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It is no secret that I love language and all things related it to. Also, being a bit of a pedant, I love to share titbits of information about words, phrases, and language in general. Therefore, I have put together a list of misconceptions (one of my favorite types of list) about common sayings. Some involve spelling errors, while others involve conception or comprehension errors. Be sure to tell us your favorite (and by that I mean most hated) common errors in the comments.
Common Saying: To get off scot free
Many people think that this saying refers to Scottish people being tight with money – hence something being free, but in fact the word “scot” is an old Norse word which means “payment” – specifically a payment made to a landlord or sheriff. So this phrase – while meaning what most people think it means, has no connection to the Scottish people – it just means to get off without having to pay.
Common Saying: As fit as a fiddle
This is another phrase where a single word has confused people – “fit” in the context of this saying does not mean “healthy” which is a 19th century definition. Its original meaning was “suitable” – and it is still used in that context in the sentence “fit for a king”. As fit as a fiddle means “as appropriate as can be” – not “in excellent health”. The first use of the phrase, incidentally, was in the 16th century and it was originally “as right as a fiddle”.
Common Saying: If you think that, you have another thing coming
This is a complete aberration of the original phrase because of the sound of English. The correct phrase is “if you think that, you have another think coming” – in other words, “what you think is wrong so think again”. Because the “k” in “think” often ends up silent when saying “think coming” people have changed the phrase over time. Of course, “another thing coming” makes no sense at all. To illustrate how global this error is, when you google “another thing coming” it returns 139,000 results; when you google “another think coming” it returns a mere 39,000 results.
Common Saying: Eat humble pie
This phrase means “to be humble in apologizing for something.” I was slightly reluctant to put it on the list because it actually does mean what people think it means, but there is still a misconception here; people think that this phrase means to eat a pie made of humbleness but it actually means to eat a pie made with umble (pictured above). Umble is an old English word for offal – the bits of the animal seldom eaten today (sadly). It was a pie that was normally eaten by the poor as the finer cuts of meat were left for the rich only. “To eat a humble pie” is an example of metanalysis (words being broken down into parts or meanings that differ from the original) as it sounds just like “to eat an umble pie”. Other examples of this in English are “an apron” which used to be “a napron”.
Common Saying: Rule of thumb
People commonly think that this saying is a reference to a law allowing a man to beat his wife as long as he uses a rod no thicker than his thumb. It is, of course, completely untrue. There is no record of any judge in Britain ever making a ruling like this – or any lawmaker passing a law. The phrase actually refers to doing something by estimates – rather than using an exact measure.
Common Saying: On tender hooks
This phrase is very commonly misspelt. First off, what exactly is a tender hook? It doesn’t seem logical does it? Well – that is because it isn’t. The phrase is actually “on tenterhooks”. A tenter was a medieval tool used for making cloth – the tenterhooks (pictured above) were small hooks to which the fabric would be stretched in the manufacturing process. To be on tenterhooks means to be left hanging – or to be in a state of suspense.
Common Saying: I’ll take a raincheck
This phrase is usually meant to mean “I won’t do it now but I will later”. This is the commonly accepted meaning (and has been for a long time) so it is now considered to be correct. It is included here merely out of interest because its original meaning was slightly different. Initially, a raincheck was offered to people who had tickets to a baseball game that was rained out – they would offered a “raincheck” which was a ticket for a game at a later date to make up for the missed game. This eventually found its way into shopping jargon in general where a raincheck was an offer to sell an out-of-stock good when it arrived back in stock. The meaning has eventually broadened to a point that it is not an offer any longer but a response.
Common Saying: To give someone free reign
This is a spelling error that leads to a misunderstanding – though the meanings remain the same fundamentally. Many people presume this phrase to mean that a person given free reign, has the “royal” power to do anything they want. In fact, the correct phrase is “free rein” and it comes from the days before cars when horses were used as our main mode of transport. When navigating a steep or winding path, one would relax the reins so that the horse could pick the safest path as he was more likely to do a better job than the rider.
Common Saying: To wreck havoc
Havoc means chaos – and to wreck something is to put it into a state of chaos. So why would you make chaos out of chaos? You wouldn’t. What you might do is wreak havoc though – because “to wreak” means “to cause to happen”. The two words are pronounced differently – wreck sounds like “rek” while “wreak” sounds like “reek”. It is a small – but common, error.
Common Saying: To beg the question
Let’s face it – 99% of people reading this list will not know the correct meaning of “beg the question”, but that implies that the mistaken meaning should really be considered correct through common usage – so let us not fight about right or wrong – I will just state the facts: “to beg the question” does not mean “to raise the question”. Originally the phrase was “to begge the question” and it appeared in English around the 1580s. It is a reference to a question (or phrase) which implies the truth of the thing it is trying to prove. Confusing? Okay – here is an example: “why does England have fewer trees per acre than any other country in Europe?” This is a “begged question” – the person asking is implying that England has fewer trees – when in fact, it may not. Another example is “he must be telling the truth because he never lies”. Decartes was begging the question when he said “I think, therefore I am”. Oh – and for those of you who are used to using the term in the wrong way, consider using “prompt the question” as a correct alternative.
Contributor: JFrater
March 24th, 2009 at 1:12 am
I’ve actually never heard “wreck havoc”
I’ve always said “wreak”
Great list :]
March 24th, 2009 at 1:14 am
Nice list. Do some people actually say ‘Wreck havoc’?
March 24th, 2009 at 1:14 am
In apple pie order… ordering a pie… :p haha!
March 24th, 2009 at 1:14 am
Another sublime list from JF.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:17 am
interesting list! For once I’ve actually heard of most of the correct sayings and for a few of them I hadn’t even heard of the common mistake (never heard anyone say to wreck havoc for example) but anyway, great list
March 24th, 2009 at 1:28 am
Good list, I was aware of most of these – I’ve never heard anyone say tender hooks or wreck havoc though, Australia must be pretty gramatically correct – but I did learn a thing or two
March 24th, 2009 at 1:31 am
I’m not sure I’ve ever heard the term ‘to wreck havoc’. It doesn’t even sound right like a saying should.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:35 am
Great list! Most of these I already knew, but I did learn some things today, too!
And as for begging the question, this is all I can say:
http://www.qwantz.com/archive/000693.html
March 24th, 2009 at 1:36 am
pretty good list like usual i just cant help but wonder why the rule of thumb guy has an apple logo on his shirt..
March 24th, 2009 at 1:39 am
Hmmm, nice list but I’ve never heard any one say “wreck havoc” …and I live in KY LOL! I also thought to beg the question or beg your pardon even after the question or pardon was given meant that it was to ask the person to repeat/ re-phrase the question/apology to make things more clear.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:49 am
NUMBER ONE IS EDUCATIONAL..THANK YOU JFRAT.ü
March 24th, 2009 at 2:33 am
As a Rule of Thumb, I Beg the Question. If you think you can Wreck Havoc and have Free Reign while we’re On Tender Hooks. I’ll Take a Raincheck and you’ll Eat Humble Pie because you got Another Thing Coming, if you think you’re as Fit as a Fiddle and Scot Free.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:35 am
Great list – one we use here is – Lets go and paint the town red.
Which realy means lets get out and party in town and genarly have a good time.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:35 am
i always wondered where sayings like this came from. where dick *as sick as a parrot* come from?
March 24th, 2009 at 2:37 am
I’ve always said ‘another thing coming’ even though I’ve suspected the correct term. Not anymore though!
March 24th, 2009 at 2:41 am
I actually knew the correct meaning of all of these, the incorrect meaning I didnt know that well. Rule of thumb for example, the incorrect meaning was hilarious.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:46 am
I beg to differ!
March 24th, 2009 at 2:47 am
I’ve never heard anyone say ‘wreck havoc’ either. Also, I remember once watching a cookery programme and they were smoking some fish on hooks and the man smoking the fish said that’s where the phrase ‘on tenterhooks’ came from. I’ve looked it up (briefly) and I can’t find any reference to fish-smoking. Maybe he was just reusing cloth hooks?
March 24th, 2009 at 3:03 am
I’m too busy to read this in one foul swoop so I’ll go through it with a fine toothcomb later. I wait with baited breath for future lists on similar sayings.
March 24th, 2009 at 3:15 am
I’m from Sweden and I would guess that the word ’scot’ is a derivative from the word ’skatt’ (or vice versa) which literally means some form of tax.
March 24th, 2009 at 3:38 am
Can I just say that in England (where English is used properly and not in the basterdised American form) I have never heard of the expressions wreck havoc or on tender hooks. Here, we use the correct forms as stated above. I can only but assume, sadly, that a phrase such as “wreck havoc” is used by over excited frat boys in which something “awesome” happened.
Just thought I’d point that out
March 24th, 2009 at 3:41 am
Again just like almost everyone else, never heard “wreck havoc”. The picture for “rule of thumb” is amazing and so is the incorrect meaning for it, which again I never heard.
March 24th, 2009 at 3:45 am
And tinydancer, wasn’t there already a list confirming that the “American” English was closer to the “correct” English than the British version of it? And also saying that Americans are the ones using the wrong usage of the sayings is just ignorant. We aren’t the only ones that get things wrong, you know.
March 24th, 2009 at 3:53 am
I always wondered about the Raincheck – I’m not a native English speaker, and I always wondered about that expressing when I heard in film or TV shows, for the longest time I thought they were saying something like a “re-check” just because raincheck made absolutly no sense. so thank you for clearing that up
March 24th, 2009 at 4:00 am
I knew a bunch of these already, but was disappointed not to see ‘I could care less’ on the list.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:01 am
Hello tinydancer. I am glad that you’re all smart and can speak English properly. Really, it makes me very happy. Now all you have to do is work on not being asshole.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:03 am
Excellent list, Jamie. Thank you. Here’s another one:
The Quick and the Dead.
This expression was famously misused in the title of the 1995 movie with Sharon Stone. It assumes that the ‘Quick’ refers to the speed of the draw of the gunslinger. The true meaning of the word is ‘alive’. It is still used in this context when we refer to the first movement of a fetus as ‘the quickening’, to quicksand (living sand) , or to trimming a fingernail into the quick.
First recorded in the 4th century Old English as “cwice”, the phrase appears in the 1385 Wycliffe Bible as:
And thei schulen yyue resoun to hym, that is redi to deme the quyke and the deed.
And in the king James version:
Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:03 am
i always heard that as *I couldn’t care less*
March 24th, 2009 at 4:13 am
6twistedbiscuits, you definitely reminded me about how much it bothers me when people say I “could” care less instead of couldn’t. If you just think about it when you say could, it kind of doesn’t work out with the way most people mean it. Unless you actually COULD care less about something, then go ahead and say it but it just doesn’t have the same emphasis as couldn’t. I actually think you should replace the “Wreck havoc” with “Could care less”.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:16 am
*edit- I will give credit where credit is due, ChickyBee was the one to think of “could care less”. And sorry for so many posts, I may or may not have been drinking.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:29 am
tinydancer: Wow. Really? Do you have something against us bastards? I as an American have never said “wreck” nor have I heard it so pick on another country and their frat boys okay? Jerk.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:31 am
6 twisted biscuits = as sick as a parrot comes from the mining days when the miners would take a bird with them into the mine and when the bird died then they knew that the air levels were dangerous and they would resurface. they would usually use parrots and budgies
March 24th, 2009 at 4:33 am
I agree with tinydancer.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:35 am
anyone mention
a MUTE point instead of
a MOOT point
March 24th, 2009 at 4:37 am
I agree with Katiebug. I have always known it to be “wreak havoc.” Who says “wreck?” I live in the South, and nobody I know would ever says “wreck” though they have a habit of saying “chunk” in lieu of “chuck.” As in, I’m going to throw something at you, ergo, I chuck it at you. But they say, “I will chunk it at you.”
Eh…nice list either way.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:44 am
@33 Canacan – The mine story is an unlike source. Not the bird in the mine part, but that a coal miner would use a parrot. These are tropical birds and were very rare and expensive. I do not think that poor miners could afford such an expense nor would the mine owners select to risk it.
In any event “as sick as a parrot” often refers to “disappointment”. As such, this may make more sense. To have paid dearly for an imported bird only to see it get sick would be a disappointment indeed.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:46 am
In the olden days when people went out to party in town there used to be lots of free-for-all brawls in the inns and taverns, which resulted in lots of blood spillages. Hence the term ” to paint the town red”. Seriously !…NOT! !
March 24th, 2009 at 4:53 am
My personal fave (not that anyone truly cares) is “for all intensive purposes,” when it fact it’s “for all intents and purposes.”
March 24th, 2009 at 4:58 am
I too never heard ‘wreck havoc’ instead of ‘wreak havoc’, but you got me on ‘another think coming’ so it balances.
Also, like TJ, I hear ‘mute point’ instead of ‘moot point’ a lot.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:13 am
I like the saying ‘for love nor money’ But i believe that it does have misconstrued usage, can someone clarify. I understand it to be theres no way in hell im doing that shite?
March 24th, 2009 at 5:13 am
This woulda been a nice place to clear up that whole: “Have your cake and eat it too” nonsense.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:36 am
I’d love to WRECK HAVOC on-Tiny BRAIN DEAD Dancer. By the responses posted, I am not alone.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:40 am
Here’s another for you: people often say “spitting image” but the correct saying is “spit and image”. Dunno why.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:54 am
Tinydancer, I’m confused upon a point you are making. Are Americans the only ones who “bastardize” your precious form of “proper” English? What about Australia and the other English speaking nations? Do they bastardize the language as well? Face it, I’m sure by your logic the Romans have a bone to pick with the French, Italians and Spanish for bastardizing their language as well. Here’s a common expression for you: get off your high horse. You are not better than anyone else here. Do you understand that? Awesome!
March 24th, 2009 at 5:55 am
Wouldn’t the fact that most English-speakers have adapted these phrases for decades and use them predominantly these ways effectively redefine them? i.e. they are no longer really incorrect as they sound okay to all of us?
Also, on Number 8, good to see some Judas Priest influence here!
March 24th, 2009 at 6:04 am
What about “Suffer fools” ?
March 24th, 2009 at 6:08 am
Late O’ Day: By the way, Have = Eaten Therefore, the term means you can’t have eaten your cake and then eat it again. At least that is the interpretation from Wyk.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:11 am
Ok I have never heard anyone say “to wreck havoc”. I have always heard “to wreak havoc”. And it appears a lot of people who have commented who have also never heard “to wreck havoc”. Which begs the question (haha just kidding Jamie!)..which prompts the question, where did you get to wreck havoc from? Have you actually heard people use it?
Hahaha I’m also so glad you had the beg the question thing on here because just the other day on another website someone in the article said “which begs the question…” then someone commented and said “oh that’s not what begs the question means”. And then I thought “well..what does it mean then??” Someone else even asked but the original commenter never said anything back. NOW I know what that person was talking about!!
March 24th, 2009 at 6:16 am
A great interesting list, other than number two. The rest are kind of understandable misunderstandings (lol), but number 2 is pure stupidity.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:17 am
I never want to eat an umble pie- it looks gross. Cool list, though.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:30 am
It seems as if the writer of this list was the one who made all the spelling errors, and not the people who use the sayings. I would say 95% of the people who read this list have never heard of “wreck havoc” or “on tender hooks”. I think the person who wrote this has just misheard these sayings and they are now passing on the misspelling.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:31 am
#31 – No need for credit, just glad to see I’m not alone!
