Subscribe to ListverseTop 10 Moral Dilemmas
- Published October 21, 2007 - 236 Comments
Thankfully most of us do not come across dire situations that present a moral dilemma, but it is always a very interesting exercise to consider a dilemma and our reaction to it. So, I now present you with a list of ten agonizing moral dilemmas, in no particular order. (Be sure to tell us what you would do in the comments.)
10. Concentration Camp
You are an inmate in a concentration camp. A sadistic guard is about to hang your son who tried to escape and wants you to pull the chair from underneath him. He says that if you don’t he will not only kill your son but some other innocent inmate as well. You don’t have any doubt that he means what he says. What should you do?
9. The Accident
You are an emergency worker that has just been called to the scene of an accident. When you arrive you see that the car belongs to your wife. Fearing the worst you rush over to see she is trapped in her car with another man.
She sees you and although barely conscious, she manages to mouth the words “I’m sorry”…
You don’t understand, but her look answers you question. The man next to her is her lover with whom she’s been having an affair.
You reel back in shock, devastated by what her eyes have just told you. As you step back, the wreck in front of you comes into focus. You see your wife is seriously hurt and she needs attention straight away. Even if she gets attention there’s a very high chance she’ll die.
You look at the seat next to her and see her lover. He’s bleeding heavily from a wound to the neck and you need to stem the flow of blood immediately. It will only take about 5 minutes to stop, but it will mean your wife will definitely die.
If you tend to your wife however, the man will bleed to death despite the fact it could have been avoided.
Who would you choose to work on?
8. Spam Filtering
You are the network administrator for a rather large company. You have a young family and need your job to support them. As part of your responsibility as a network administrator is to monitor the emails for the organization. Usually this just means occasionally allow through emails for staff members that have been accidentally blocked by the spam filters.
One day you get a helpdesk request from a staff member asking for an email to get released. Normally it’s standard procedure except this time the request has come from the wife of a very good friend of yours. You recognize the name on the helpdesk request so quickly attend to the problem. As part of the procedure you need to manually open up the email to ensure that it isn’t spam, so you do and you discover that it certainly isn’t spam. You find that it’s actually an email to your friends wife from her lover. You scan the rest of the contents of the email and there is no doubt that she has been having an affair for some time now.
You release the email, but you can’t decide what to do. You’re initial reaction is to call your friend up and tell him about the email, however you quickly realize that company policy is very strict about revealing the contents of confidential emails of staff members regardless of the contents and unless someone’s life is in immediate danger, under no circumstances are you permitted to reveal the information.
In any case you know that revealing this information presents great risk, because even if you don’t do it directly, there is a good chance that the dots will be joined somewhere along the line and you will be found out. However you feel that by not telling you friend that you are aiding his wife get away with adultery and this troubles you greatly.
What do you do?
7. The Neighbor
You have a wonderful daughter. She is 8 years old and has always been a happy outgoing child. But a while ago something terrible happened, she was raped. You are quite sure that the person who raped her is your neighbor. Your daughter is so traumatized she has stopped speaking, but she in other ways been able to convince you that he is the one. Unfortunately not enough evidence can be found to convict him.
You try to put your life back together. You move to another house and try to help your daughter in any way you can, but it is clear that the experience has ruined her life and that of your family.
One evening you have taken your wife out to dinner at a restaurant when you spot your former neighbor at another table. He is eating alone and looks unhappy. You quickly finish eating and leave. The next day you find out that your former neighbors wife has been murdered. Enough evidence to convict him of the murder is soon found, and at first you are very happy, finally his will get what he deserves.
But then you remember that you saw him in the restaurant at the time of the murder. you know he did not murder his wife. Maybe he paid someone else to do it… You remember that the police said that it had been made it look like a burglary, maybe it was…
You sit down to think. If you keep quiet he will be convicted for the murder, and the real murderer will go free If you give him an alibi, he will go free, but you can’t be sure the real murderer will be found, and it is possible that the evil bastard paid someone to do it… What do you do?
