
Yep but you're forgetting that Israel has the US backing them up and as long as the US finances and lets them get away with whatever they want Israel will continue to do stuff like this.
Pretty much.
The difference between Iran and Israel is that Iran is controlled by Muslim extremists. The leaders of that country condemn anyone who does not follow radical Shia law. Therefore, they want everyone who does not follow this Shia law dead. Israel simply wants nuclear bombs for defense against Iran.
The reason that North Korea shouldn't have nuclear bombs is because an absolute idiot runs the country. Kim Jong-Il already ordered a South Korean ship missiled. Imagine what he would do if he had nukes!
And isreal missiled an US ship.
Isreal doesnt want to recognize it has nukes cuz it recieves 3 billion dollars every year frop the us and admiting that would eliminate that aid. Its wrong.
Hmmmmmmmm, get your facts right.. Kim has nuclear already, exactly why the yanks are not gonna shock and awe his country.
It always amazes me how some people are willing to bend and twist reality to suit their beliefs…
Hugo de Groot? Only the most influential political prisoner ever. Pioneered international law while imprisoned for disagreeing with Maurice of Nassau.
@ hermy304 From one south african to another south african……..shut up, you are an idiot.
Well your an idiot as im not South African and everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
you are still an idiot ! Know South Africa 1st then comment – now you know why you an idiot. From the people of the most beautiful place on earth South Africa.
Well im not saying ***** now,i was asking a simple question and all you arseholes take offence to it.Whats the point in having a coment system when you get harrassed and people cant get a simple question,Frater you need to sort your website out,its full of rude people and full of viruses.Peace out.
Yes he is. Mandela was not, and IS not a magician! He never wanted the presidency. It was forced upon him by the ANC. That was the primary reason why he did not want to be re-elected. He was not an actual functioning president, he was a figurehead, and people need to understand that. Had Mandela not embraced reconcilliation, Hermy would have been one of the formerly priveleged we might have killed in the civil war that might have followed. Count yoursellf lucky! People like you are tolerated. But patience eventually also runs out. Be grateful, be very grateful!
Your just digging yourself a hole by saying that you would have killed an innocent person in a civil war which is low enough.Anyway i live a long way from South Africa.
Okay list. A bit more information would have been good and choice for #1 was pretty obvious (though understandable). I could have done without Bobby Sands though, he was an idiot.
Idiot. You are obviously oblivious to a great deal of history on Mr. Sands MP and on the countries and governments of England and those on whom they practice(d) their empire building. Either that, or it is you who would be the idiot.
I love the country I live in. SOUTH AFRICA. I dont care about politics. I do know that Mandela went to prison a cold blooded killer and came out a world famous leader. Whether he changed in prison to save a nation or just his own butt, thats not my problem. Malema is an idiot, but still, not my problem. And Jacob Zuma should wear a hat because that man has the funniest looking head I ever saw, but its not my problem. Keeping my kids and myself safe, that is my problem. So anybody who touch me or my kids, I will blixem right into thy kingdom come, whether it is Malema, Funny Head, or Mandela all mighty.
you've never had a gun stuck in your face have you ? you'd know that you cant bliksem anybody , they will rape , kill and torture you . We both watch and read the same news . This is the real world , your best defense is bars , locks , dogs , more dogs and awareness . Hierdie mense is fokin siek man , moenie so grap nie . Jy spiel met jou lewe .
And a shotgun.
Rina, you also have your facts a bit convoluted. I wonder how many of your kind go around believing what you do. Consider yourself fortunate to have a country you can call home. You have a choice, you can go back to the country of your ancestors, or your can be gracious and accept that the majority 'allow' you to continue to live in a country that your forbears ruled like Nazis. So you havea real nerve judging anyone who brought democracy to our country. You would have continued voting for the racist National Party, had the hand of your government not been pushed beyond negotiation. Had we had a democratic mechanism through which to bring about change, we would have opted for it. But your government, backed up by the Defence Force and other agencies prevented that. Be careful, be very careful that your small ungrateful minority does not,as you put it, get bliksemed right out of the country that you claim to love. South Africa is an African country, and you are a descendant of foreigners to the country. Foreigners who paid no heed to the black majority that now rules the country. Stop *****ing! What contribution have you made?
man i dont like you, keradah where are you from ? I would like to know where this bowel evacuation you call insight comes from ?
Kerahdah speaks like a real People's Kommissar. dunno where he\\she's from, but i can tell he's a no good commie.