Another random one that drove me nuts was when discussing assignments in high school, many classmates would refer to theirs as ‘a working progress’ instead of a ‘work in progress’
Hrmm… perhaps this could spawn a list of ‘Commonly Mangled Sayings’ ?
March 24th, 2009 at 6:33 am
There was one misconception that used to really annoy me, it was “no pain, no game” its actually “no pain, no gain”.. A lot of people already know that, but a lot of people DON’T.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:35 am
I’ve never heard of wrecking havoc either- and thank you many times for the tender hooks thing. That bothers me. also on my “pet peeve” list:
* Irregardless. I don’t care if it’s in the dictionary. It’s not a word.
* Flammable and Inflammable. Inflammable..you keep using this word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
* “I’m LITERALLY going to starve to death I’m so hungry!” “I have so much homework I’m LITERALLY going to die!” I am figuratively going to punch you in the head if you keep using literally wrong.
* PIN number. Urg.
I know those are words and not phrases, but they all needed to be said,
March 24th, 2009 at 6:36 am
Quite a non-controversial list JFrater. (If you discount tinydancer’s allegations, that is.)
But informative nonetheless.
English is such a delightful language, with a rich history, and many diverse sources. No wonder it is used as the language of the world, because everyone can identify with it, and “bastardize” or “wreck havoc” on it, in their own way. But it’s all fun.
One phrase that does seem to get on my nerves is “Believe you me”. I maybe wrong, but it just doesn’t seem proper. Does it?
March 24th, 2009 at 6:37 am
Pocket: your post made me laugh, thank you for that.
I have heard people say wreck havoc vice wreak havoc, so it happens.
I would consider “to raise” and “to prompt” the questions to be very similar in their meanings. One of the synonyms I found for “raise” in this context was “provoke.” One of the synonyms I found for “provoke” was “prompt.” Perhaps I’m reading too much into it?
As far as the discrepancy between “rain check” for the baseball game and the context today, I really don’t see that as such a wild misconception.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:37 am
posted too quickly. The end of that sentence is “so there they are” if anyone was wondering.
There’s an article about common phrases on mental floss today. Never knew how “pleased as punch” came about. Pretty neat.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:41 am
Callie: just in reference to PIN number; I think that is an issue that covers a lot of territory. Whether it’s personal identification number number or network interface card card or to a lesser extent: bunny rabbit or puppy dog, etc. These certainly make me cringe, but then I catch myself doing it too.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:42 am
I use “couldn’t care less” but I have always liked “could care less”. It makes me think that the person could care less if they tried, but it isn’t worth the effort to them.
I’m from Canada so “wind chill factor” comes up frequently. Some people pronounce it “windshield factor” and it makes me want to smack them.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:51 am
I’m going to call Rob Halford and tell him he has another think coming.
Also – some guy told me one time he was going to ‘kick my ass’ and ‘beat the shit out of me.’ As I laid on the ground in a puddle of my own blood, I figured out that he didn’t actually ‘kick my ass’ once and as I remained in control of my bowels, he didn’t actually ‘beat the shit out of me.’ I grabbed my phone and texted him that he shouldn’t say things he doesn’t actually mean. He should have said he was going to slap me a few times and then punch me repeatedly in the solar plexis while his buddies held me up. I suppose he could have chosen to kick me in the ass as I was sprawled out on the ground, but he chose to kick me in the stomach and in the face a few times.
Boy was he stupid.
And I’d like to say to Jamie that his use of my picture in #6 is copyright infringement. You’ll be hearing from my lawyers pal!
March 24th, 2009 at 6:54 am
I knew a few of these and find it amusing now that I have used them wrong in the past. Guess its just like that game telephone…you whisper a word in someones ear and the in turn repeat it to somone else in the same manner. It is then repeated until everyone has heard it. The last person must then say the word aloud. It never turns out to be the same word, but for some reason the word is usually beer.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:58 am
I still don’t understand number 1.. I’m a very big linguistic geek so it’s quite important that I get a grip on that one. Help!!
Also, I couldn’t remember my password for my account so I tried the forgot password thing and it doesn’t work.. So I created a whole new account and then when I went to the forum to mention my initial password-recovery problem it wouldn’t let me log in!!
March 24th, 2009 at 6:59 am
P.s Hi, I’m new
March 24th, 2009 at 7:00 am
@ Number 44: Here’s another for you: people often say “spitting image” but the correct saying is “spit and image”. Dunno why.
I didn’t know that but maybe it means that someone looks like someone physically (image) but also in DNA (spit).
Makes more sense than spitting image anyway.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:06 am
#19 astraya — I know you were joking, but you hit on one of the ones that bugs me most in your post: “baited breath”, which of course should be “bated breath”, as in “abated”. I always picture people who use the wrong phrase as walking around with worms hanging out of their mouths.
Also cannot stand “tow the line”, which is increasingly used for “toe the line”.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:06 am
oops grammer error “commented have” not “who have”
March 24th, 2009 at 7:09 am
Callie: Yeah that’s like when I hear people say “the ATM machine”
March 24th, 2009 at 7:12 am
9. shichiro : I´ve been wondering that too… Is that some subtle message about the evilness of Apple? Oh, the iPod loving wife-beater…
Anyway, I had heard people using the wrong versions of most of these and they make me cringe every time (especially the “another thing coming” for some reason…).
Oh and Callie (55), you could LITERALLY hit someone on the head for misusing the word….
March 24th, 2009 at 7:12 am
Same as, Katiebug.
I knew all of them, except “Begge the Question”, and I’m still not sure I understand that one…
I’ll stick with prompt….
March 24th, 2009 at 7:15 am
Man, bucslim, I never knew you were such a looker.
Actually, out of all the items listed, the one that surprises me the most is “spitting image/spit and image”. Really? It’s not “spitting image”? I have been so wrong for so long…
Not going to get into “wreck havoc”. Seems like everyone else has.
Sounds like Tinydancer has a thing against us Yanks. That’s okay, if I were British I’d still feel pretty sore about losting the Revolutionary War and needing us “doughboys” to help save you in WWII. It’s okay to feel angry.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:15 am
@Callie
“I’m LITERALLY going to starve to death I’m so hungry!”
You do know that’s actually possible.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:21 am
H3000 the people I know who use that are in no danger of dying because they didn’t eat lunch. I’m talking about the girls that used to sit in class in their Uggs and miniskirts, text the whole time, and absentmindedly twirled their hair while saying it. Actually, it’s entirely possible they just plain forgot to eat.
of course I know it’s possible. no disrespect meant at all towards victims of starvation.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:24 am
Someone should tell Judas Priest about number 8.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:24 am
lol @ jacob (#12)
great list!
March 24th, 2009 at 7:27 am
I’ve heard the etymology of the phrase “fit as a fiddle” comes from the fact that in the middle ages (?) fiddlers would often play for long amounts of time, so therefore needed to be healthy. So the original phrase was “fit as a fiddler” which eventually got shortened to “fit as a fiddle”. This is what NPR told me anyway
Great list
March 24th, 2009 at 7:28 am
oh and one more!
could HAVE and would HAVE. Could of and would of make me batty- and I know sooooo many smart people who do it. I know could’ve sounds like could of, but seriously. Common sense should take over there and realize it’s a contraction.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:31 am
Cedestra: I really hate when American blows their horns about rescuing us European in WWII! I was not ilke you did it out of the goodness of you heart, you sat at your asses and looked on until Pearl Habor!
And you always seem to forget about the times Europeans helped you out, like in the Revolutinary War when France spent all its money on helping you out.
Tinydancer: all power to you!
March 24th, 2009 at 7:32 am
Well I’ve seen the incorrect term ‘wreck havoc’ used many times. Here are some examples from all over the planet:
(Great List – Thank you!)
“Floods wreck havoc in Northern Ireland”
http://www.metro.co.uk 2007
“Wildfires wreck havoc in Oz”
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk 2009
“Majestic England wreck havoc”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk 2002
“Tornadoes wreck havoc in the US”
http://www.australianetwork.com 2008
“After surviving Katrina, Fletcher ready to wreck havoc on C-USA”
http://www.espn.com 2007
March 24th, 2009 at 7:37 am
I never wreck havoc, but I do like to cry havoc and let loose the hounds of war.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:38 am
Lists like this make me realize how smart I am.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:39 am
77–The French also came towards the end of the Revolutionary War, so what is your point?
March 24th, 2009 at 7:42 am
Interesting list!
Just as a sidenote, I’m Norwegian and we still use the word “skatt” (same derivation as “scot”) for our taxes. Which is, in a way, a payment to the local sheriff.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:45 am
This list says “Another thing coming” doesn’t make sense but it sort of does. You can take “You’ve got another thing coming” to mean “You have something else coming” which means “something other than what you expected is going to happen”.
I have also never heard anyone say “wreck havoc”. I’ve always said “wreak”.
One of the ones I hate is when someone says “irregardless” instead of “regardless”.
Also, I can’t believe “couldn’t care less/could care less” isn’t up there.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:46 am
81. shayman: The Revolutionary War was from 1775 – 1783, the French joined the war in 1778, I would not call that the end of the war, more the middel…
March 24th, 2009 at 7:49 am
The meaning of to “table a question or project” depends on which side of the Atlantic you happen to live.
One saying I have tried to track down for years is “coming out of the woodwork”. I know *what* it means, I just don’t how it came about, though I have a pretty solid idea of it’s source I can’t find definitive back-up.
Another saying I like is “I’ll eat my hat”, which apparently began as “I’ll eat hatte” (obviously some noxious substance).
I have enormous lists of sayings, most, for better or worse, having to do with someones lack of intelligence (it began, and still is, a joke between one of my kids and me).
I also have a wonderful list of words used in film-making, describing the various pieces of equipment, but it’s not very p.c. any more. (who cares? Really, I mean…no,I’ll go into rant mode and take up two hours of your time!)
March 24th, 2009 at 7:54 am
The mangled phrase that always makes me laugh is when people say “Damp Squid” instead of “Damp Squib”.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:55 am
85. segue: It is funny about “I’ll eat my hat” vs. “I’ll eat hatte”. In Danish we also say “I’ll eat my hat” – in Danish of course, so perhaps we are using a translation of a misused saying! Is like an international game of telephone..
March 24th, 2009 at 7:58 am
Very nice list. The explaination on “beg the question” was well done. i agreee with many of the others who have never heard “wreck havoc”. I do have a question though. You made a couple refernces to the fact that when common usage becomes widespread enough it becomes correct. What I’m asking is at what point does this happen? I thought a couple others on the list may have fallen under this category (eat humble pie, fit as a fiddle).
March 24th, 2009 at 8:02 am
To use the phrase “I’ll eat my hat” might be to make the point that there is a great deal of disbelief present and that one would go to such extreme? I don’t think it is a misconception as much as an extreme.
March 24th, 2009 at 8:09 am
Carlin had a good one in ‘hot water heater.’
No, what you need is a cold water heater! If you already had hot water, you wouldn’t need it heated.
March 24th, 2009 at 8:31 am
Wonder if it where I’m from…pennsylvania. but I have heard wrek havoc many times. I believe I have said it that way too until I was about 15 or 16 and learned the correct phrase. I still hear people saying it…frat boys to old boys.
I, myself, HATE when people say ’same difference’
March 24th, 2009 at 8:33 am
I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone say ‘tender’ hooks or to ‘wreck’ havoc, and I’m a philosophy student so the idea of begging the question is pretty important, but a great list! really interesting =]
March 24th, 2009 at 8:40 am
About the whole “spitting image” “spit and image” thing. I’m pretty sure that they are both right. If I’m not mistaken, there are quite a few ways of saying it actually.
March 24th, 2009 at 8:56 am
Nice list Mr.Frater, honestly i check this site twice a day for updates or randomly go to lists i’ve already read
Listverse is the reason why i procrastinate so damn much!
March 24th, 2009 at 9:01 am
I’ve never understood the saying, “my dogs are barking”
such as, “Fwhoo! My dogs sure are barking today!”
This would be in reference to painful feet (or maybe painful corns on the feet), like,”Ive been walking all day and night and I gotta tell you , My….”
I have always loved this saying, for the most part, because of its odd nature.
Theres gotta be a misconception in there someplace.
#86 Banjolegs:-
Meanwhile on the set of another low budget horror flick, the following echange took place-
“Run for your life, that giant squid’s goinna explode!”
“No No No, get back here Buddy! That squid aint goinna explode because it’s DAMP! You hear me, that’s a damp squid!”
“oh, it’sah damp?”
“yeh that’s right Buddy, damp squid… Now go get me a latte..or are your dogs barking again?”
March 24th, 2009 at 9:05 am
p.s.
59. Armauld
haha, I know exactly what you mean.
March 24th, 2009 at 9:20 am
FINALLY!!!!! Someone else who knows that NO ONE uses “beg the question” correctly! I had a philosophy prof who taught us the correct usuage, and he’d get irate if you used it wrong (it was a joking irate, pretty funny guy actually). And ever since then, I have NEVER heard ANYONE use it correctly. NEVER EVER EVER. And whenever someone uses it incorrectly, I always think “should I correct them?”. But i never do, because it’s a LOOOOOOOONG explaination. I just try to say “raises the question” … I figure that’s enough.
March 24th, 2009 at 9:25 am
I love finding out where these phrases come from. A lot come from so long ago that their original meanings are ‘forgotten’. If anybody gets a chance to see the UK show – The Worst Jobs In History, by Tony Robinson (or gets to read the book), you’d find boat-loads of references to where these sorts of things came from. E.g, thick as two short planks, to cadge a lift, to duck and dive, to wheel and deal, to get ’shafted’, an old codger, a ‘toe rag’ etc etc. V V interesting.
March 24th, 2009 at 9:30 am
Another one is unthaw. Really, are you going to freeze it then?
I wonder if “spit and image” has something to do with spit shining shoes until you can see your own image. That’s just a guess, I have no idea where it comes from.
March 24th, 2009 at 9:32 am
36. hook em horns – “I live in the South”
Let me guess – Georgia?
I, myself, am from the West.
But then again, wouldn’t that be a self-referential statement and thus invalid – at least from Tinydangler’s p.o.v.?
March 24th, 2009 at 9:40 am
One more – if you make your bed you lay on it – meaning, if you have caused a situation, you sort it out.
March 24th, 2009 at 9:41 am
OMG – mispronunciations could go on forever – make a decision: you cannot make a decision you already have you need to choose one, all of the sudden – it is written all of A sudden, and the best one?
“’scuse me while I kiss this guy!”
March 24th, 2009 at 9:42 am
Signe
Sorry but you’re wrong about WWII. Ever heard about the lend lease program that kept you supplied BEFORE Pearl Harbor? Oh and you forgot about the American pilots who helped out during the Battle of Britain. The argument wouldn’t have started if Tinydancer hadn’t mentioned that it was only american frat boys who would mangle the English language.
March 24th, 2009 at 9:43 am
re: Sick as a Parrot…
http://www.trevorsbirding.com/as-sick-as-a-parrot/
March 24th, 2009 at 9:56 am
Six of one, half a dozen of the other if you ask me.
I might point out that I’ve NEVER heard “beg the question” mean anything other than falling into the circular argument fallacy and asserting what you are trying to prove is true as part of proving it.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:07 am
i never heard any of those
March 24th, 2009 at 10:16 am
According to my Etymological Dictionary of Modern English, the saying probably began as “To eat Old Rowley’s (Charles II’s) hat”.
Now, how about “to beat the band”?