6. The Pregnant Woman
A pregnant woman leading a group of people out of a cave on a coast is stuck in the mouth of that cave. In a short time high tide will be upon them, and unless she is unstuck, they will all be drowned except the woman, whose head is out of the cave. Fortunately, (or unfortunately,) someone has with him a stick of dynamite. There seems no way to get the pregnant woman loose without using the dynamite which will inevitably kill her; but if they do not use it everyone will drown. What should they do?
5. Nieces and Daughters
You and your family are going away for the weekend. Your daughter is 7 and is best friends with your niece, who is also 7. Your families are very close and your daughter asks if your niece can come with you on your holiday. You have been on holidays together before and don’t see any problem, so you agree.
You arrive at your holiday destination and the house you are staying at backs onto a beach. The girls ask if they can go for a swim. You tell them that they have to wait until you have unpacked the car, but they can play on the sand directly in front of the beach. They run down to the sand, and you begin to unpack the car. After about 5 minutes, you hear screaming coming from the direction of the beach and it sounds like the girls.
You run down to see what the matter is, and you discover that they hadn’t listened to you and have gone for a swim. There is no one else on the beach and the girls are caught in a rip.
The girls are really struggling, particularly your niece who isn’t as strong a swimmer as your daughter.
You swim out quickly, but when you get there, you realize that there is no way you will be able to get both the girls back into shore on your own. You realize that an agonizing decision will need to be made.
You need to decide which of the girls you will rescue first, you have enough strength and energy to rescue them both, but you can only do it one at a time. You look at the two girls, and your niece is really struggling to hold her head above water and you know if you take your daughter back first, there will be little or no chance that she will survive.
Your daughter is struggling also, but is much stronger in the water and you estimate that if you take your niece back to shore first, there’s probably a 50% chance that your daughter will be able to stay afloat long enough for you return, but you simply don’t know how long she will hold on for.
4. Hit and Run
One morning you are driving to work, and as per usual you are running a bit late, so you are driving a touch faster than the speed limit. You reach down to your stereo to change the CD, when all of a sudden your car hits something solid. You spin to a stop, but not before several more cars have run into you and each other in an attempt to avoid the accident.
As you look up and out of your car, you can see that you hit a person, and that the person is not looking very good. In fact, you are sure that they are dead. You shakily get out of your car, and look around at the damage that has been caused. Several cars have been badly smashed up, but more importantly you have killed someone with your careless driving.
As you are standing there in shock, a woman comes up to you, tears running down her face, and obviously very shook up. As a natural reaction, you ask her what is wrong. She gives you a funny look, and then she explains that she just ran over someone. You ask her where this person is, and she points towards the person that you ran over!
You don’t understand why, but for some reason this woman thinks that she caused this accident and killed the person, when in fact you are well aware that you were the cause. Whoever accepts the blame is likely to be placed in jail for a very long time. If you let the woman take the blame, there is a very good chance you will get away with it all. However, there is also the chance that you could be placed in jail for even longer for trying to cover it up.
3. Drug Bust
You are on holiday in Bali with your 18 year old son and wife. You have been there for a week and are ready to head home. All three of you are at the airport getting ready to board your plane, when an armed officer comes around with a sniffer dog. You have all your bags on a trolley, and the dog sniffs at both your wife and your bag, and passes over it, however when he gets to your sons bag, he begins to get a bit more active.
You look over at your son and he’s looking a little nervous. You know he’s smoked a little marijuana in his time, but generally, he’s a good kid, and you certainly didn’t think he’d actually be stupid enough to bring it back on the plane with him. At first you feel angry that he would do such a thing and start planning your responsibility lecture, but then you realize that you are in Bali, and they have a zero tolerance policy on drugs, meaning your son could be jailed for life, or worse, executed, if he does have some illicit materials in his bag.
You look at your wife and realize she has come to the same conclusion and has gone pale with fear.
The armed officer accompanying the dog is beginning to look more stern with every sniff the dog takes and looks directly at you and asks you to open to the bag.
You do, and as the officer begins to take things out of the bag, you see to your horror that there is a small quantity of marijuana stashed in with your sons belongings.
The officer looks at you and asks “Who’s bag is this?”
You realize you have to answer, but the answer won’t be easy. You see your wife in the corner of your eye, and she is about to step forward and claim it as her own; what do you say?