And tell me, what contribution have you made? Maybe, YOU should stop *****ing, because you are making a complete and total ass out of yourself. Right now, you seem like a racist radical. Wake up and smell the roses!
We have a special political prisoner here on the philippines.
Senator Antonio Trillanes IV. A senator on prison.
No. He's a prisoner who ran for the senate, and miraculously won.
I like what Ricky Gervais said about apartheid.
Nelson Mandela went to jail a terrorist, was released and never did it again. You see the system worked!!
***** Bobby Sands. I hope he's starving in hell
So Tomcat, what contribution did you make towards bringing democracy to our country. Vote for the Nationalists every 5 years? Fight in the SADF against Namibians, who also wanted nothing more than to rule their own country. As it is at the moment, you're in no position to be smartassed about the new dispensation, with all it's problems, many of them inherited from your previous Nazi government. When the ANC came to power, there was no money in the treasury, and you all expect the problems to be solved overnight! Wake up and smell the roses! You could be in a much worse situation, as the minority in an African country! Don't push your luck! Whose system works? The system that your Nazi Nationalists introduced into the country? You voted for them! Or have you forgotten that little bit of history?
Stop jumping on people with unrelated comments – it's practically trolling, and makes you seem like a self-righteous little pr*ck.
Pretty interesting list, though I would have liked to read more on Mordechai Vanunu's exploits. Great choice for #1 and though I am not familiar with Bobby Sands, from the description it doesn't really sound like he belongs on this list.
Not sure if I like or disliked this list. Didn't really move me all that much. I guess I would have liked a little more info on each prisoner and such. Nice premise.
Horrible list. You don't even mention where half these people were imprisoned.
Terrorists Arafat and Sands are included, but true political prisoners Solzhenitsyn and Natan Sharansky are not? Referring to murderer Che Guevara's "idealism"??? This is not one of the better lists on this site, to say the least.
Yeah, a bit thick on the Che reverence, I agree. But about a zillion or so folks are woefully uninformed about him; they think him to be a great liberator. I'm undecided about Arafat – I sympathize with the palestinians – he definitely started out as a terrorist, but ended up a statesman. Didn't spend a whole lot of time as a prisoner though did he? Solzhenitsyn would be a much better choice.
Arafat: a very LOUSY statesman, mom. Corrupt, ineffective to the extreme, and gave every appearance of being a stupid, out-of-touch partisan.
He was never able to control the folks he claimed to speak for, did he? I will defer to your superior knowledge.
Nice to see you, btw.
I agree, the Che Guevara reference almost made me throw up in my mouth a little… It makes me sad that some people are so horribly misinformed on who he really was.
Hi. Yeah, slightly underwhelmed by the list today – sorry. Like others have said, a bit more info may have helped in the discussion. I’ve heard of Bobby Sands but I don’t/didn’t know anything about him. Ghandi – the thorn in the British side – got his dream of independence, but this happened without him (some of his followers did it), in the end. By the time of independence Ghandi was all but finished with politcs.
Arafat: One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.
All these stories have many sides, and it’s quite easy to sympathise with the perpetrator (or the victims) sometimes without knowing all the whys, whens, and wherefores. I don’t know enough to say either way; except of course that all these guys did what they did because they thought it was the ‘right’ thing to do at the time, otherwise they wouldn’t've done it the way they did – or even at all. They made a choice.
Arafat: One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.
Yeah, and one man's garbage man is another mans' trash collector. But neither a terrorist nor a freedom fighter is a political prisoner, so neither belongs on this list.
Poorly written list riddled with platitudinous/weasel language ("gallant leader") and lacking in many places simple exposition to illustrate who these people were. Personal bias is not always a negative in writing, but it shouldn't play a part in a quasi-journalistic list such as this—there's so much subjectivity and so little objectivity in it that one's first impulse is to run to a history book or some trusted online resource to get the full story that was obviously left out.
Good idea for a list, very bad in execution.
After going through the list, I felt that our own Benigno "Ninoy" Aquino, Jr. should have been considered. I wrote something about him somewhere down the comments.
I couldn't agree more. Well said.
Good list – could have been a great list with a bit more information to flesh out the entries – next time eh?
Seem to me to be some pretty good choices. Never heard of Vanunu, and from what I've read here and at wiki, I should have. Shame that.
Interesting blurb on Leonard Peltier in the comments as well – certainly appears he was unfairly convicted. And wtf? How is it that people with exculpatory evidence aren't allowed to testify or are ignored? It happens here too – I don't get it.