March 24th, 2009 at 10:23 am
Thanks for the education!
March 24th, 2009 at 10:24 am
Thank you SO MUCH for including the “begs the question” issue! I just about died when I heard them use it incorrectly in a shampoo commercial. I nearly wrote to the company. I think you should have included “I could care less.” It’s either “like I could care less” or “I couldn’t care less.” Just think about what you’re saying, people! x_x
March 24th, 2009 at 10:32 am
H3000 and Armaud:
“spitting image” is indeed properly pronounced “spit and image,” but it should be written “spi’it and image” because it is a corruption of the original phrase: “spirit and image.”
Originally, when you wanted to tell someone that they reminded you of someone or something else, you would tell them that they “were the very spirit and image” of that other thing/person.
Eventually this got shortened down to spit and image, and since this makes no sense whatsoever, it was naturally shifted over to spitting image, which makes no sense either.
English is such a lovely language that way.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:40 am
Fascinating list, I thoroughly enjoyed reading through it! I’ve also never heard of “wreck havoc.” In fact, I actually thought it was a typo until I started reading about it.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:43 am
I’d just like to point out that there is a local band in my town that is called ‘The Tenderhooks’. I’ve spoken with these guys a few times and they said that they were amused by how many people actually thought that there was nothing wrong with the name. Also, I know that at least one of the members of the band was an English Lit major. Sometimes it is astonishing that so many people could be so incorrect.
55. Deadangst – “believe you me” is a colloquiallism of the southern united states if I am not mistaken, and does not really qualify, as it is used mostly by people that have no grasp of proper english anyway.
ps I live in the south, so don’t take the previous response as any sort of south-flaming, it’s simply the truth, the people down here have ABSOLUTELY no grasp of how to speak properly.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:45 am
btw the thing that really grates my nerves is the improper use of ‘talk’ and ’speak’.
I speak to you, a group of people, a class, etc.
The baby is finally able to talk.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:53 am
Love this! I teach HS English, so knowing the origin of idiomatic phrases is always entertaining to my students.
Here’s an interesting one I came upon years ago: The term “spitting image,” which means almost identical usually refers to a person looking very much like an older relative. “Emily is the spitting image of her mother!” The origin lies in a misunderstanding of dialect. Southern slaves would often say someone was the “spirit and image” of someone who had passed on. It’s easy to see how “spirit and image” when spoken in dialect could be misunderstood as “spittin’ image.”
March 24th, 2009 at 10:53 am
A-Damn
Where were you born?
March 24th, 2009 at 10:56 am
100-TEX
I am actually residing in the great state of Texas. (Wouldn’t have it any other way.) I like being the buckle to the Bible Belt.
In any case, what part of the West are you, yourself, from?
Well, I’m fixin’ to grab a coke and head back to work, y’all. LOL. Hope you got the gist of what I was saying there, Tinydancer…oops, sorry, might I add: AWESOME!
March 24th, 2009 at 11:01 am
hook em horns
New Jersey, of course
March 24th, 2009 at 11:03 am
historydave – thanks, i was getting so curious about that spitting image thing.
common phrase i hear is “its doing my head in”, as in something is really annoying. any clues where that came from?
March 24th, 2009 at 11:04 am
I was born in Maine, but I’ve lived in Knoxville since I was about six.
March 24th, 2009 at 11:05 am
Signe:
Okay, time for some history lessons.
To begin with, however, you must be young. Danes and other Europeans who LIVED through WWII generally get down on their knees and thank Americans for saving them from the Nazis. It’s only subsequent generations—who weren’t even born at the time and so have no idea what it was like or what sacrifices were made by the Allies on their behalf–who scoff at America’s overwhelming contribution that made their current lives possible. Not to mention the lone stand made by Britain against the Nazis.
“I really hate when American blows their horns about rescuing us European in WWII!”
And why is that? Why do you “hate” this? What, about this truth, bothers you so?
You forget, because you do not know, signe, that the world was not always in the form it is today, with an “internationalized” United States that has its finger–for good or bad—in every pie from Europe to Asia. There was a time when Americans were distrustful of Europeans, and disliked their incessant backbiting and infighting, like a deeply irrational and dysfunctional family that couldn’t get along even to save their own lives. But in point of fact Americans DID pity the weaklings of Europe—the Dutch, Belgians, Danes, Norwegians, etc., whose countries were raped and decimated by the Nazis. Americans pitied the innocent victims who were not in on the power plays between the “big” states of Europe… and it was, in part, for you and your small country that my father and uncles and millions of other Americans came to Europe (and the Pacific) to defeat the horrible evil that had fallen on your continent.
I hate flag wavers, too, signe. But I also hate ingrates and history-deniers.
“I was not ilke you did it out of the goodness of you heart,”
I see. So tell me what our motivation WAS, then, signe.
Self-aggrandizement? The US came away from WWII with a few military bases and some negotiated aggrements for access to airspace and emergency landing of aircraft, etc. We did not demand land or reparations. Yet the US was WELL within its right–and had MORE than the power–to wrest these things and MORE from Europe. Did it? No. Instead we set up a defense organization to stand against the threat of the USSR—a very real threat to western European freedom–which most of the western European nations joined, as co-equals—and this, in fact, set the foundation for the Union you now enjoy.
What other motivation did we have, signe? The US was attacked and it responded. Period.
“you sat at your asses and looked on until Pearl Habor!”
Wrong. For a time, just prior to and just after the start of WWII in 1939, American public opinion, yes, felt that Europe should take care of its own problems and that they should not be our responsibility. The nations of Europe–the great powers AND the little states—allowed a monster like Hitler to come to power in Germany, and lifted not one finger to stop it. In fact, some of their actions helped to foment the conditions which brought the Nazis to power. The opinion of the American people, for a time, was that we wanted no part of it—of European squabbling, hatreds, and other insanities. Which is not to say that we, as a people, were righteous or free of our own insanities. But having our own, we saw no reason to take care of yours for you.
But this opinion changed as the war pressed on. American public opinion NEVER was happy about the terrible things done by the Nazis to the small nations—the bombing of Rotterdam, for instance, or the unprovoked invasion of Denmark and Norway. And when the British were standing alone against the Germans, finally, American opinion had by that time reached a point where it was ready to enter the war. In point of fact (this is often ignored) opinion polls at the time indicated quite clearly that isolationism had passed and that Americans were willing to enter the war against Hitler.
What those of ignorant of history do not understand, however, is that America–never having been a militarist nation before this–had, up until about 1940, one of the weakest and smallest armies in the world. We were not prepared. Roosevelt knew this and enacted policies to so prepare us. So that by the time the US DID enter the war, it was ready to take on Germany—which had only just began to suffer its first setbacks in the war. But there was never any doubt, after mid-1940, that the US was GOING to enter WWII—whether we were attacked or not. What mattered was getting ready for it, to build up to the point where we COULD fight Hitler. This is a matter of record, of policy, and of HISTORY.
“And you always seem to forget about the times Europeans helped you out, like in the Revolutinary War when France spent all its money on helping you out.”
For its own purposes. France did not perform this service for the then-American colonies out of the kindness of ITS heart, in fact. It provided aid as a part of the larger war it was preparing to fight, with its allies, against the rising power of Great Britain. Our Revolution was only a sideshow (though it wasn’t to us) in that larger struggle—which is truly what served to bankrupt France—not the relatively limited amount of aid and service it provided to the Americans—which, while financially substantial in ONE sense, was only a fraction of what France spent overall in fighting Britain for its OWN reasons—moreover, what actual service it DID contribute to the Revolution came, yes, very late—though in fact it was pivotal and decisive, and we owe, to this day, a debt of gratitude to the French for it. But let’s not overstate the case, either. They helped us because it suited their larger plans to do so.
In WWII the US had only one “larger plan”: the defeat of facism in both Europe and Japan. No other. And that served ALL of us–not just the United States.
And it, along with our defense of your nation during the Cold War, made your current existence and lifestyle possible.
I don’t want unending gratitude from Europeans for this. Mere acknowledgement will do, and a LACK of stupidity and ignorance about it, on your part, would also be nice.
March 24th, 2009 at 11:08 am
I have always thought “You got another thing coming” came from the Judas Priest song.
March 24th, 2009 at 11:11 am
excellent. once again I am smarter for reading these. I have had many arguments with the “rule of thumb” comment with numerous women. Hey has anyone else ever seen “for all intensive purposes”, written?
March 24th, 2009 at 11:23 am
randall – thank you for the history lesson. i agree with what you say. i am grateful for the life i have now, but i never personally knew anyone who fought in the war to give me this life. i am thankful to them people, but not the people who didnt fight in the war. i know how that sounds, what i mean is people who werent born havent given me this life. i’m sorry, very tired and not making much sense.
the war is over and done with, there is no point in shouting about *you did/didn’t do this/that/the other* or *we did this/that/the other* seems a bit pointless.
March 24th, 2009 at 11:28 am
I think your second sentence is incorrect. It should say “tidbit” instead of “titbit.”
March 24th, 2009 at 11:46 am
kool list man but i really think its pretty damn hard to go back to speaking proper english. i dont know if anyone has ever been down in south texas but proper english isn’t even in our vocabulary. its more like tex-mex bro. but great list never the less.
March 24th, 2009 at 11:48 am
I really thought the rule of thumb was about beating your wife…one of those things that seems odd enough to be true.
The one what always bothers me is people saying “I could care less” I’ve also heard “scotch free” as in the tape.
99. I thought it was “splitting image”. i could be wrong though.
March 24th, 2009 at 11:59 am
#84–I was referring more of how the French joined the war on the(North) Americans side after their unsuccessful attempt at the Seven Years War against the British. Having been defeated against the British, and financially crippled, the French joined with the Americans–and only did so after the Americans beat the British (I forget the Battles name).
March 24th, 2009 at 11:59 am
Randall: I don’t disagree with your assessment (i.e., the counter to signe), but let us give credit where credit is due. It is a little silly for present-day Americans to take credit for the sacrifices of past heroes, now long gone. However, I hope the passion for that history remains so that those sacrifices may not be forgotten, and I commend you for that.
In regards to this list, another great success – very interesting. I would mention, though, that “begging the question” certainly has its place, regardless of its supposed bastardization. When an assumed conclusion is embedded in a claim, I beg to ask on what such an assumption is based. Begging the question is commonly used in philosophical inquiry to refer to the fallacious nature of circular reasoning.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:00 pm
6twistedbiscuits,
Though all gratitude goes to those who fought and lost their lives for others, you can’t dismiss others who through working and taxpaying, helped support the war effort as well. America spent upwards of 40% of its GDP for WWII at the sacrifice of the American taxpayer.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:01 pm
always thought it was wreak havoc, not wreck.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:02 pm
too far, randall, too far
March 24th, 2009 at 12:06 pm
Actually, I think 2 and 5 are pretty well known. I knew it was tenterhooks, and who says wrecks havoc?
March 24th, 2009 at 12:07 pm
Raj,
There are still many WWII vets still alive. I wouldn’t discount them as “long since gone” so quickly. Additionally, us present day Americans also kept most of Europe free from the Soviets, at little to no cost to the Europeans. So I think we still have some rights to point out such facts.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:08 pm
steelman – apologies for not making myself clear, i meant those who, like me, had nothing to do with the war. like people who werent born at that time
March 24th, 2009 at 12:09 pm
I’m not sure if this fits the topic exactly, but how about “Walking on eggshells?” I beleive the correct expression is “Walking on eggs.” If the eggs are already broken as in “eggshells”, then one doesn’t need to be carefull. Sir John Harington, translating Ariosto’s ‘Orlando Furioso’ from Italian in 1591, wrote: “So soft he treds. As though to tread on eggs he were afraid.” From “Dictionary of Cliches” by James Rogers (Wings Books, Originally New York: Facts on File Publications, 1985).
March 24th, 2009 at 12:10 pm
“I beg to differ” would have been another one for the list.
Interesting though JFrater. Thanks!
March 24th, 2009 at 12:13 pm
Actually, Decartes was NOT begging the question in “je pense, donc je suis” (or the more popular but never actually used in his orginial writings of Meditations on First Philosophy, of which you are quoting, “Cogito ergo sum”). but he does later in Meditations on First Philosophy (in the Third Meditation) in the form what is now known as the “Cartesian Circle” (i.e. whatever one clearly & distinctly perceives as true is true).
March 24th, 2009 at 12:15 pm
Raj:
I was, also, referring directly to my family. My father and my uncles—all combat soldiers/airmen/sailors in WWII. Dead, all of them… but not forgotten to me or my family.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:22 pm
I am from Texas and I have certainly heard Wreck Havoc, though I have never heard of Tender Hooks.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:23 pm
I have now though!
March 24th, 2009 at 12:24 pm
Randall – thank you
My father was Army Corp of Engineers, pulled out of college 1943, transport ship to England pre-Normandy, then on to France and up to Germany.
He would agree with you with all of his heart, and by the way, had a beer with him last weekend – looking pretty good for a dead man.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:25 pm
moonbeam – how did it become walking on eggshells?
March 24th, 2009 at 12:34 pm
OH shit!
Mom was a riveter in a B-25 Mitchell bomber factory, she would kick my ass if I left that out. Or her cousin who was a B-25 pilot, who was always joking with her about the rivets popping out when they were on a mission.
She had a margarita by the way.
March 24th, 2009 at 12:48 pm
“Wreck havoc” is one of my pet peeves actually, I always tell people off for saying wreck instead of wreak. -_-
March 24th, 2009 at 12:49 pm
Does anybody know where “chip on your shoulder” comes from?
March 24th, 2009 at 12:55 pm
6twistedbiscuits – I’m not sure why people say “walking on eggshells”, but I hear it said that way all the time. (Also sorry about the typo: “beleive” should be “believe”.)
By the way I’m from the US and I have heard people say “wreck havoc.” I’m not offended by Tinydancer’s comments about how Americans basterdised English. The word ‘basterdised’ or (bastardized) is often defined as: “a degradation of a language caused by the passage of time or geographical remoteness.” We do use the English language very diffently here. Sometimes when I watch movies or television filmed in the UK I can’t understand what’s being said. I need subtitles!
March 24th, 2009 at 12:58 pm
english language chanes over time whatever the country. i dont think it is bastardised, i think it is just changing. i mean, we dont talk the same way now as we did hundreds of years ago
March 24th, 2009 at 1:04 pm
I just wanted to mention that some of the items you guys are saying should be on the list are on previous lists
March 24th, 2009 at 1:06 pm
How many of you folks from the south (U.S) use the term Chesterdrawers instead of Chest of Drawers ?
Nice history lesson Randall. How we got from misconceptions about common sayings to saving Europe in WWII befuddles me.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:06 pm
ADPRO8 – http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/chip-on-your-shoulder.html
March 24th, 2009 at 1:12 pm
147. 6twistedbiscuits: I agree. Just like my post above, it’s like an elaborate game of telephone.
Also, I thought that although Britain didn’t have a “rule of thumb”, Texas did?
March 24th, 2009 at 1:18 pm
i don’t think there are any misconceptions about them but i’ve always wondered how “piece of cake” and “easy as pie” came about
March 24th, 2009 at 1:18 pm
Can someone please use “on tenterhooks” in a sentence? I’ve never heard that term before and haven’t a clue how it’s used.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:21 pm
I would like to get my tenterhooks around Anglina Jolie.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:30 pm
hilarious
March 24th, 2009 at 1:40 pm
Further annoyances;
Pacific/pacifically instead of specific/specifically.