2. The Mad Bomber
A madman who has threatened to explode several bombs in crowded areas has been apprehended. Unfortunately, he has already planted the bombs and they are scheduled to go off in a short time. It is possible that hundreds of people may die. The authorities cannot make him divulge the location of the bombs by conventional methods. He refuses to say anything and requests a lawyer to protect his fifth amendment right against self-incrimination. In exasperation, some high level official suggests torture. This would be illegal, of course, but the official thinks that it is nevertheless the right thing to do in this desperate situation. Do you agree? If you do, would it also be morally justifiable to torture the mad bomber’s innocent wife if that is the only way to make him talk? Why?
1. Lifeboat
You are going on a cruise. 2 days into the cruise your ship experiences technical difficulties and the captain says it needs to make an unscheduled stop. A couple of hours later the captain makes another announcement that the ships hull has been breached and that you will all need to start heading to life rafts and abandon ship. The ships life rafts are lowered as people begin to pile in and you get on board one of the life rafts.
As it is lowered however, it hits the side of the ship, putting a hole in the side of the raft, and when it hits the water it begins to sink. There are 10 people in the boat and to prevent it sinking, you quickly work out that by having 9 people working for 10 minutes while 1 person rests you can bail the water out with their hands, quick enough to keep the water at bay and preventing it from sinking, but you have to continually keep it up to ensure that the boat doesn’t sink. By being able to rest one person you are greatly able to increase the length of time you can keep the boat afloat, however if the rescue team doesn’t turn up you calculate that within 5 hours the boat will sink and you will all die.
While taking your break, you glance over to another boat and notice that a friend of yours who you met on the boat is there and has noticed your predicament. He is signaling for you to come over and join them on their boat so you don’t have to continue bailing water out. There is only just enough room for one more person. You also notice that their boat is moving away rapidly with the current, but your boat can’t keep up because the hole is affecting its buoyancy.
You estimate that if you jump ship, you will force all 9 remaining crew members to bail water continuously, which will reduce the total time they can stay afloat to just 2 hours, but will ensure that you will be able to live long enough to be rescued.
If you stay aboard, you will not have another chance to jump ship, and there’s no guarantee that the rescue will arrive in 5 hours, meaning you will drown, however by staying you give everyone a better chance of survival.
As you watch the boat with your friend drift away, you realize you have about 30 seconds to make a decision:
a) Do you stay on your current boat and help keep it afloat as long as possible and hope that the rescue will arrive in 5 hours
b) Do you go to your friends boat, ensuring your rescue, but reducing the chances of the others on the boat being rescued?
Source: Moral Bliss
October 21st, 2007 at 11:36 am
I love this list, something to make you think.
October 21st, 2007 at 11:41 am
Oh wow, I hope I’ll never be presented with those situations. Making the choice is terrible, but trying to justify it is worse.
October 21st, 2007 at 12:00 pm
Samian: I agree – I felt a bit sick reading them because I just can’t comprehend what it must be like to have to make these decisions!
BTW: I have corrected some spelling errors that Cyn, thankfully, pointed out.
October 21st, 2007 at 12:03 pm
eeps…. no response…these are difficult
October 21st, 2007 at 12:03 pm
10 – don’t pull the chair out, the officer will probably kill someone else anyway, and it’s a much easier way to die then to stay there doing who knows what for how long.
9 – Save the wife, and then go onto the other person if he’s still alive
8 – ignore it. If they’re using business email, they will get caught eventually, so stop worrying.
7 – Tell the police, even if he did pay someone to do it, he will go to jail.
6 – Use the dynamite, the needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few.
5 – Save your daughter first
4 – Say you were the one who hit the person, there’s no guarantee you will go to jail, and it is always safer to tell the police the truth the first time.
3 – Hardest one i think, not sure what i’d do
2 – Torture the mad bomber thats acceptable, do not torture his wife. He is mad, he may not care about her.
1 – Save yourself. I know above i said the needs of the many out weight the needs of the few. But that’s when you know you will be saved, there’s no guarantee if you stay and help.
those are my answers.