I like the idea of this list but the thing read so poorly I could barely get through it. I would have liked to see more objective information about each prisoner.
I’m not interested in this, but I do highly respect most of these people.
Nice and thought provoking list. Makes you thing about what is important in life and what isn’t.
So, the first serious comments about this list (4 and 6 by declineofgenius) were to remind us the kindness of the State of Israel and the crimes against it.
Telling us what a crime it is for the State of Israel for someone to fight for freedom any way he can, and to just tell the truth.
Sign of the the times and the world we live in …..
Regards from Greece.
The information about Havel is misleading, if not actually incorrect. The Prague Spring was in 1968, Charter 77 wasn't written until 1976–and Havel was one of the (242!) original signatories, but didn't write it himself.
"Something is rotten in the state of Denmark." – and it's this list.
Maybe it should be titled "Top 10 Prisoners That Reflect Dash's Personal Political Beliefs"
or perhaps "How to Search Amnesty International"
"How to Search Amnesty International"
Your list sucks, Dash. If you can't keep your personal politics out of a list then it immediately loses all credibility. If in addition to that you write it with all the literary inhibition of a 14-year-old then it crosses the line into ridiculousness.
The title of this list should be "Top Ten Ways To Introduce An Episode Of This Is Your Life".
"he set it on the road to recovery" – can you back that up statistcally concerning economics crime rates, etc?
just asking
I would love to- I have had a quick look for some reliable crime statistics but seem to be finding it hard to find any that I would count as reliable ( It varied between pro gun groups who I suspect round numbers down to suit them and and pro white groups who I suspect rounded them up. I did find this pretty graph http://www.issafrica.org/CJM/statgraphs/murder1.h… But I have no idea where it really comes from but it does show a clear decline in murder rate.
And here's a pretty picture of SA's economic growth- again I'm not entirely sure how reliable it is http://www.southafrica.info/business/economy/econ…
(Can you tell I have trouble trusting stats on the internet?)
Bloody intense debate- what sort of name is that when you can't get the whole side of your debate into one post?
Cont…
Anywho, what I meant (and I suspect you know I meant) is that he set it on the road to recovery by ending apartheid and the deliberate repression of black people. He wanted there to be freedom for all and he wanted it to be peaceful. I definitely feel that allowing black people the freedom to live and work where they want to is a stop on the road to recovery but don't get me wrong, I don't think the final destination has been reached yet and it will take time to get there.
Bloody intense debate- what sort of name is that when you can't get the whole side of your debate into one post?
The scientific term is postus interuptus. It bugs me to no end, I don’t know how some folks are able to consistently post lengthy, informative comments without getting the dreaded blue-box pop-up scolding you that the post is too long. Lifeschool once mentioned something about “turning off” IntenseDebate, but I am too lame to figure out how to do that. Oliveralbq’s trick that he once shared is to make a post and then go back to “edit” it in order to be able to add more text. That works, but it’s a pain in the ass. Whining about it like I am doing here doesn’t work either, but it is way more fun.
i'm with you – i just cut down a comment to avoid a double post, but it ended up not saying what i had intended. if anyone could explain the way around the long comment nag it would be greatly appreciated.
Kind of *****ty list.
This Arafat write-up is a travesty. Ask the family of Leon Klinghoffer how "gallant" Mr. Arafat was. Ask the families of Moshe Weinberg, Yossef Romano, Ze'ev Friedman, David Berger, Yakov Springer, Eliezer Halfin, Yossef Gutfreund, Kehat Shorr, Mark Slavin, Andre Spitzer, Amitzur Shapira, and Anton Fliegerbauer how "gallant" Mr. Arafat was.
Arafat was a sub-human mass murderer.
Plus, he looked like Ringo Starr peeking out from under a Pizza Hut table cloth.
Wow, I wonder how much space I would need if I were to list all the Palestinians murdered by the IDF?
Best comment ever by Enigma!
Plus you wouldn't be able to name them all because most don't even have an identity in the hell-hole formerly known as their home.
At what point is Zacarias Moussaoui considered a political prisoner? Or how about other terrorists held at GITMO? This list is complete crap. Only a complete moron who has no understanding of the world would claim that Yasser Arafat deserves a spot on this list.