This may be a UK thing as I haven’t heard it elsewhere.
Reach instead of retch – again may be a local mispronunciation.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
i wonder about *you want to have your cake and eat it too*. of course i want to eat the cake if i’ve got it
i dont understand that saying at all.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:49 pm
1) Nice list. But I disagree with “another thing coming” making no sense. It certainly makes more sense than “another ‘think’ coming” if you ask me! If you “think” something, but you’re wrong, then you simply should “think again”. But, if you are expecting something, and you’re wrong, then you certainly have “another thing coming”! Makes sense to me!
2) I think Wikipedia explains “Begging the question waaaaay better than you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beg_the_question
3) “Chip on your shoulder” comes from a 19th century US practice of carrying a chip of wood on one’s shoulder when you wanted to fight someone, daring others to knock it off if they wanted to fight you. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chip_on_your_shoulder
4) “I’m on tenterhooks right now. I can’t wait for the concert to begin!”
March 24th, 2009 at 1:54 pm
#135 moonbeam – really? I always thought it meant something to do with eggshells being sharp and if you didn’t tread carefully you’d cut your feet.
#153 em – “I was told I’d hear back about the job yesterday, but they didn’t call and now I’m waiting on tenterhooks.”
I think. The comments on this list have made me doubt a few things
I have some vague random thoughts about English Colonies/former colonies and the ‘bastardization’ of language, but it’s way too early to even attempt to make it clear for other people. I’ll just have another coffee I think.
March 24th, 2009 at 1:59 pm
#6: Nice mullet!
March 24th, 2009 at 2:01 pm
Lark (137): “je pense donc je suis” and “Cogito ergo sum” both mean the same thing: “I think therefore I am”. I am not sure why you think I am quoting the Latin but not the French. And for the record, while “je pense…” was the first use of the phrase by Descartes, he uses a Latin variant very similar to his French (which had already been hijacked into the Latin form we know today) in Principles of Philosophy (1644), Part 1, article 7: “Ac proinde hæc cognitio, ego cogito, ergo sum, est omnium prima & certissima, quæ cuilibet ordine philosophanti occurrat.”
The only difference is the “ego” which is obviously unnecessary in Latin and is used as a type of exclamation – as in the other famous phrase “ego sum lux mundi” (I am the light of the world” when “sum lux mundi” or “lux mundi sum” would have been quite sufficient to get the point across.
Anyway – back to the initial argument: it is begging the question because by saying “I think” he is implying that he exists – which begs the question.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:05 pm
ChickyBee is right – here is another example em: “Waiting for the results of my biopsy has left me on tenterhooks”. (ie, has left me agitated and expectant).
March 24th, 2009 at 2:09 pm
Randall (120): I thoroughly enjoyed that little history lesson – thanks.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:24 pm
TEX:
My dad flew a B-25, in fact. In the Pacific.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:24 pm
jfrater:
Anytime, pal.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:25 pm
re parrot: I would like to retract my seemly stupid comment. It was explained to me as that as a child = and as children do, I took it as fact. Thanks for clearing it up for me… she says as she blushes profusely. I am sick as a parrot for having had my childhood story debunked.. thank god for people more educated that me!
March 24th, 2009 at 2:30 pm
Thanks all
March 24th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
Thanks 6twistedbiscuits
March 24th, 2009 at 2:42 pm
I always thought #6 originated from Roman times when emperors were looked towards as the deciding factor to either spare the gladiators or have them killed. He would signal this by using a thumbs up or a thumbs down, hence rule of thumb.
March 24th, 2009 at 2:53 pm
Interestingly, in Dutch and German, Rule of thumb is called rule of fist
March 24th, 2009 at 3:05 pm
Yo sweet list. Is it just me or does anyone else hate it when people say “irregardless?”
March 24th, 2009 at 3:27 pm
Randall: Thanks for setting the record straight! Truly awesome!
I know it’s a word and not a saying, but it drives me to distraction when someone says “Expresso” instead of “Espresso”. I don’t know if it is a Brooklyn thing or if it is more wide spread but it is horrid.
March 24th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
@ Della & anyone else who thought otherwise -
i did Google ‘titbit’ while proofing & it is a variation of ‘tidbit’.
March 24th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
Correction, as this is a common mistake that really annoys me:
“if you think that, you have another think coming”
It’s actually:
“if you think that, you have another thought coming”
If you’re going to correct phrases, please do it properly.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:00 pm
the thing is now all the incorrect sayings are now correct and the original ones are never used and now meaningless/archaic. Which begs the question: does any one really care?
March 24th, 2009 at 4:05 pm
Wow. A bit of hate seems to be floating about.x
March 24th, 2009 at 4:12 pm
We all use the word “moot” incorrectly. (Myself included) It actually means “open for debate,” but for some reason we all use it to mean that something is not even worth debating.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:16 pm
I cannot stand people who say “think” instead “thing”, eg ‘Let me grab somethink’ (wtf?)
What is the world coming to? And end? Soon I hope.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:17 pm
lol – and then i type And instead of an.
shoot me now.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:31 pm
lol tinydancer.
Yeah, hate tends to “float about” when you hate on the USA.
If you didn’t notice, quite a few of us are from there.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:39 pm
I’m another who’s never heard of “wreck” and always knew it to be “wreak”. Hmm.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:52 pm
#85
> Another saying I like is “I’ll eat my hat”, which apparently began as “I’ll eat hatte” (obviously some noxious substance).
“Hatte” was a present tense of the middle English word “Hote” which meant either to command or to promise. So, any ideas what“I’ll eat hatte” might mean? I can almost grok it, but not quite.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:53 pm
the most commonly messed up “play it by year”. I wish you would had addressed this one. It is “play it by ear”. growing up on the east coast I heard it all the time. Many times from my bosses that had such a “excellent” education. More than anything on this list it bothers me the most.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:18 pm
While there may never have been any rule of thumb in British law, there certainly was one in Massachusetts Bay Colony law. In fact, I believe it’s still on the books, along with all of the revenant blue laws that prevent anything remotely fun from happening on Sundays.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:21 pm
Good job, Jamie: I’ve heard every one of these, and considered many of them cringe-worthy. (Okay, I’ll ‘fess up: I hadn’t heard of “umble pie.” And neither, apparently, has WordPress’ spellchecker.) I particularly want to scream when somebody says “wreck havoc.” Of course, I come from a land when people find repose in chaise “lounges” (and “chaise” is pronounced “Shay’s”), and attend what they call lawn “fates.” (Fetes, of course.) And these are always spoken by people who think they’re displaying the height of sophistication — a neat trick when the speaker (fifty percent of the time) did not complete high school. And you cannot correct them — not even worth the headache of trying.
But I love people who get down to the nitty-gritty of English — and consistently show a command of the language in all its rules and nuances. Linguistic guns on the list, indeed, g!
March 24th, 2009 at 5:35 pm
182. ndg: Please read post # 107 re: the origin of the saying “I’ll eat my hat”.
In fact Posters, you’d all look a lot more intelligent if you’d read the posts already ahead of yours so that you aren’t repeating questions already asked and answered.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:37 pm
hey, i searched for hatte – not hat! I was just finding a translation for a word that someone didn’t have a definition of. Ass.
March 24th, 2009 at 5:40 pm
Plus, it “probably began” leaves, to me, a fair degree of wiggle room. He certainly doesn’t prove the saying. Ass.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:04 pm
Nice list, JFrater. I, too, enjoy these types of lists. It is always fun to see the changes, even small ones, in language
and meanings.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:25 pm
ndg, so, the fact that you were too lazy to read the posts above you before you posted, makes *me* an ass?
Clueless, I must say, clueless.
You miss the point entirely and call *me* an ass.
I have to guess you are in middle school, though, so I’ll cut you some slack for being unfinished yet.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:28 pm
To those saying they’ve never heard “to wreck havoc”… It comes from “Wreck havoc, and let slip the dogs of war” Blame Shakespeare…
It’s actually still in use today, at least in Alabama.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:29 pm
Irregardless, conversate, supposebly, could care less….
All of these make my head want to explode. But the other day I saw a new one that just left shaking my head.
Some lady wrote “whole heartily” instead of “wholeheartedly” on her blog. Oh. My. God.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:30 pm
Dang. I know how to work printing presses and there are these points that I call tenterhooks. They keep the metal plate that contains the image on the roller by piercing the metal. NEVER get your finger caught on one. NEVER.
March 24th, 2009 at 6:50 pm
Now I’m not sure how many people actually say this since I’ve only heard one person say it, but apparently it’s pretty common. My friend says “Mine as well” instead of “might as well” and for some reason it just really pisses me off.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:07 pm
still don’t quite get what beg the question is.
Great list!
March 24th, 2009 at 7:16 pm
wreck havoc or wreak who cares language evolves just as everything else some for the good an some the bad it’s all relative man.
March 24th, 2009 at 7:57 pm
Uh, remembered another one;
‘Burglarized’
Is that even a word?!
March 24th, 2009 at 8:00 pm
Aah, there is a lot of comments so I dunno if this has been mentioned but. My English teacher once mentioned that the term ‘to get off Scott free’ was coined by Shakespeare. In.. Henry IV I think it was, the Scottish guy in the end was the only guy to get off without punishment, hence he got off ‘Scott free’
This could be horribly wrong ^^; if anyone can confirm or find out more information that’d be cool. Awesome list tho!
March 24th, 2009 at 8:06 pm
Pretty good. Now do you want to explain the phrase “Lickity Split”? Is a “lickity” something fast and why is it associated with a split (a split second perhaps?)
March 24th, 2009 at 8:06 pm
You have another ‘think’ coming?
How does that make any sort of sense?
Wouldn’t it be ‘thought’?
March 24th, 2009 at 8:12 pm
Panic: no – otherwise you would say to a boxer: “you have another fought coming” instead of “you have another fight coming”.
March 24th, 2009 at 8:12 pm
Just to clarify – it is referring to the action of thinking not the thought that results
It is perfectly correct English grammar.
March 24th, 2009 at 8:20 pm
Jfrater – but we don’t say ‘I have a think’ we say ‘I have a thought.’ Pretty sure it has something do with nouns and verbs (I’m not good with that stuff.) Your example is past and present tense.
And thanks to your example, I typed ‘fought’ then went back to correct it – by replacing the F with… another F. Thanks a lot
March 24th, 2009 at 8:25 pm
ChickyBee: yes we do: “I am having a think about what decision to make”. “We are having to rethink our modus operandi”, etc.
“To have a think” is the same as “to have a fight”.
March 24th, 2009 at 8:26 pm
Oops – and again to clarify – the difference is obvious if you compare the two:
“I have a thought” = “I have a plum”
Thought is a noun – think is a verb. You don’t “thought” something, you “think” something.
March 24th, 2009 at 8:32 pm
Sorry for using two comments for every answer – one would do I am sure
March 24th, 2009 at 8:34 pm
If it makes you feel a bit better, I’ve always said wreak havoc
March 24th, 2009 at 10:03 pm
that’s the least informative and stupidest list i have ever read. who says wreck havoc, rule of thumb and scot-free. You must hang out with some idiots if you hear these mistakes
March 24th, 2009 at 10:14 pm
Good list, but if you think that people will ever use these right (especially #1), you’ve got another think coming.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:16 pm
#199 Buk: I thought “Lickity Split” had something to do with sex between lesbians. I could be wrong.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:27 pm
chris: I have heard all three of the comments you mention (though wreak usually – not wreck) throughout my life. And that is mostly from people who know when to use capital letters.
March 24th, 2009 at 10:32 pm
jfrater – Ahh ok. Like I said, not good with that stuff. maybe it’s just me, cause I honestly don’t remember saying ‘a think’ about anything. Cept of course when using the saying in question. I’m gonna be freakily aware of that now.
Shifty – you owe me a new keyboard
March 24th, 2009 at 10:33 pm
Great list! The comments are even better! Grin!
March 24th, 2009 at 11:02 pm
Great list. My friends are gunna be annoyed though. Me and my need to share useless, obscure yet interesting facts with everyone.
March 24th, 2009 at 11:41 pm
No.1 – the modern adaptation has nothing to do with your explanation of it – in fact the statement comes after someone makes a statement which is followed by “Which begs the question”: This means that the question is begging to be asked in response to the statement- which is pretty much the late Mediaeval usage of the term as well!
To “wreck havoc”??? Are you sure you just didn’t make that one up to fill up the list? I’ve NEVER heard anyone use that term – - – EVER! I have always heard others say “to WREAK havoc”
Finally – why didn’t you include “The quick and the dead”???
After all most people I ahve queriesd about this phrase assume that it means ‘be quick (fast) about doing something or you’re dead’. In actual fact ‘quick’ or quicke’ is a very old Anglo Saxon word for “alive” – thus the quick and the dead actually refers to the living and the dead
March 25th, 2009 at 12:23 am
Amanda G @ 191: Will the Man said “Cry havoc and let slip …”. PhantomBanker @79 got half the quote, and you got the other half.
March 25th, 2009 at 4:54 am
177. Sniffle – March 24th, 2009 at 4:12 pm [Report Abuse]
We all use the word “moot” incorrectly. (Myself included) It actually means “open for debate,” but for some reason we all use it to mean that something is not even worth debating.
While you read the first definition of the “moot” (adj.), please read the second portion which is as follows:
“2: deprived of practical significance : made abstract or purely academic”
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/moot%5B3%5D
March 25th, 2009 at 5:50 am
Haha, I read all the comments about never hearing “wreck havoc.” And I hear it all the time, its my mother’s favorite phrase! I lived in Nevada and Utah and I’ve heard it everywhere.
March 25th, 2009 at 6:01 am
I’m surprised at 8, 5 and 2 as I’ve never heard anyone get those wrong…?
March 25th, 2009 at 10:54 am
I’ve never heard anyone say “wreck havoc” or “beg the question”.
Weird!
March 25th, 2009 at 12:25 pm
People now say “for all intensive purposes” instead of “for all intents and purposes” that really grinds my gears
March 25th, 2009 at 1:39 pm
what does “for all intents and purposes” mean? where did that come from?
March 25th, 2009 at 2:25 pm
Randall: okay, calm down. My point is actually very much like your first one: we are not the generation who fought the war, therefore I don’t see why get the right to use that as some sort of trumph over tinydancer. He/she made a comment about his/her view of the american way of speaking english, and because you did not like the comment your respons is “you don’t get to critizise my country because we once saved yours”. That to me is stupid and annoying and unfortunately not the first time I hear comments like that from Americans.
I don’t think that because you saved our asses we are not allowed to say anything negative about you. I’m absolutely sure that your comment about the people who live during the war were very gratefull for your help is true, and it is not that I don’t appreciate your grandparents helping my grandparent, but that does not mean that I’m gratefull to YOU or owe YOU any special respect because of that.
Americans are the only people I ever heard these sort of comments from – and from being form a small country, we have been helped out a lot in past – Spain or England or Sweden never makes comments like that even though they sure has saved our but.
So to sum up, I don’t have a problem with the US helping during WWII – I have a problem with people who use it in a “I helped you ungrateful bastards so you never get to say anything negative about me” sort of way.