October 21st, 2007 at 12:03 pm
The last one would be easy for me. The answer is use the stupidest person’s head to plug the hole, the jump ship. Seeing as those with the least intelligence often have the most swollen heads about themselves, applied properly you’ve just saved them too. Then jump ship and hope noone cares if the guy drowns.
October 21st, 2007 at 12:12 pm
#7 I definately keep my mouth shut, however if there’s any way I’m totally sure the neighbor is the rapist he wouldn’t have lived long enough to make it to jail
October 21st, 2007 at 12:24 pm
Steve: Wow, I agree with all of your answers except for the one about the raped daughter. I would, as a woman who knows how precious children are to a mother (not being a mother myself, but seeing mine in defensive action), probably have killed the man who raped my daughter, however since this is not the case here, I would not say a damn thing and let the man suffer for what he has done.
October 21st, 2007 at 12:26 pm
Oh, and I would turn my son in to the police. It’s not a large amount of weed, and if he was stupid enough to try that, he deserves punishment. No way am I going to stick up for my son’s blatant stupidity when it comes to drugs.
October 21st, 2007 at 12:44 pm
10. Lose-Lose. Get up on the chair and hug your son. It’s probably going to be your last moment anyway, you might as well end it quickly. (Doing something quick and surprising to get shot should be an easier way to die than by another kind of torture…)
9. Take thirty seconds to try and apply a compress to the man’s neck with your shirt, then help your wife. She’s sorry, after all.
8. Talk to your boss, or keep the secret. Their marital problems aren’t worth your job.
7. Because you’re better than him, report that he couldn’t have been the murderer. Who knows, maybe his conscience will lead him to confess his abuse of your daughter? Unlikely, but still, you’re better than him.
6. Find a weak spot in the cave wall and use the dynamite there. If you killed her and survived, the guilt would not be worth living with anyway.
5. Never underestimate the power of a scared saviour. Drag them both to shore, you have more energy than you think. Ask your daughter to kick her legs.
4. Calm the poor woman down, tell her you don’t think it was her that hit the pedestrian. Take the consequences.
3. Your son should take the rap. Don’t let your wife take it either. Besides, come on, whose clothes are in the bag? It’s easy to tell whose it is and only makes you an accomplice. It’s really your fault for being too tolerant a parent, but let your kid learn something about the law.
2. It is morally justifiable to torture him, but not his wife. Chances are if he’s crazy it won’t matter anyway.
1. Tell your boatmates to steer your boat towards the other boat and get them to help you bail. They’re just sitting there anyway.
About half these problems just require thinking outside of the box rather than moral decisions.
October 21st, 2007 at 1:21 pm
10.refuse to hang my child.
9.help the man.
8.tell the friend.
7.let the molester go to jail, family come first.
6.use the dynamite.
5.hold onto both girls and scream to the spouse for help.
4.own up.
3.it belongs to my son.
2.torture both for the sake of saving many more people. plus the wife is not so innocent to marry such an imbecile.
1.get onto the friends’ boat.
October 21st, 2007 at 1:33 pm
Those are great (and disturbing). I like the one I read elsewhere. It’s kind of a moral dillemma, more like just a tough decision. The way it was told to me was that it used to be on some job applications. I think it’s just a clever joke, but I really like it. I’ll try to tell it as best I can.
You are driving home from work on a rainy day when you see three people standing at a bus stop. None of them have an umbrella, and are surely uncomfortable. The first is an old woman who is probably sufffering under the cold rain. The second is an old friend of yours who once saved your life. The third is the girl of your dreams. You have room in your car for one passenger. Do you:
A: Give the old woman a ride as she is suffering the most.
B: Give your friend a ride as you owe him big time.
or C: Give the girl of your dreams a ride as you may never see her again.
One witty job applicant answered with this:
I would give my keys to my old friend so he could take the old lady home, then I would stand in the rain with the girl of my dreams.
October 21st, 2007 at 1:56 pm
Steve: Callous for number 6! heh
Newsong: very pragmatic answers – I agree with most
lydia: I agree with your number 2
Jack11: the witty job application wins in my books
October 21st, 2007 at 3:17 pm
#9 do nothing, let them both die and watch them go. I have made it very clear that if my wife ever cheats, she is going to die.