@hessian – yes we do have the biggest GPD in africa and we have the largest African stock exchange . But being the best in africa is like being the best in the stupid class . Our infrastructure before the ANC’c take over was great , prices were low and crime was exceptionally low . Yes apartheid was not right and it had to end , but im so confused they couldn’t figure out a better way of handling it . You cant hand over a fully developed country to uneducated peoples , they will not prosper , it will go downhill which it has they dont have the skills to keep up progress. It should have been a gradual handover with guidance and structure and education , then we wouldnt have starving people with a child on each emaciated tit standing on every corner waiting for a handout (never before have we had such high unemployment rates) .It could have and should have been handled better , but my bed was made for me and now i have to lie in it . Oh and the ONLY reason South Africa is the biggest most developed economy in Africa is because White people built it from the ground up , when we handed over power that all went to ***** . The high HIV infection rate is the peoples own fault you wanna ***** around town without a rubber you gonna get aids , its not that hard to understand you cant blame that on education. add to that we just let any scum who wants to flee their own worse piece of ***** country cross our borders and you got the makings of a total failure .You dont know ***** .
Here is the US State Dept. travel notes for people attending the World Cup 2010, S.A. http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis_pa_t… – click Security Assessment
some excerpts –
… visitors should be aware that criminal activity, often violent, is prevalent throughout the country… violent crimes such as armed robbery, carjacking, mugging, "smash-and-grab" attacks on vehicles. organized crime gangs targeting individuals at shopping centers and other public places. … carjacking, have sometimes been accompanied by violent acts, including murder… South Africa has the highest incidence of reported rape in the world… seek immediate medical attention, including antiretroviral therapy against HIV/AIDS. etc. etc.
…precautions are recommended: Avoid using ATMs…
… Criminals do not discriminate
So Bluesman, have you forgotten how the budget on education was alocated from 1948 up to 1994? I suppose you know about the peanuts alocated for the education of a black child and and the large amounts spent on white education. What did you expect would happen? Did you really think that you would end up with an equitable situation? And remember, we had no say in how your goverment went about running the country. We had no vote, and no direct representation in Parliament. What did you think it would lead to eventually? Of course, there is a disparity in the number of graduates in the country. and by the way what qualifications do you have, because I can lay mine on the table, and by the lame argument that you put forward, it seems to me that you're somewhat intectually challenged and educationally short-changed. And again, what has your contribution been to bringing democracy to the country. Or did you really think that your bunch of Nazis were doing the right thing?. The Nationalists had 46 years to introduced phased democracy, as you would have liked. Instead they opted for a more draconian style of rule. So, who do you think is to blame?
Sub par list . . . There is So little information about each entry, and that which is written is dripping in political fervor. Not Listverse worthy.
what makes someone a political prisoner?
if only you had included that in the foreword.
le sigh
…his inability to make peace…
Rettccchhhhh!!!!! As if he was ever trying!
Wow. Arafat AND Vanunu, and not mention of Sharansky. This is something else…
*No* mention, rather.
Bobby sands is a legendary political figure to myself and people with my beliefs. Please respect them, even if you do not agree, as we respect your history of tyranny.
"Our revenge will be the laughter of our children"
- Bobby Sands MEP Fermanagh/S.Tyrone
He's a legendary political figure even though he was an abject failure. *clap clap clap*.
There are far greater figures in the movement to look up to than that *****-stirrer.
If i said i followed Che Guevara, i suppose you'd say the same thing, I dont look up to people because of what they done, its what they were attempting to do.
Abject failure? His death led to the Provisional IRA's support tripling in size literally overnight.
I doubt he' consider that a failure.
His death led to many more civilian deaths and the IRA never got what it was after. I repeat: abject failure, *clap clap clap*.
We can vote, we are seen as equals, there is cross border co-operation between both goverments, Sinn Fein is one of, if not the largest political party in the north
i doubt he call that failure either.
All of those things were achieved in spite of Bobby Sands' death, not because of it. I repeat: he sparked more prolonged violence and a greater number of deaths. The movement did not need Bobby Sands, the only people who benefitted from his death were the *****ing sectarians.
his death may have sparked violence; but why, must i CONSTANTLY ask, should the nationalist population have sat by and accept inequality, brutality and political gerrymandering at the hands of the Unionist government? Westminister turned a blind for years leading up to the troubles. what? the nationalist community should not return the violence and abuse they where suffering? i would like to see your actions in the same situation, grow a set of balls and accept that the government is often the greatest terrorist in any nation, particularly when it treats its citizens like they did in N Ireland
That argument is bull*****. The murders we're talking about here were sectarian in nature or aimed at those who were there ostensibly to keep the peace. It was ignorant, hateful, stupid people killing innocents for no real reason. How did any of the murders after Bobby Sands' death contribute to the movement? I'd like an answer to that before you say something as incredibly thick as "grow a set of balls".