I apologies to all the people who just wanted to read about commen saying and don’t care about all this
March 25th, 2009 at 3:07 pm
222. signe: Don’t know where your opinions come from about the USA. They were probably absorbed from the opinions of your parents and relatives. Some of mine were nurtured there also. The point is that these have influenced us, despite the true history. Randall was only pointing out the true history, without the filter from others who have had an influence on our opinions. Racism in the USA is also filtered this way. Most of the arguments brought up by “the other race” are based on opinions from people who experienced these atrocities in the past. I agree that we should base our opinions on the experiences we have had and not “pre-judge” an entire country or race based on these pre-judgements (prejudice). The reason Randall responded to tinydancer as he did was to attempt to avoid these prejudices and explain the true history. It appeared from tinydancers post that he was against the USA because of perceived slights from Americans (read USA) that were done in the past. His statements were not the true history and Randall eloquently attempted to point this out. Will the listener do more research and see if Randall is correct? Who knows. The attempt by Randall was to hope he would, and hopfefully to not pre-judge people (or anyone) based on race, creed, color or sex .
March 25th, 2009 at 3:37 pm
I always thought “beg the question” was in reference to a circular arguement, meaning has the question been answered or not? A polite way of saying shut up and quit going on already. Anyway I’m glad you included it because it most certainly does not mean “raise the question”.
March 25th, 2009 at 3:38 pm
Oh I forgot to say that although it does not beg the question the comments above do nothing to enlighten anyone So why don’t you all stick to the subject ?
March 25th, 2009 at 4:22 pm
I have to take issue with the veracity of #6. I am a Criminal Justice Major and have seen this referred to in one of my text books(unfortunately, I sold it after that term for grocery and gas money, so I can’t give a direct reference to it).
I did, however, look it up online, and came up with a pair of sites that make mention, briefly, of it. They’re seem to side with the list author, but I do recall my text book stating that this was a factual occurrence. If anyone can come up with actual concrete proof that this judge did not in fact issue the alleged opinion, I’ll withdraw my statement of course.
These sites make some mention of this idiom:
http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/rule-of-thumb.html
http://womenshistory.about.com/od/mythsofwomenshistory/a/rule_of_thumb.htm
It is my opinion that while the judge in question probably did say something to the effect of the saying in question, he probably did not mean it as an excuse for men to beat their wives. He probably intended it as a direction to what would then have been moderation, an attempt to lessen the severity of the abuse.
But, in comes the Women’s Liberation movement, and they commence to spinning everything to their own ideals to make women victims, and we all see how that turned out.
[Before anyone on this site tries to take my head off, claiming that I'm some kind of misogynistic bastard, you're right, to a point, and only to a point. I hate women who let themselves be victims. I actually applaud the women who go after their tormentors, and kill or maim them for abusing and tormenting them. But I hate those who simply let it happen to them over and over and wait for someone to come rescue them from themselves. So if you're going to try and twist what I said above, twist it the right way, please.]
March 25th, 2009 at 5:01 pm
This is my first time commenting on a list!
This list is further proof that English is one of the weirdest languages out there.
One other phrase-
1. Hunker down- means to get someplace safe during a storm. People living in Florida during the 2004 hurricane season heard this phrase every six minutes. Needless to say, we got pretty sick of it.
A perfect look at figures of speech is the cartoon “Symphony in Slang” by Tex Avery.
March 25th, 2009 at 6:14 pm
222. 6twistedbiscuits: what does “for all intents and purposes” mean? where did that come from?
****
It means “for all practical purposes”, but none of my linguistic reference books seem to have any information on source material.
March 25th, 2009 at 6:16 pm
I was enlightened.
March 25th, 2009 at 6:18 pm
I did not know Rule of Thumb had anything to do with beating wives.
March 25th, 2009 at 6:20 pm
I have always wondered about “the cat’s outta the bag”. At one point in time, did a parson have a cat in a bag and try to keep it a secret?
March 25th, 2009 at 8:22 pm
Great list! Only one error.
According to Judas Priest, it’s “you got another thing coming.”
Sorry, but the Priest has spoken.
March 26th, 2009 at 2:20 am
In response to shadow.
I never even mentioned the war as a talking point in my comment. Randall decided to add it as a quip (although very dumb it was), to make an over zealous mute point about the USA saving the UK and the rest of Europe. Lets not pretend however, that the reason for US intervention was an act of charity, it was clearly in its own interest to join the war. I don’t say this damningly, it is completely fine and ok that it had an interest in joining the war, we all did. But when some Americans say that they saved our “asses” is utterly patronising and misplaced. Things may have been drastically different considering that America never declared war on Germany (only on Japan after Pearl Harbour) and it was only because Hitler declared war on American that the Americans joined the fight against Nazi Germany.
March 26th, 2009 at 3:18 am
shadow – i understand what you say about women letting themselves be victims, but i do think you need to understand women who are victims, why they let them selves be victims. this is now the place to discuss it tho.
segue – cheers
i tried to google that and came up with nothing useful
March 26th, 2009 at 3:35 am
sorry, typo, should have been not the place to discuss it
March 26th, 2009 at 5:42 am
@6twist…- After scrolling through the comments, I see there’s another ’shadow’ here. He uses a lower case ’s’ and I use an upper case one. Might be a good idea to do that so that there’s no confusion as to whom you’re addressing.
As for your response, actually, I do understand. My mother, grandmother, and both of my sisters have all been in those types of relationships. And I told them the same thing: stop taking it and beat his @$$ already! Guess what, my baby sister did, and doesn’t take any idiot’s guff now. My other sister has not learned that lesson yet, and continues to rely on her ‘big’ brother’s reputation to keep her safe. Believe me, it’s a pain in the rear too. It’s not that hard to stop being a victim, you just have to realize that the abuser has weak points too.
Perfect example, my folks were arguing one night, and my old man slapped my mom. Next thing we heard was my old man hitting the floor after she skull punched him. He never raised a hand in anger to her again.
A man who would hit a woman is not a man – he is a coward. He knows this, and so he beats on women to try and make himself more of a man, instead of going out and beating on another man.
There, I’ve said my piece. Thank you.
March 26th, 2009 at 6:39 am
On number six with the rule of thumb, it is actually taken from chaucers canterbury tales in the millers tale, it was well known back then that millers when weighing out corn on the scales to sell would put their thumb on the scales and press down slightly to make it heavier, thus making it more expensive.
March 26th, 2009 at 9:28 am
Scott Free
In Norwegian skatt (pronounced like Scott) is the word for tax, which fits right in with your explanation. Skatt free.
March 26th, 2009 at 9:59 am
Signe:
Sorry, but your head is badly up your ass. *I* did not say ANYTHING to “tinydancer.” Check again, that was not me. I believe it was Cedestra.
I was responding to YOUR ridiculous statements… with intelligence and facts.
“Randall: okay, calm down.”
Don’t presume to tell me to “calm down.” You haven’t SEEN me worked up yet. Don’t invite it.
“My point is actually very much like your first one: we are not the generation who fought the war,”
In point of fact I’m directly connected to that generation, however, as it was my father’s generation and that of my uncles. My family, therefore, made the sacrifice of fighting in that war—they lost 3+ years of their lives defending themselves and killing the enemy–something I’m quite sure they’d rather not have done.
“therefore I don’t see why get the right to use that as some sort of trumph over tinydancer.”
Again, that was NOT me.
“He/she made a comment about his/her view of the american way of speaking english, and because you did not like the comment your respons is “you don’t get to critizise my country because we once saved yours”.”
Which, AGAIN, I did not say. Good lord. You’re making yourself look even more asinine, Signe.
“That to me is stupid and annoying and unfortunately not the first time I hear comments like that from Americans.”
Americans have no monopoly on stupidity and annoying behavior, signe. Trust me.
“I don’t think that because you saved our asses we are not allowed to say anything negative about you.”
Well, again, I never said that. In point of fact, I agree.
“but that does not mean that I’m gratefull to YOU or owe YOU any special respect because of that.”
Not to ME personally, but you DO owe it to the memory of that America that was, and to America as a CONCEPT.
“Americans are the only people I ever heard these sort of comments from”
Well, perhaps because Americans are constantly made to feel like shit by snooty Europeans and others around the world who criticize (sometimes rightly) our policies and actions, without a single thought to the fact that A) America made sacrifices and was forced to do terrible things on behalf of our European cousins more than once…. and B) that without the US, you and all your friends and relatives would today be the miserable citizens of a Russian/communist puppet state. And that sounds oh-so-jingoistic, but it IS in fact, nevertheless, 100% true.
But America is only occasionally seen fondly for this. Most of the time we’re the butt of jokes (which we can take–we’re not thin-skinned like some people we could mention) or worse, out and out hostility. So it’s not surprising that Americans sometimes want to say “f*ck you” to your ilk.
Of course, this is no defense of some of the grossly stupid things America has done over the years. But add up all our mistakes and missteps and they amount to very little indeed. Whereas 2000 years of European history has been steeped in blood, hatred, injustice and misery, with singular bits of glory and beauty. Some of it surely you can be proud of, but some of it ought to shame you horribly. We have our own shame to face. We BOTH should check the mote in our own eyes before commenting on the beam in the other person’s.
March 26th, 2009 at 10:21 am
Go America!
March 26th, 2009 at 10:22 am
Shadow – i have been in that situation! ask me how i got in it, why i couldnt get out of it, what state of mind i was in, how i eventually did and every feeling involved and then you may realise its not as simple as *beat his @$$* and *the abuser has weak points too*.
as a part of my training i will be working with people in abusive relationships, i know before i even start the training there are as many men as women and it is so not as simple as *just dont live like that*, i also know how hard it is for some one who has never ben in that situation to understand why some one would let it go on as long.
March 26th, 2009 at 10:22 am
tinydancer:
OKAY. Now I AM responding to you.
Did you not read ANYTHING I said to Signe, earlier?
And AGAIN–it was not ME who said anything to you, it was, if I’m not mistaken, Cedestra.
“Randall decided to add it as a quip (although very dumb it was), to make an over zealous mute point about the USA saving the UK and the rest of Europe.”
As I JUST said, NO I DID NOT. I only responded to signe when he/she made the same ridiculous and historically WRONG comments about American motives in WWII as YOU have just made.
“Lets not pretend however, that the reason for US intervention was an act of charity, it was clearly in its own interest to join the war.”
HOW SO, “tinydancer?” ENLIGHTEN us. Show me the facts from history that support this.
The US was attacked and it responded. That is all. YES, in a roundabout way you can characterize that as “in its own interest,” but EVERY nation acts thusly, “in its own interest” when attacked.
BUT IN FACT, “tinydancer,” as I pointed out, the US was already DELIBERATELY gearing up for a war it was NOT YET INVOLVED IN DIRECTLY *because* both the president and a majority of the American people KNEW that Hitler was evil and horrible and needed to be defeated. This MYTH of American isolationism is just that–a myth. It DID exist up to the point the war started and shortly after–but in point of fact it began to vanish around mid-1940 and the majority of Americans supported giving all aid possible to those fighting the Nazis. EVEN IN THE 30s the majority of Americans detested Hitler’s regime and, if given enough cause, would have surely agreed to fight against it. However, it was RIGHTLY seen that Europe should deal with this problem first.
But I’d be interested to hear what “other” interests the US had in joining the fight in WWII. As I pointed out to signe, the US came away with only various bases around the world and rights to air access and the like. NOTHING more. We had it well within our power to demand MUCH MORE. But the US did not.
IN FACT, the US instead instituted the Marshall Plan to rebuild and reinvigorate ruined Europe. Again, to protect it from the near-certain encroachment of the USSR. Yes, in a sense this served our interest, in that we would continue to have relationships and trade with other democracies in Europe and the West, and not be threatened by communist hegemony in Europe. But what Europe gained from this was its continued freedom and prosperity—which you enjoy today. Period.
“when some Americans say that they saved our “asses” is utterly patronising and misplaced.”
No it isn’t, not in the least. QUITE SIMPLY, if America had not existed, the world would today be mired in horror and barbarism. You like your democracy and freedom and market economy? Good, so do I. They’re not always perfect, far from it… but they’re a damn sight better than the alternative, which you would have had on your hands if America had never existed. Between Nazism and Stalinist Communism, today would be a bleakly miserable world indeed, “tinydancer,” and you damn well know it.
Nobody says you have to kiss American ass for it—in fact, we never ASKED that—something else we could have harped on, but didn’t. But enough with the snideness and denial of the historical truth. You have what you have today because America came when you needed us. Yes, we also benefited from the defeat of Nazism and the defense against Communism—but we, after all, were footing 90% of the bill, both in cash and effort. And certainly a good deal of blood.
“Things may have been drastically different considering that America never declared war on Germany (only on Japan after Pearl Harbour) and it was only because Hitler declared war on American that the Americans joined the fight against Nazi Germany.”
This is patently absurd. AS I SAID, the Roosevelt administration was forced to GEAR UP for war with Germany because at the time the US military was woefully unprepared and ridiculously weak. Japan became an unwelcome sideline that grew to dominate the issue just prior to Pearl Harbor–but Japan was in fact NEVER the focus of Roosevelt’s plans for getting into WWII. He NEVER wanted to fight a two front war, and up until the very DAY that Pearl Harbor was attacked, he and his people were trying and hoping all they could to divert war with Japan. The enemy was Hitler in their eyes, and the Japanese could be dealt with later if need be. It was ALWAYS Roosevelt’s intention to find a reason to declare war on Germany as soon as it was felt it was feasible for us to do so—it’s simply that the attack on Pearl Harbor forced his hand and then a day later Hitler DID declare war—which simply removed the decision from Roosevelt’s hands. It would have happened anyway though, and that’s historical fact.
WHY do you think it took so long for the US to join the fray against the Nazis, once war was declared? The first large scale bombings of Germany by American planes did not occur until 1943. And it was only a short time earlier that the first actual land battles occurred between Americans and Germans. The US was still not READY to take on Germany when Pearl Harbor happened—but the intent all along was to build up to it and DEFINITELY join the war against Hitler. Which is what the US finally did.
You complain about Americans shooting their mouths off—you have done the same here, without support or logic regarding the historical facts.
March 26th, 2009 at 10:38 am
I wouldn’t say we had America to thank for Nazi Germany losing WWII. I would say we have Hitler to thank for that.
Yes, the American foray into the war was timely and helped greatly, but I think what really sealed Germanys’ fate was Hitlers’ decision to attack the USSR. There was no way the German war machine could fight on so protracted and rugged a front line. (remember the german forces surrendered to the soviet army)
At the end of the day, the list of Hitlers enemies became too great
“And certainly a good deal of blood”
Not denying that but if you look at the stats, only 2.8% of casualties in WWII were american – not bad going compared to the 25% of the USSR!
Still it goes to show, do not fcuk with Britain! Or America…Or Russia…
March 26th, 2009 at 10:43 am
“that without the US, you and all your friends and relatives would today be the miserable citizens of a Russian/communist puppet state. And that sounds oh-so-jingoistic, but it IS in fact, nevertheless, 100% true”
Really?
Remember, USA and USSR weren’t the only people fighting the cold war.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:14 am
cym:
Come now. Do you really think western Europe could have stood up to Soviet Russia for a moment, on its own? In point of face, if the US had not existed, and Russia had defeated Nazi Germany on its own (almost certain to have happened, but not *entirely* certain) then the Soviets would have rolled right through to the Atlantic. That was Stalin’s goal and deepest desire. With the US blocking the way he was forced to play a game of trying to foment communist rebellion and takeover in various western states instead—and as you know, he very nearly would have succeeded in Italy, Greece, and some other states, perhaps even France.