October 21st, 2007 at 3:19 pm
Regarding #3, I’m surprised people here are so quick to say they’d turn their son in. Remember, this is happerning in Bali, which has very strict drug laws. If your son is arrested there for drug possession, you may never see him again.
October 21st, 2007 at 3:22 pm
petey mcgee–Are you serious? I mean, cheating is certainly wrong, but you really think it’s punishable by death?
October 21st, 2007 at 3:37 pm
10. I would not pull out the chair
09. Half-assedly help the man, but focus on the wife
08. if anything comes up where the friend is suspicious of the affair anyways, tell him about the e-mail.
07. let him hang
06. Use the dynamite, but not without a struggle.
05. definately try to call for help, and die trying to save both, if I couldn’t make it.
04. TELL HER!!!!
03. It is my son’s.
02. Use torture, very easily.
01. Hmmm…. it really depends on the type of people in the boat. If they are trying their hardest, and generally physically fit, I would stay. Otherwise I would jump.
October 21st, 2007 at 4:03 pm
for all my answers im going to go on moral basis only, though in real life i’d try something other than the obvious.
10. Look into your sons eyes. what do they say? if they say he understands, pull the chair you saved a mans life. in not, refuse.
9. Its my job, I have to prioritize. the man gets the help
8. Don’t tell the friend you know is wife is cheating, but say you have reason to suspect. He will probably investigate if your sincere.
7. Stricly by morals, I wouldnt say anything. In real life, i would approach him with this deal: admit to rape and i will provide your alibi in murder
6. the woman dies. pregnant or not pregnant. She would have died when the tide came anyway
5. tell my daughter to stay calm and kick, then rescue my neice first.
these next 2 are hard.
4. perhaps the only one where i make the wrong decision. Ask other people what they saw, and if no one knew exactly seal your lips.
3. my son knew better.
2. first, make sure theres irrefutable evidence hes the bomber, then torture him but not his wife. nothing horribly extreme.
1. stay in the boat, but make sure my friend knows how and where to send help.
October 21st, 2007 at 4:06 pm
its a crazy world, anything can happen!
October 21st, 2007 at 4:26 pm
Needed……..A list of movies based on some of these moral dilemma’s. Anyone seen Abandon Ship with Tyrone Power ?
October 21st, 2007 at 4:52 pm
10 – Depending on how long I have been in the camp, I doubt death is something I fear any longer, but I don’t have the right to make that decision for anyone else. The guard will most likely shoot another prisoner anyways, so go out with a blast and attack the guard.
9 – The life of a woman who is going to die anyways versus that of someone who can be saved. Sounds cold, but that’s the way it has to be viewed. The man can be saved, the woman cannot.
8 – Once you know the woman is having an affair, there are ways of clueing in the spouse without revealing that you found the info in an email.
7 – Karma is a bitch. Tell the neighbor that if he doesn’t confess to the rape of your daughter, that you will let him fry for murder.
6 – This is such a silly scenario it’s not even worth commenting on. In the first place, what in the world is a pregnant woman doing in a sea cave and in the second, wtf is someone doing with a stick of dynamite?
If it were a better written scenario, I would say that the life of one when balanced against the lives of many is easily sacrificed, preggers or not.
5 – Again with the silly scenario. Who in their right mind would send two little girls down the ocean without supervision, especially after they have made it clear they want to go into the water?
It’s amazing what people can do in desperate circumstances. I’m sure with a bit of struggle, between the man and the daughter, they all three could reach the shore safely – and I would hope the dude would make it clear that such disobediance and stupidity has consequences.
4 – I hit the person, I take the fall, that’s kinda a no-brainer.
3 – The kid is old enough to know the odds and the risk of carrying drugs. His drugs, his punishment.
2 – In this situation, this waste of space has no rights, but I find the idea of torture repugnant, so I’m in a bit of a quandary. The evil side of me says to hand him a stick of dynamite and light the fuse. If he refuses to talk, at least he will suffer the same fate as his victims and be answerable for their deaths.
1 – Since I’m such a math whiz, I should know that the life of one person is not worth the lives of 9 others. I’ll take my chances with the rest.