So u think that all the murders in the troubles where sectarian? well i would disagree, i believe that many where committed regardless of religion ie any murderd armed forces by republicans, not because they where protestant but because of who they represented many catholics where killd by republicans also. just because you may not get that argument doesnt mean its stupid, it means you are.
Go back and read my comment, you dumb *****. At what point did I say that all the murders during the Troubles were sectarian?
I'm going to spell it out for you again in plain English (maybe you can read it, even if you seem unable to write it):
Bobby Sands' death did not advance the cause of the Republican movement, all it achieved was an excuse for hate and sectarianism to bubble over and cause many more needless deaths. His name now is used primarily as a figurehead for hate groups who feel the need to prolong a conflict that started many years before they were born and which they do not fully understand.
Fantastic response, good for you ! Perfect points and I couldn't agree more. TAL mo chara.
"people with my beliefs. Please respect them" – or what?
Murder some more – like the Omagh Massacre? – IRA bomb in a crowded market – civilians killed including 2 babies, 9 children and 2 Spanish tourists.
Those kind of beliefs the world can do with out.
listen i know nothing of bobby sands and ira bombings but i googled him and he died in 1981, while that ira bombing was in 1998. So even if its the same ira it is wrong to blame one man for something that happened years after his death (unless he's like elvis, drinking he's mojito on a beach in bora bora)
Arsnl – I wasn’t referring to Sands at all – read it again
Btw – Elvis is in the Bermuda Triangle, so I think he’s sippin’ a Bahama Momma
Well neither that person say IRA. he said “people”. That may very well mean people that believe in an independent northen ireland. Its not something evil for a large group of people to live independently, is it?
Damn i knew i got that wrong. So elvis is in the bermudas, but where is john lennon and what is he drinking?
You've already admitted you know nothing about the subject, so Woyzeck's going to let the staggering ignorance evident in that comment slide. He would suggest that you go off and do a little research before joining the debate over such a complex and emotional issue.
Read a book, that was a RIRA bombing, nothing to do the PIRA.
AIRA
BIRA
CIRA
DIRA
EIRA – use the rest of the *****ing alphabet – any faction that advocates death of innocents is absolutel uncivilized
Bobby sands was a terrorist like the rest of the IRA. When you have family members that were murdered by the disgusting IRA just because they worked in the UDR, then i will respect your opinions. As far as i'm concerned get stuffed anyone who believes the IRA did any good, bunch of glamorised terrorists that unfortuntely idiots believed did good for the country.
im not going to comment on you family member, but it can be argued that the UDR wher as bad as the IRA, if not WORSE, it is well known that they colluded with loyalist paramilitaries to murder innocent civillians, eg the Reavy Brothers, the Miami Showband massacare etc. I personally believe that its worse to have a police force/ defence force that are plotting to murder innocent people for sectarian reasons, than a terrorist organisation targeting armed forces, both are wrong on every level but one is more chilling than the other.
I agree wholeheartedly that there were just as bad people in the UDR as the IRA. Both organisations had people that gave them their bad names, and I'm sure there were many people who joined it for the cause, and not the bloodshed, however the bloodshed is all that remains in my mind.
I'm not defending some of the loyalist groups, they have caused just as much heartache for my family as the IRA.
Unfortunately the troubles were a terrible time and the damage caused reaches from the past to today, and will remain in the future, hopefully everyone just learns from the mistakes made.
I just strongly disagree with Bobby Sands being hailed as some sort of hero, he was a criminal, nothing more, nothing less.
I agree with everyone who commented that this list was poorly written in every way. The entries aren't too short, they just don't include the important information. Number 6, Havel, is especially bad. Who exactly is this person? When did he go to prison? For how long? Why is he a political prisoner? Also, if Bobby Sands staged a hunger strike to be classified as a political prisoner but ending up just dying in the end than how does that make him a political prisoner? Sounds like a just like a regular prisoner to me.
No charge against Bobby Sands was ever proved: bombing, possession of firearms, involvement in gun-battle: nothing!
Bobby, smile on!
You forgot Princess Leia!