Britain could have done nothing in the face of this and you know it. Britain could not even have continued the fight against Hitler, brave as it was, without US support finally.
No, the US didn’t just come in and win the war on its own, of course not–far from it. But it certainly made victory possible and contributed the lion’s share of the manpower (in the west) and financial burden that made it happen. And it kept Soviet Communism from sweeping across Western Europe in the end.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:21 am
There s no doubt in my mind we d all be speaking Russian here if it wasn t for the US.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:22 am
“irregardless”. even my wife uses this one.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:49 am
Meh, history is not my strong suit – it has been nearly a decade since I studied History, and we never covered WWII. I just, perhaps patriotically, feel that Americans saying or insinuating that they won the war is a little, nay very, insulting.
As to the spread of communism, we shall never know! If Stalin had immediately turned into the worlds’ next Hitler would support have remained? We don’t know. Could a dramatically increased size of USSR by conquering other european nations support communism?
True Europe was in a pretty poor state but then we had been engaged in war for the better part of a decade. The situation was similar for Russia too. Like it or not they are an intrinsic part of the European economy.
The boast that the US “kept Soviet Communism from sweeping across Western Europe in the end.” is, frankly, arrogant. You played your part, but you didn’t fight the cold war single handed. Anyway – you would not have been able to fight it if not for us. All these jet aircraft that were used after WWII were British designed. The CIA said it would pool resources to make a supersonic jet, and when we handed over our research, they said in the interests of security, the finish project would not be shared.
America is a great country with a proud history, but I feel many Americans think more of their country than perhaps they should. Still, this is probably universal.
Thats all I will say on this – I criticise trollz on commenting where they are not well hersed in knowledge; Im not going to fall into that trap. Still, its nice to debate AGAINST you rather than WITH you for a change
March 26th, 2009 at 11:49 am
@ 6twist – On that, you’re wrong, it IS that easy. It’s getting the idea cemented into your head that’s always difficult.
Hey, I grew up in a dysfunctional, abusive family. Guess what? They ALL respect me and look up to me because I was the first, and so far only, person who had the strength to tell all of them to go screw themselves and went out entirely on my own, and made a life for myself without their help.
There’s something about conquering abuse that you’ll never learn from a book and cannot teach, and that’s how to conquer yourself first. When you do that, then you can conquer anyone.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:53 am
“Britain could not even have continued the fight against Hitler, brave as it was, without US support finally”
Just to point out, wasn’t really Britain – it was the British Commonwealth – a considerably larger and richer power than just the British Isles.
March 26th, 2009 at 11:58 am
Peejee, where do you live? Russia? lol
March 26th, 2009 at 12:11 pm
Shadow – ok, so you understand that much, then why dont you udersand how hard it is to get that idea into some ones head? how had it is to change the way you live?
once you know that the abuser has weak points too its still hard to leave. in my case, the ex had gotten me to thinking there was no other life. not that i couldnt do better. that there was no better, no worse, nothing else, just the life i had with him, even with people telling me therewas a different way to do things. can you get your head round that, that people can get so messed up they put up with abuse because abuse is all they know? so its not as simple as just leave. leave to where?
in the end it was my son being born that opened my eyes. that wasnt the life i wanted for him. it still took a year to leave, because he threatened suicide then having me arrested for knapping if i did leave. so dont you dare tell me anything like you have been, that i shouldnt have put up with it or anything!
March 26th, 2009 at 12:23 pm
What most people don’t realize here is that wreak is pronounced the same as wreck. The words actually share origins and probably once meant the same thing. Which basically renders #2 moot.
March 26th, 2009 at 12:30 pm
…my english teacher is rolling in her grave. At least she would be if she were dead.
Wreak and Wreck are NOT pronounced the same?
Where did you learn that?
Tell me you arent a UK education product. Please!
March 26th, 2009 at 12:30 pm
Re: Parrot
Canacan, you shouldn’t be TOO embarrassed about this mistake, whoever told you the story, though, should have said ‘Canary’ instead of ‘Parrot’. Canaries were taken into the mines.
Also, Amanda G. – we can’t blame Shakespeare for wreck havoc, because he never wrote that. The quote is: “Cry ‘Havoc,’ and let slip the dogs of war.” Nothing in there about wrecking anything
I had a friend once that thought for years the phrase was “Moo Point”. None of us would ever tell him it was wrong… Hehe
March 26th, 2009 at 12:35 pm
That whole tenterhooks thing is definitely an americanism – never heard it in England. It’s ’cause you seem to pronounce a lot of /t/ sounds as /d/ sounds (it took me a while to work out why my brother’s American mate finds the word ‘duty’ funny – apparently he says it ‘doody’).
But yeah, I’ve always said tenterhooks.
Honestly, we give you a language
March 26th, 2009 at 12:43 pm
Honestly, I’d never heard the word ‘tenterhook’, or any derivation thereof, before I started reading this post – just goes to show that saying something is an “Americanism”, is sort of without meaning – I can barely understand people from states like Missouri, and I’ve lived in America my entire life.
March 26th, 2009 at 12:46 pm
Its strange how the language has modified over the pond. The t to d thing is wierd, true, but what about whole words?
Tap = Faucet
Rubbish = Trash
ladybird = ladybug
pushchair = stroller
diaper = nappy
Just odd.
Also the government talk about separation of state and religion and yet the pledge of alleigence talks about one nation under god
Odd.
March 26th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
^ Not sure if the left is always supposed to be British and the right American, but I’ve never heard of “nappy”.
March 26th, 2009 at 12:51 pm
Left English, Right Americanish except at the bottom where i screwed up
March 26th, 2009 at 12:57 pm
Cym, you have to realize, we have more influences on our version of ‘English’ than just the Brits. Trash, for instance, is from ‘Trask’, which is Norse in origin. American English is sort of an amalgam of a lot of different things.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:06 pm
cymbreakfastkuchen:
Honestly cym, you’re just downright silly. You admit on the one hand that you know not thing ONE about history, and the proceed to try to debate me on it… I, who was thoroughly schooled in it and made it one of the pursuits of my life. I chuckle at your silliness.
First of all, the British Commonwealth was NOT “richer and more powerful” than Britain, it was simply larger and more vastly resourced. But to this day Britain has a far larger economy than Canada and Australia put together, let alone the other members and former members of said Commonwealth.
The Commonwealth wasn’t saving your ass, Cym. Remember, all those resources from the Commonwealth would have had to find a way to get TO Britain… and that wasn’t happening until the US added its powerful naval presence into the mix, and the Uboat codes were broken as well. Britain was almost starved out of the war for a time—the Commonwealth didn’t help then.
I don’t even understand your “point” about Stalin. He was a rapacious dictator with designs on western Europe. The Russians had the power, at the close of the war, to have swept right over the lot of you if the US hadn’t stood in the way. That’s not “opinion,” that’s just simple fact.
As for the state of Europe vs. the state of the USSR at the end of the war—again, you’re clueless. Europe was in ruins and weak to the point of collapse, Cym. The USSR had been severly hurt but took it the way that giant state always took it–it absorbed it and still had the power to crush the Nazis in the East and roll right into Berlin, and then forcibly occupy all of Eastern Europe. And even then they still had more manpower and equipment on the ground in Europe than the Allies had, and could have easily conquered the West had the US not stood in their way.
Have you forgotten that the USSR was a SUPERPOWER, on a par with the US? Even a united Europe never had the power to stand up to either nation. Don’t be foolish.
“The boast that the US “kept Soviet Communism from sweeping across Western Europe in the end.” is, frankly, arrogant.”
Hardly. It’s a simple fact.
“You played your part, but you didn’t fight the cold war single handed.”
This is the height of absurdity. No, we didn’t fight the Cold War singlehandedly, but in point of fact for the first few years of it we might as well have. Europe was in a shambles until the Marshall Plan began kicking in at the end of the 40s, and even Britain was weakened severely. Only the US remained untouched by the war and strong enough to stand up to the USSR and protect the small nations of Europe until such a time as those nations regained some of their strength and were able to work with us to confront the Russians. But that did not happen right away, and even when it did the US was still by FAR the dominant partner in NATO.
“Anyway – you would not have been able to fight it if not for us. All these jet aircraft that were used after WWII were British designed. The CIA said it would pool resources to make a supersonic jet, and when we handed over our research, they said in the interests of security, the finish project would not be shared.”
Okay, no… THIS was the height of absurdity. For chrissakes, Cym, you’re just full of it.
In fact, yes, Britain had excellent aircraft engineers and did a hell of a job with aviation. But let’s not overstate the case and pretend the US “stole” jet technology from the UK. That’s outrageously stupid.
There was nothing “magical” or miraculous about jet technology, and in fact the US had a jet program, separate from but concurrent with, the UK’s. Yes, for a time the Brits were ahead of us, and the Germans were ahead of you. Big whoop. If you don’t have the industrial capacity to manufacture a technology in mass quantities that are needed, you’re little better off than if you never had the technology at all. And Britain DIDN’T have the industrial capacity at the time.
Nobody said that the US was “smarter” or better than the UK. Simply more powerful, by leaps and bounds. Regardless of engineering genius (which the Brits always had, in excess) one doesn’t face a vastly more powerful enemy without an equally powerful friend on your side. The US was that powerful friend, and without it even Britain couldn’t have stood up to the Soviet Union, and could not have been victorious against Nazi Germany.
It’s got nothing to do with “superior fighting prowess” or smarts or capability. The US is no better than the UK in these matters. It’s simply a matter of sheer brute power and resources, and industrial capacity. The US then and today is a far larger economy and military power. It alone made it possible for Western Europe to survive after WWII. Period.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:17 pm
“richer and more powerful”
Never said it was more powerful. Come now Randall, if you are going to quote, quote correctly. What I said was “a considerably larger and richer power than just the British Isles.”
As to the jet, I take your point. My own was that your government promised ours a share of the spoils and then went back on its word – but hey thats politics.
I’m not going to debate you on this – as we have both recognised, I am not an authority. It is foolish for me to try – give me science any day of the week!
I AM an authority on arrogance though. I have it in spades. So does most of america. You live in your bubble, I will live in mine. We can both be assured that the other is completely wrong
At the end of the day, the currently waning american empire will not measure up and hasnt measured up to the British Empire at its height (thankfully for all concerned – my god we were ruthless borstards [misspelled for moderation])
Both of our great nations are obsolete, my friend. This is Chinas’ era now. Surely we can agree on that
March 26th, 2009 at 1:18 pm
@Regnak – Sorry, you’re right, Americanism wasn’t the right term. I meant it is an error that only occurs under an American accent, due to the substitution of the voiced /d/ for the voiceless.
@Randall — I’m sorry: yes, you helped us. But it wasn’t out of some noble sense of right or wrong – it was because the Japanese foolishly bombed Pearl Harbour and riled you. That’s like saying if a psycho kicked a lion in the nuts, the lion was somehow a hero for waking up and mauling him.
Secondly, I would point out that we’d been embroiled in the war for some time before you got involved, so you kind of came in at an advantage (having not already been at war for years).
Please, can you show the Allies the respect deserved by all who fought for sanity and peace in what was the worst war ever witnessed by this world, and not be so chirlish as to claim credit for a joint accomplishment.
Also, anecdote time. I was in California last Summer, and my Dad parked the car. Little did we know you had to park facing a certain direction there (maybe just that town, don’t know), but a couple of middle-aged passers-by said, loudly to “themselves”, “Come on you Brits, we won the war, you could at least park right”. DICKS. Of course, being British, it was all we could do to mutter amongst ourselves and watch with impotent rage as the two shuffled their obese frames into the distance.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:19 pm
262 – I never said the only influence on your version of english is Britain. What is it with this list and misquotes and misunderstanding!? I merely said it was odd how the language has deviated from its roots.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:30 pm
btw…I had one that I forgot to share for this list.
“That is the crutch of the problem.” … I about fell over. It’s crux. I couldn’t believe someone sent that to me.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:35 pm
listenhere:
You know, “listen,” I’m not going to repeat myself endlessly. I already addressed the nonsense you’re spouting when “tinydancer” and “signe” said the same things way up above. (Take a look, and read my responses).
The US was NOT (contrary to myth) just lying around doing nothing, sleeping while the world was going to hell. We were in fact gearing up for war with Hitler and would have entered the fight with him NO MATTER WHAT at the proper time—when we had the strength to do so. This was Roosevelt’s policy and plan, and after a fashion it was the sentiment of a majority of the American people.
They were angered and sickened by the horror and injustice Hitler was perpetrating on Europe—and only spurred into action by Pearl Harbor. Pearl Harbor only forced the issue earlier than Roosevelt and his planners had intended. That’s all.
As for this silliness of “advantage”.. from whose perspective are you speaking? I take it you’re a Brit? Britain EVEN BEFORE WWII did not have anywhere NEAR the economic might or industrial capacity of the US. Please let’s not get silly about this. Britain is a great nation and I love it. But on the scale we’re talking about it was always small and bound to be shunted aside by the superpowers.
I have not claimed credit for the joint accomplishment. It WAS a joint accomplishment. *I* am merely fighting against the incorrect notion that A) the US had some half-sinister “ulterior motives” for fighthing in WWII–which has been suggested here… and B) that the US wasn’t responsible for providing the strength and resources that ultimately WON that war along with her allies, and stood up to the USSR while Europe recovered.
FOR THESE, the US should be looked on fondly, and with none of this snarky BS that we hear from time to time, such has appeared in this thread.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:37 pm
that last should have read, “and NOT only spurred into action by Pearl Harbor.”
March 26th, 2009 at 1:39 pm
265 Anecdote
Unfortunately (and stereotypically) americans are ignorant. FFs approximately 40%-50% of the public accepts a biblical creationist account of the origins of life!
They probably believe that WWII started in 1941!
Fortunately intelligent americans do survive the political and education cull and make it to LV – Randall amongst them.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
“FOR THESE, the US should be looked on fondly, and with none of this snarky BS that we hear from time to time, such has appeared in this thread.”
I agree with the sentiment. However, the US has committed some major faux pas and seriously damaged its internation reputation in the 60+ years since the end of WWII.
You cannot deny that US foreign policy (particularly of the last 8 years) has alienated your country and caused it to be looked on with derision, suspicion and, in some extreme cases, hate.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:44 pm
Out of curiosity, do the american people still support the wars in iraq and afghanistan?
March 26th, 2009 at 1:44 pm
that should read international reputation, not internation reputation…wots an internation anyway?
March 26th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
272. cymraegbachgen87: I don’t…I did for about a minute but not anymore. Its not going anywhere.
March 26th, 2009 at 1:59 pm
cym:
““richer and more powerful”
Never said it was more powerful. Come now Randall, if you are going to quote, quote correctly. What I said was “a considerably larger and richer power than just the British Isles.””
Uh, yeah. Okay. That’s a lot different. Sure. (?!)
The point is still there. Britain was dying on the vine DESPITE the Commonwealth, before the US got into the war. The Commonwealth was not going to save Britain. Period. Canada and Australia did not have the might to come and save the mother island.
“At the end of the day, the currently waning american empire will not measure up and hasnt measured up to the British Empire at its height (thankfully for all concerned – my god we were ruthless borstards [misspelled for moderation])”
Well yes, the British WERE ruthless bastards… but how do you mean, that the US has not measured up? What absurdity is this?
To begin with, we speak of the “American Empire,” but in actual fact there isn’t one. The US, it’s true, exploits and uses like an empire, but it holds very little “colonial” territory, and except for a brief bout of it in the late 19th century/early 20th, has eschewed that nasty business. Hypocrites we may be–as you are and were, as we all are–but we like to at least pay lip service to the notion of self-determination and independence for other people. Our “empire” is largely economic and while we do back it up with a vast military, it isn’t quite the same as the way business was done back in the “good old days” of the actual empires.
But the vast ECONOMIC empire we’ve built… I mean, come on… that isn’t anything to sniff at.
And of course… another way of looking at it is that we ARE a continuation of the British Empire. As Joseph Campbell said, “after WWII the US rejoined Britain in its conquest of the planet.”
“Both of our great nations are obsolete, my friend. This is Chinas’ era now. Surely we can agree on that”
OH, I’m not so sure about that. I joke about it sometimes, but really, you know… we were saying the same thing about Japan 20-30 years ago. Of course China is far larger and more resource-laden, and isn’t going away no matter what. But I’m not so sure that any of us are “obsolete” and that China is destined to replace us. I don’t think it’s so simple. Setbacks aren’t the end. And China is far from all-powerful and still has a LONG way to go.
March 26th, 2009 at 2:05 pm
shutup.
.
March 26th, 2009 at 2:08 pm
cym:
“I agree with the sentiment. However, the US has committed some major faux pas and seriously damaged its internation reputation in the 60+ years since the end of WWII.
You cannot deny that US foreign policy (particularly of the last 8 years) has alienated your country and caused it to be looked on with derision, suspicion and, in some extreme cases, hate.”
Oh, I’d agree TOTALLY with this.
March 26th, 2009 at 2:11 pm
259. cymraegbachgen87: Its strange how the language has modified over the pond. The t to d thing is weird, true, but what about whole words?
Tap = Faucet
Rubbish = Trash
ladybird = ladybug
pushchair = stroller
diaper = nappy
****
My mum being Australian, and having spent part of my childhood there, my own language is a jumble of “there” and “here”.
Tap, I’ve always said tap. I still say tap. Everyone seems to understand what I mean, so there’s no need to change.
Same with rubbish.
I remember very clearly calling ladybirds ladybirds, but getting teased dreadfully when we returned to the States. I finally gave in on that and several other words:
boot, bonnet, pushchair, pram…some words I only used at home, pip, for example.
It was all very confusing for a young child.
March 26th, 2009 at 2:14 pm
“To begin with, we speak of the “American Empire,” but in actual fact there isn’t one”
I was going to retort, but you did it yourself:
“But the vast ECONOMIC empire we’ve built”
Which, correct me if I’m wrong, is in dire straits? The dollar tumbling in value, commodity prices dropping dramatically, house prices down, other countries calling for a universal currency to replace the dollar; yes we may scoff now but the french scoffed at the euro…(yes I know this is universal, but according to the news it is being keenly felt in the US)
“it isn’t quite the same as the way business was done back in the “good old days” of the actual empires.”
No I agree…the modern way is far more ruthless, far reaching and destructive
(I joke but I think there is an element of truth there?)
I really like the J. Campbell quote – I will have to remember that.
I suppose my parting comment was a bit premature. But I happily admit that Britain has yet to regain its military power (although I would put us in the top 5?) and thanks to the economic crisis, is no longer a leader in production or fiscal areas. We have collapsed to a service and intellectual economy – not a bad thing per se but far from our glory days.
As to Japan – I would say that side of the world dominate the globe. Just look at the products that come out of it! If Japan was wiped off the map tomorrow, where would we get our high end electronics?
China is far from all powerful, and is sitting on a potential time bomb that is its own people; if it cannot sort the economy, infrastructure and agriculture. (A massive feat but if any country could do it I would place money on China.) But it controls the region and is only getting more powerful. I wonder if the world is going to shift from a western centred, to an eastern centred one? Something to think about, and with the current regimes in that part of the world, something to worry about.
“but we like to at least pay lip service to the notion of self-determination and independence for other people”
With current scandals in the UK about torture, the US’ history with G. Bay, oil rights from iraq for decades, it seems more lip service than anything else. But I DO agree with you. At least our nations strive for freedom for others, which is more than can be said for many countries and regimes
March 26th, 2009 at 2:15 pm
cym:
“Out of curiosity, do the american people still support the wars in iraq and afghanistan?”
Well you should know—I mean, this is no secret. The war in Iraq has been unpopular for the last three years. (or longer). Obama’s election to the presidency was based, in part, on the unpopularity of that war. It was wrong from the start and people came to know it, or at least they came to be fed up with it.
Afghanistan is another matter, and you should know that there’s a great difference between the two. Afghanistan is a problem for ALL of us, not just the US. The Taliban was supporting terrorism aimed not just at the US, but at the west in gneneral. Al Qaeda isn’t just our problem, it’s yours too.
But the way the US handled Afghanistan under Bush.. yes, stupid and ineffective. And the way the Bush administration has handled the “war on terror”—stupid and ineffective.
People are getting more behind the idea of discussion and reproachment with the Muslim world, I think, yes.
March 26th, 2009 at 2:16 pm
I have to say, I havent been stretched this much by YEC or other fundies! I actually have to concentrate – damn you for actually KNOWING what you’re talking about.
March 26th, 2009 at 2:16 pm
The use of “action” as verb (eg. “Please action this.” as opposed to “Please do this”/ “Please make sure this gets done”) makes me want hack my wrists open with a blunt pencil.
@232 Lord Nick:
You can read about the “most likely” explanations for “lettign the cat out the bag” here:
http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/let-the-cat-out-of-the-bag.html
March 26th, 2009 at 2:18 pm
I know Afghanistan is a completely different kettle of terrorists – was just wondering on what the consensus was. There have been demonstrations here at the funerals of soldiers killed in A.stan as well as at welcome home parades.
It annoys me, people come to our country to live within our freedoms and abuse them by doing stupid things like that!
March 26th, 2009 at 2:23 pm
“Well you should know—I mean, this is no secret”
Well, yeah I suppose. But then you look at the amount spent on this war and just wonder, particularly in the current economic climate, why aren’t we seeing the same demonstations on the news ala Vietnam? still I can’t compare – that was many years before I was born
I also despair of coming across americans slating obama – throughout the world he is seen as a positive force and yet, both on LV and elsewhere, he is constantly berated and people are already asking for him to be thrown out of office!?
Is it only in the US where he is seen as a bad thing?
March 26th, 2009 at 2:23 pm
cym:
I think Afghanistan got rolled up into the anger people felt the world over about Iraq… which is Bush’s fault. It’s a shame, because Afghanistan was always the real problem, and it won’t just go away. We can all pull out and go home, but it’ll happen again.
Something needs to be done in that part of the world, but I’ll be damned if I know what it is. Force only works for so long though, that’s obvious.
March 26th, 2009 at 5:26 pm
I hear the expression ‘eats like a bird’ – it-it’s really a
fals-fals-fals-falsity. Because birds really eat a tremendous lot. But -I-I don’t really know anything about birds. My hobby is stuffing things. You know – taxidermy.
March 26th, 2009 at 5:43 pm
cym, I’m awfully glad you recognize a few Americans as being intelligent. I’ve worked hard to be one of those few, and I hope it shows. :-/
March 26th, 2009 at 6:28 pm
Guy mention some more common mistreatments of the English language, such as the phrase “The prodigal son returns.” prodigal does not insinuate prodigy or prophecy, but rather it means wasteful. Ah ha “The wasteful son returns” is now more appropriate!
March 26th, 2009 at 8:24 pm
My favourite demonstration of the (real) begging of a question comes from Black Books, where Bernard doesn’t want to do his taxes. When asked why, he yells, “Because you can stick it up your arse!”
March 26th, 2009 at 8:50 pm
THANK YOU. My head almost explodes every time people say “begs the question.” How can so many people be so wrong about a phrase?
March 26th, 2009 at 10:58 pm
All I can say is ‘one off’. One of the most annoyingly mispronounced phrases and one that everyone refuses to say properly. It is clearly derived from ‘one of a kind’ and therefore should be ‘one of’. Seriously, in what way does ‘one off’ make sense? And why do people refuse to listen to my logic?
March 26th, 2009 at 11:25 pm
291. bslihqoi -
“one off/one-off” means an odd or singular object (or, rarely, occurrence). it comes form the world of manufacturing.
imagine a production line and you’re working quality control, suddenly you see one which is “off,” malformed, or unique, when they’re all supposed to be identical, AKA “a one-off” as opposed to a “one-of-a-kind.”
it also came from the concept of “off the mould” in manufacturing. a prototype that was the only cast “off” of its mould fits this term perfectly. “when they made you they broke the mould” and so on.
for more go here:
http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-one4.htm
google my friend, know it, love it, use it:
March 27th, 2009 at 1:54 am
A British epression I hate (and I am British), is one that’s often used to teach people a lesson after their carelessness causes them grief – “That’ll teach you to walk out into moving traffic!” (you can substitute a similarly life-endangering act here). Surely that ought to be “That’ll teach you NOT to walk out into moving traffic!”!
March 27th, 2009 at 3:21 am
293 – similarly – people saying “That’ll learn you”
What?
No it won’t!
A pet peeve of mine up with someone asking “Can I lend a pen?”
No thank-you, I already have one.
March 27th, 2009 at 4:54 am
oh cym-
“can i lend you?”
well, when i worked at a coffee shop back in 2000 my co-workers (they’d just left high-school, i was 20) always said “can you borrow me $20? (a dollar, whatever)” instead of “can you lend me a dollar (or whatever)?” and it was so infuriating!
“can you borrow me a dollar?” NO! but i could lend you one….
and this was in chicagoland USA.
March 27th, 2009 at 5:08 am
WRECK HAVOC? WTF? Everyone says wreak. You’d have to be some kind of faggot to say wreck, as it makes no sense.
March 27th, 2009 at 5:17 am
A lot of the youngins are like that. I suppose they think it sounds kinder but it annoys me. In college, I had a few friends who would ask “You wanna drive me to [location]?” No, I’m not especially keen on wasting gas money but if you ask correctly I may be amenable to driving you where you need to go rather than feel a sudden desire to drive you somewhere for the sheer pleasure of chauffeuring your ass around.
March 27th, 2009 at 5:21 am
296. gabi319 : Youngins? How old are you Gabi? You’re not ancient like Anon are you? Because I vaguely remember you telling me your age somewhere – probably Creationism discussion, screw going back throught that mess – and I didn’t think you were THAT old
March 27th, 2009 at 5:31 am
297. Mark-
since you asked…
how old are you?
i’m 29 as of march 15 ‘09, but i’m very happy to be able to hold a rewarding conversation with “ancients” like anon. so your question made me curious…
March 27th, 2009 at 5:38 am
298. lo : Ok, well this is going to make me seem like a whiney teenager. I’m 16, but in my defence my jokes about Anon being old are just that, jokes. I call my parents “old” – such a great term, don’t you think? – too (they’re 46 and 50 this year) it’s all fun and games. I don’t actually believe someone is past their used-by when they hit 31 or anything like that, but I do believe that musicians’ quality is going to go downhill very quickly after the age of 27
I too enjoy a convo with Anon, but I haven’t really crossed paths with the gray-man lately so I guess I’ll have to go looking for him sometime soon. Then again, he is rather verbose so I’d better do it when I have a lot of time on my hands
March 27th, 2009 at 5:47 am
mark-
i think we have a list here of “the curse of 27″ for musicians, somewhere.
anyway LV is a playing ground for all ages -a big part of what makes the comments so awesome
p.s. to cyn and mom, et al.- i just accidentally hit the “abuse button” PLEASE disregard, it was some kind of mouse error here on my laptop. i didn’t mean it! (i clicked back onto the screen after stepping outside and saw “thanks for reporting abuse…”)
March 27th, 2009 at 5:49 am
Silence youngin!
Wow that makes me feel old!
March 27th, 2009 at 5:57 am
dammit I thought I got 300!
Why can I never get a nice round milestone number.
Anons got a 2000
LV hates me.
March 27th, 2009 at 6:00 am
no cym. LV does love you
March 27th, 2009 at 6:03 am
Mark,
I am 25 years, 1 week and 1 day old
So yes, old enough to call you youngin’ and it still applies to my college friends. There seems to be a wide cultural divide between those born in ‘84 & before and ‘85 & later. I brought up the mixtape in conversation at one point and one of the ’85s said “What’s a mixtape?” I was about ready to head to the senior citizen’s early bird special after I finished weeping over the “age” discrepency between my younger friends and I.
Well, damn…there’s comment number two. The pants I referred to in the Creationist list will have to be sacrificed…
March 27th, 2009 at 6:05 am
Easy gabi. You know what I can do with “exploding head” – imagine what I will do with sacrificing pants!
Of course this is another discrepancy between US and UK
Here ‘pants’ are homer simpson style y-fronts. Less than sexy, but if anyone can pull of wearing them, gabi, its you.
March 27th, 2009 at 6:07 am
lo,
Then damn it all why does it raise my hopes and then repeatedly beat them against the jagged rocks of failure!?
And yet I come back for more.
Hi, I’m cymraegbachgen87, and I’m a ListVerseholic.
March 27th, 2009 at 6:24 am
gabi-
i still have some “mix tapes”!
one of my best friends from freshmen year of college and i traded some meaningful mix tapes back in the day (it was 1998) and he sent me a mix tape (by “snail mail”!) back in 2002 just for the memories. yeah, we were both hooked into the mp3 scene by then (he was a musician getting a masters in writing at NYU), but getting a psychical “mix tape” -on cassette- at that point in time meant something in and of itself!
i still own a tape-playing “boombox” just for the purpose of hearing these old mix tapes. i also have an audio setup that plays the stereo sounds from my dvd/cd player, radio, and -yes- vinyl record player! dose this make me some kind of “hipster” tied to the technologies of the past? who knows. i know i don’t care..
March 27th, 2009 at 9:25 am
This probably explains why “rule of thumb” would come up in a legal textbook. There was a historic political cartoon referencing it and that’s probably where the myth of “you can beat your wife if the implement’s not bigger than a thumb’s width” orignated:
Although British common law before the reign of Charles II permitted a man to give his wife “moderate correction”, no ‘rule of thumb’ (whether called by this name or not) has ever been the law in England.[4][5] Nonetheless, belief in the existence of such a law can be traced as far back as 1782, the year James Gillray published his satirical cartoon Judge Thumb. The cartoon lambastes Sir Francis Buller, a British judge, for allegedly ruling that a man may legally beat his wife, provided that he used a stick no thicker than his thumb, although it is questionable whether Buller ever made such a pronouncement.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_thumb#Origin_of_the_phrase
March 27th, 2009 at 3:23 pm
the only place I’ve ever seen wrek havoc is here
March 27th, 2009 at 3:55 pm
Just a note on who messes up the English language the most. I think we’re all pretty much equally to blame on this one.
I am an Australian living in England and I have spent some time in America and Canada in my past. Mangling language seems to be a function of education, not geography. Intelligence seems to have very little to do with it either. I have seen highly intelligent people using some of these phrases. It’s a case of “monkey see, monkey do”. If you see people saying “wreck havoc” (or, rather, if you hear them) then you will learn to say that yourself.