This made my day. :]
Why is Arafat a terrorist? He fought the occupation of his country. And he did some bad things, but did he ever bulldoze houses, clusterbomb children, use white phosphurus, massacre babies, incinerate cities, spy on America, like the Lavon Affair, bomb the USS Liberty, assassinate Israel`s Prime Minister, no Israel has. He doesn`t seem like such a terrorist does he?
You're an idiot. The actions of one side in a conflict do not cancel out the actions of the other just because you want them to. You're free to have a side to support in this argument but when your bias starts affecting your ability to accept history then it's time to stop rubbing for a while. Alls I really need to say to your comment – especially the snide and profoundly thick line "He doesn`t seem like such a terrorist does he?" – is to point out that terrorism was his stated MO for over thirty years, that he approved Black September and he made the following quotes:
"Our law is a Jordanian law that we inherited, which applies to both the West Bank and Gaza, and sets the death penalty for those who sell land to Israelis."
"Peace for us means the destruction of Israel. We are preparing for an all-out war, a war which will last for generations."
"Whoever thinks of stopping the uprising before it achieves its goals, I will give him ten bullets in the chest."
"We will not bend or fail until the blood of every last Jew from the youngest child to the oldest elder is spilt to redeem our land!"
And Woyzeck's personal favourite, the one which is practically a dictionary definition of the word 'terrorism':
"We plan to eliminate the state of Israel and establish a purely Palestinian state. We will make life unbearable for Jews by psychological warfare and population explosion. We Palestinians will take over everything, including all of Jerusalem."
You didn't need to write all that Wozysk. Anyone who supports Palestinians is terrorist according to Israel, regardless of their actions.
It feels good to know you couldn't come up with a real argument against what I said.
If you want to use quotes to show that a person is a terrorist, these might show you that the "terrorism" isn't one sided.
"We must expel Arabs and take their places."
– David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.
"There is no such thing as a Palestinian people… It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn't exist."
– Golda Meir, statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.
"We walked outside, Ben-Gurion accompanying us. Allon repeated his question, What is to be done with the Palestinian population?' Ben-Gurion waved his hand in a gesture which said 'Drive them out!"
– Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times, 23 October 1979.
"[The Palestinians] are beasts walking on two legs."
– Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the 'Beasts,"' New Statesman, June 25, 1982.
"Israel should have exploited the repression of the demonstrations in China, when world attention focused on that country, to carry out mass expulsions among the Arabs of the territories."
– Benyamin Netanyahu, then Israeli Deputy Foreign Minister, former Prime Minister of Israel, speaking to students at Bar Ilan University, from the Israeli journal Hotam, November 24, 1989.
And this is a good one:
"(The Palestinians) would be crushed like grasshoppers … heads smashed against the boulders and walls."
– Isreali Prime Minister (at the time) Yitzhak Shamir in a speech to Jewish settlers New York Times April 1, 1988
But then this is even better:
"Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves … politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves… The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country."
– David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky's Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha Flapan's "Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech.
"It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism, colonialization, or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands."
– Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of militants from the extreme right-wing Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, November 15, 1998.
You're fighting the wrong battle here, pal. You're pretty much just backing up everything I said in the first place. In case you didn't read it, here it is again:
"The actions of one side in a conflict do not cancel out the actions of the other just because you want them to."
Mark's point was that Arafat wasn't a terrorist because the Israelis used terrorism (a.k.a. 2 + 2 = 0). My point was that Arafat was still a terrorist even though the Israelis use terror tactics too (2 + 2 = 4). At no point did I say that the Israelis were a bunch of peace-loving shrinking violets, so your entire argument is born out of fallacy and, I infer from the fact that you didn't read my comment properly, bias.
You do raise an interesting point, however, in your use of quotation marks around terrorism. Do the actions of the Israelis count as terrorism, or are they something different (though equally ugly)? I would suggest that what Israel engages in is aggressive fascism, while the Palestinians use terrorism. By this I mean, Israel attacks brutally and indiscriminately, but comparitively rarely and usually with a specific objective. The Palestinians attack every day in order to frighten the Israeli populace.
At any rate, they're both *****ed and I wish the sea would swallow their entire *****ty little patch of desert so that they have nothing to fight over anymore.
obby sands should be remembered for the bigot he was, if i could really comment he i would tell you what a w@nker he was.
Whats different about him and the muslim terrorists? thats what he was a terrorist
his name is mohandas karamchand gandhi. there is no such man as mahatma gandhi
Ya you're a dildo
Mahatma is an honorary title bestowed upon people who have great signifigance to the Indian population. It means "great soul".
Number one was the only one I heard of.