Londoners seem to be some of the most prolific at making up new words or combining existing words in strange and beautiful ways to create dialects that are unintelligible to someone who grew up as little as of ten miles away. Strangely enough, Londoners are the people who are physically closest to the Queen whose language it is. (i.e. The Queen’s English)
There was a list of examples of uses of the phrase “Wreck havoc” posted above by Kat in comment 78. Two of the websites were English, one was Irish, one was Australian and one was American. By this statistic (admittedly, a small sample size) the English are the worst at their own language by a factor of 2 to 1. I’m embarrassed to see an Australian website in that list but in our defence, I’d never heard of it.
One thing that bugs me that often comes up in discussions about language (and indeed, has already come up in this discussion) is when people say “Language evolves, get over it.” The trouble for me is not that language evolves – I understand that and I see it as part of the rich tapestry – the trouble is that our language is evolving too quickly. It is possible (and is happening) for a new dialect to form within the space of a single generation and for parents to have trouble understanding their kids.
Mostly, this “evolving” is a form of entropy where a word that has a relationship to other, similar words becomes a new, misheard or mispronounced word that has no relationship to any other words. An example is “tenterhooks” becoming “tenderhooks”. The original word had a meaning, even though few people knew what they were. The new word has no meaning and is just another in a long list of words we have to memorise. “Wreck havoc” and “free reign” are a different form of entropy where no new words are created but some meaning is lost from the phrase.
This kind of “evolution” means that our language is losing its structure and is becoming more difficult to learn… and I don’t like it.
And lastly, my personal favourite: “This endangered animal is very unique.”
March 27th, 2009 at 4:02 pm
On a more current topic, I saw a study once which showed that musicians’ brains reach their peak at the age of 70 whereas mathematicians reach their peak at somewhere in their early 20s. I’m not sure whether that was referring to composing or performing. My aged brain (I’m 29 in three months) cannot recall the precise details or even where the study was done.
Oh, and another common badly mangled phrase: “You have peaked my interest.”
March 27th, 2009 at 9:46 pm
301. lo : Yeah, it is a playing ground for all ages, but that doesn’t mean that all of the youngins are as intelligible with their comments as me. Hence the “teenagers are immature morons” generalisation which I try – with mixed success – to stay clear of.
305. gabi319 : Yay for March babies, Black Friday b-days are sweet. Just one question, what’a a mixtape….
311. Dave : Australian? Melbourne, Sydney, Adelaide whereabouts? I’m from regional QLD and I can tell you that we have so much fun teasing any South Australians we can get our hands on – and Victorians for that matter – gotta love accents
March 28th, 2009 at 9:11 am
NEVER heard anyone say “Wreck” havoc!
March 28th, 2009 at 9:23 am
120. Randall: I knew if I flirted with you enough, it would pay off in the long run.
I think…hmmm.
128. raj, et al: My comment about British people disliking the Americans was tongue-in-cheek (see most of astraya’s comments on previous lists for an understanding of tongue-in-cheek). It’s really silly that people make grandiose comments about other people (the original “Americans butcher the English language). So, I took a jab back. I know sarcasm is difficult to find on the internet and beyond some people’s comprehension, but do try to keep up with me. I’ll even give you a hint: frickin’ smiley face at the end!
March 28th, 2009 at 9:45 am
The word “scot” in scot free, if of Norwegian origin, I say it must come from the Norwegian word “skott” meaning walls. We still use it today about “walls” on a ship. So scot free means you did not get walled in…
March 28th, 2009 at 12:05 pm
I knew all of these except #1. Go figure!
Ya learn something every day. Great list!
March 28th, 2009 at 3:30 pm
Thank you… So much… For telling the truth… of BEG THE QUESTION.
March 29th, 2009 at 1:21 am
Dave,
First its Queens’ English. You’re saying the Queen is English…duh! Second, Received Pronounciation (or Q.E) is nowhere near London in its origin. You also have to further differentiate between Londoners and true Cockneys.
“different form of entropy” lol. Seeing as entropy is a universal concept in thermodynamics, there cannot be a different form of entropy. Indeed your coining of this term is just what you are complaining about! Entropy is about disorder and randomness. Please correct me if I have misunderstood your post
Change of language over time is fun! It has been changing at this fast rate for at least the last two centuries. Read ‘A Diary of a Nobody’ It is a social commentary of the late 1800’s. It points out the differences in language between father and son on many occasions, along with major differences between fashion and work ethic
March 31st, 2009 at 1:07 am
never once heard someone say “to wreck havock” only “wreak havoc”.
April 1st, 2009 at 8:28 am
i knew perfectly well what all the phrases meant and im only 14 years old! im english so that helps as almost every phrase was english-origin. you must have written this article for americans
maybe next you should try to explain “irony”, God knows americans need to learn what that is
April 1st, 2009 at 2:54 pm
321. this_sucks:…next you should try to explain “irony”…
****
God knows you have mastered sarcasm (the lowest form of wit).
April 2nd, 2009 at 12:37 am
I know I’m beating a dead horse here, but I’ve never heard someone say “Wreck havoc”. I’ve always said “wreak havoc”.
April 3rd, 2009 at 1:24 pm
another one i heard my partner use the other day was ‘to cut off your nose despite your face’ which made me laugh as it should be (i hope you already know) ‘to cut off your nose to spite your face’
April 3rd, 2009 at 1:48 pm
st0ner: “For all intensive purposes.” always amuses me.
April 3rd, 2009 at 3:12 pm
Stoner, maybe you should try to find a new girlfriend, one that isn’t mentally retarded?
April 6th, 2009 at 9:41 pm
You did such a great job that some douchebag plagiarized you. http://dcpes.com/?p=89
April 8th, 2009 at 7:15 am
I live in a small town in Ohio. I have heard many people around here say wreck havoc.
April 15th, 2009 at 3:57 am
I was always led to believe that the full phrase was ‘as sick as a parrot with a rubber beak’ which would obviously be quite a pissed off bird.
Things which bug me…
Posterity/prosperity ‘I’m saving it for prosperity’ !!!
Grisly/grizzly
Hordes/hoards
Specific/pacific
I heard somebody on one of those hideous daytime chat shows (Trisha or something) say that their situation was “heart rendering”. That would be unpleasant if it were true!
April 15th, 2009 at 9:57 am
Another idiom which is improperly used is “None the wiser”. People use it believing no one is wiser, when it actually means they are no wiser than they were before.
April 16th, 2009 at 1:36 pm
I think this is an excellent list, also providing some interesting insight to the origins of some of these phrases. While I agree that some of these are misused, I have to contend that they shouldn’t be used. I think, as with all languages, they’re shaped by the speakers, and the fact that some of them have changed from meaning makes the modern meanings no less accurate.
Of course, you could have meant this and I missed it :-p
April 16th, 2009 at 11:43 pm
i’m not sure who says wreck havoc instead of wreak… blah blah you’ve heard it all before. But actually my pet peeve with most people is them saying “lol” in actual conversation! if it’s funny, why not just laugh?
And also i don’t say free reign i say free rein, i’ve never really thought about it as reigning over someone…
April 21st, 2009 at 4:28 pm
Another one who has never encountered ‘tender hooks’ or ‘wreck havok’.
My pet peeve is people using the word ‘draw’ instead of ‘drawer’! It’s a chest of DRAWERS not DRAWS!
April 24th, 2009 at 7:13 am
[citation needed]
April 24th, 2009 at 7:14 am
I love lists such as these, but hate hate HATE the hastily Googled tacky clip art. This list would be 100% improved if they were removed.
April 24th, 2009 at 4:29 pm
I looked, in vain, for “the hastily Googled tacky clip art”. Where was it located?
April 24th, 2009 at 5:56 pm
Tiny dancer-
I am an American and I assure you that I have only heard a few of these misspoken. Sadly it is not us getting everything wrong, but you, for making assumptions about us. Great for you for being such a racist and bigoted asshole.
April 24th, 2009 at 6:30 pm
I’m an American also, carnivore, and like you I have not heard these these misspoken in my family or group of friends and co-workers. I wonder where Tiny Dancer gets her information? Perhaps from the lowbrow sit-com where, I understand, the use of proper language is not always displayed.
April 25th, 2009 at 4:14 pm
I think you made up “wreck havoc” so you’d have 10 sayings.
April 30th, 2009 at 4:44 pm
“The Proof is in the pudding” is a phrase I’ve never quite understood–Also I’ve heard people say “I could care less” in stead of “I couldn’t care less–I’ve never understood the first one–Makes no sense–
April 30th, 2009 at 5:07 pm
340. smithstar15: The actual phrase is “The proof of the pudding is in the eating”, which can be extrapolated to mean that the result of any given action, is proof of it’s effectiveness.
That’s all I’ve got.
May 4th, 2009 at 7:19 pm
Oh, so it’s not “For all in tents and porpoises”.
May 10th, 2009 at 10:58 am
Hey, #20, P! I’m from Sweden too, and I believe that the list’s author was right about the derivation of “scot-free”. Consider, for instance, the common Swedish word “förskott” (English-only speakers: Think of it as meaning “pre-scot”) as used in “förskott på löning” (in English that is “advance payment of wages”), and you’ll see how it all makes sense. “Skatt” meaning “taxes” is probably derived from the word “skatt” meaning “treasure” as the taxes were the source of the King’s treasure. But I suppose the words may have a common root, I’ll give you that.
May 12th, 2009 at 6:55 pm
Unfortunately for the “listmaster” his “common” sayings aren’t even common. Anyone in the intelligent community uses the phrases correctly, ie free rein, another think coming, tenter hooks.
Perhaps the “listmaster” should do a little more research about actual sayings that are used commonly, instead of sayings that .1 percent of the population uses.
May 12th, 2009 at 8:36 pm
Nabokov: perhaps you could demonstrate a few phrases that you think are suitable for this list.
May 13th, 2009 at 11:47 am
Do I smell teen-spirit?
May 22nd, 2009 at 8:11 pm
I hate when people say “You want to have your cake and eat it too.” Of course I want to have my cake and eat it too. But, isn’t the correct saying, “You want to eat your cake and have it too,” implying that you can’t eat your cake and still have it?
May 25th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
Wow. Good list, and lots of interesting comments. I tried to read through all the comments but became frustrated by the tirades. Couldn’t find any mention of my pet peeve:
“Cut the mustard….”
Greetings to all from Vermont USA
May 27th, 2009 at 11:36 am
Do you have a source for the idea that the phrase is actually “another think?” “Another thing” makes much more sense grammatically, and makes equal sense logically, so all thinks being equal, I’m sticking with another thing.
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:54 pm
Ianrey, read my previous comment #174:
“if you think that, you have another think/thing coming”
It’s actually:
“if you think that, you have another thought coming”
“Think” isn’t grammatically correct which I’m sure we will all agree. “Thing” doesn’t make any sense.
If you have a thought about something that is obviously incorrect, then you should think about it again. That is the whole point of the phrase.
Please, everyone, try to engage some form of intelligence, otherwise you’re destined to be a traffic warden.
June 26th, 2009 at 4:11 pm
erm, congrats! hehe
i’m bi myself… so much variety that way, it’s like being at a pick ‘n’ mix
August 9th, 2009 at 8:34 am
well jeeze i kinda knew #2 was wreak havoc. ive NEVER heard WRECK havoc!
August 20th, 2009 at 1:44 am
Very nice list. I’m pleased that you included “beg the question” because (as a prior Philosophy major) that one drives me mental. I do think you should also have included the very common American habit of saying “I could care less” which is a particularly annoying one!
August 26th, 2009 at 12:03 am
I read something on the internet mere minutes ago and instantly thought “I should post this on that LV list.”
Did you know that wrecking was a crime in Soviet Russia? Well, it was, and it was the basis of quite a number of the execuations during the Great Purge of the mid-to-late 1930’s. It was defined in Soviet law as such:
Wrecking are deliberate acts aimed against normal functioning of state and cooperative organisations, e.g., giving deliberately wrong commands.
Interesting
September 9th, 2009 at 11:48 am
Funny – I was brought up thinking that “Rule Of Thumb” came from us artists. There’s a simple rule for measuring proportions in what the artist is viewing while doing sketches, paintings, etc.,. You’ve probably seen artists in movies holding their thumb up in front of them? They’re measuring objects in the distance as proportions of thumb length – the “rule of thumb” i learned in art.
September 22nd, 2009 at 8:43 am
@oouchan (151):
I would tend to believe that “rule of thumb” comes from the old system, which was used in many European countries, including Great Britain, of using the measurements of various body parts of a king or queen as a standard. Like the convention that a yard was the distance from the tip of a person’s nose to the end of their fingers (that person being the king) and that an inch was the length of the first joint of his thumb.
I also have to say that the implication that Texans are wife beaters is offensive, even in jest. Texans may abuse the language, but implying that we are all dumb, abusive, rednecks is unwarranted.
As for the list, I liked it very much. I am appalled at the level of writing I see on the Internet and in our public schools. While it is true that language evolves over time, it seems to me that if we continue on the current path, that people will soon revert to communicating via a series of grunts and gestures. And written communication is even worse with the proliferation of “texting” abbreviations in e-mail, instant messages, and other areas where it is not appropriate. And services like Twitter are making it worse, but that is another rant for another day.
September 26th, 2009 at 7:03 pm
I have no definite knowledge, but if I had to hazard a guess as to the origin of “As sick as a parrot”; I would go with the Norwegian Blue, a parrot who appeared in a Monty Python sketch and who was dead. The pet shop owner claimed that the parrot was merely sick from “pining for the fiords”
October 20th, 2009 at 6:15 pm
I love reading lists like this and I also get annoyed when people use a phrase incorrectly. I think the majority of errors come about as many of these old sayings are exactly that: colloquial and regional sayings, rather than printed in books and newspapers. As such, and due to the many dialects, it seems many people (well in Britain at least!) learn the saying without knowing/learning the spelling.
Some points replying to some comments made above:
Wreak havoc: Wreak and Wreck are pronounced the same in many areas of the UK.
Being on Tenterhooks: I would say this means left in a state of taut nervousness and suspense rather than ‘left hanging’ as stated in the article. However, many (younger) people I know do say Tenderhooks believing it refers to being left hanging on a butcher’s hook (used for aging and tenderizing meat) and so in a state of pained helplessness (probably influenced by horror flicks!).
Chip on your shoulder: I’m from Portsmouth, UK and it’s locally said that when the sailors (in Nelson’s time) came back to shore after months away, they had a lot of pent up agression and so would try to pick fights with locals or other ships’ crews in port by jostling and bumping into others until the chip (which may well have been imaginary!) fell off.
I believe, “Pleased as Punch” is a reference to the Punch & Judy puppets being overly/smugly pleased about something they’ve just done.
“Spitting Image” was a 1980s popular satirical show in the UK reflecting the public figures of the time. This show probably did a lot to make people think ’spitting image’ was the correct saying.
One of my current pet peeves is people saying ‘Pre Madonna’, rather than ‘prima donna’.
Cheers
Gaz
(Right, I’m creamed so’s it’s up the apples to see the old uncle and get some feathers for me. T’ra!)
November 3rd, 2009 at 4:38 pm
I can’t believe there is so many people who haven’t heard of “wreck havoc”. I my self have heard both versions and probably used the incorrect version a few times. Of course with out really realizing what I was saying and just repeating it as I have heard others saying it.
Has anyone heard others saying “believe me you”. For example: “That cat ate more than that huge dog over there, believe me you.” I say it, though I never quite understood what exactly it meant or if it was some kind of hillbilly slang, *shrugs* I don’t really know.
November 7th, 2009 at 4:16 pm
A slight addendum:
“all intents and purposes”
is commonly mistaken as: “all intensive purposes”.
I don’t know what that means.