October 21st, 2007 at 5:50 pm
10. Wouldnt pull it. No guarantee anyway that innocent will be killed or spared . The HARDER dilema is being required kill an innocent in order prevent your child from being killed.
9. Spouse. One will die so Id attempt to save the one most likely to survive due to my effort. Course if it was my cheating spouse –
8. Since its a good friend, I’d tell immediately w/o hesitation what I’d seen and I have. Another option is advise the cheater to confess immediately or else you’ll expose them. If in doubt, one could ask the friend if they would reveal to you if your own spouse was cheating and why. I’d tell though.
7. I would speak up – justices best chance comes from facts and Id inlcude my rape suspicions as well. Besides, the restaurant could come out later anyway.
6. Nobody gets killed in hopes to save others or guarantee to save others.
5. Much like #9 and the 50/50 chance isnt enough to disregard the stronger being placed first since theres no guarantee anyone will make it to shore.
4. Tell her and everyone the truth. Thank goodness that obstructing justice is a crime.
3. Execution or life in prison isnt a ‘lesson’ situation. I would refuse to answer, demand legal council and then be honest.
2. No torture.
1. I would not stay with a sinking boat.
October 21st, 2007 at 5:54 pm
Agh! I hate this list! Hopefully we’ll never face moral decisions like this…
October 21st, 2007 at 6:00 pm
I honestly see no dilemmas here. There is right, and there is wrong. Black and white. It’s tough, but in our heart of hearts, as cognitive beings, we know what to do. Why do lie detectors work? Because, ultimately, our bodies know we are doing something erroneous. The same with these decisions. These dilemmas are just like how I like my women: tough…but easy.
October 21st, 2007 at 6:29 pm
jen- yes, i am serious and she was well aware of this before we got married. i have been cheated on before and i love my wife so much that i absolutely cannot take that kind of pain. it may not be the healthiest outlook, but it is the way things are.
October 21st, 2007 at 6:50 pm
10) If my son was old enough to understand the situation, and that to not kill him would be to kill him and another, then I would do it. I feel like a horrible person, but I would have to do it. But if he was young, and not able to fully understand, I couldn’t.
I wouldn’t outwardly tell the friend, but I would drop hints like crazy. I would use any information I read in the email to try to lead him to the conclusion that his wife is cheating without actually having to say anything outright.
9) I would save her lover, because you could at least save one person definatly.
7) I would say I saw him at the restruant, because there’s a good chance that they would find out that he paid someone and he would be punished for that. Either way, I would probably beat the shit out of the neighbor. And definately get the daughter in therapy if she isn’t already.
6) I think it’s up to the pregnant woman to choose. It her who would be sacrificeing her life and that of the child.
5) I would rescue the neice as quickly as possible, but I would only get her to a point where she could get to shore on her own, so it takes less time and I could get to my daughter quicker. And I would desperately yell for help, hoping someone would get to my daughter while I was helping the neice.
4) I would speak up, because A) I have no right to ruin a strangers life and B) It would be incredibly stupid to get more jail time by not speaking up.
3) I would say it was his, because I think as a kid they’re more likely to not be executed. Anyway he was the one who was stupid enough to bring drugs on a plane.
2) I think it would be justifiable to torture the bomber, after all it’s one lunatic’s suffering for hundreds of lives. It isn’t however justfiable to torture his wife if she is indeed, innocent.
1) I would stay, mostly because I would feel and look like complete scum if I let all those other people die. Plus, who says you die as soon as the boat sinks, I think you could tread water for maybe another half hour.
October 21st, 2007 at 6:51 pm
I forgot to mention that for #2 you could also bluff, and make it seem like his wife was being tortured.
October 21st, 2007 at 7:02 pm
I’m with seymour on this. The most moral decision is fairly obvious in most of these cases. The only real question is whether or not you can justify behaving immorally to yourself to gain something that you want (your daughter to live, yourself to live, yourself to not go to jail).
The concentration camp one would be the most difficult choice for me, I think, because according to the scenario if you do not kill your son, he will be killed anyway and so will someone else. If you do kill him, he alone will die. So there is no real choice of action in which you can gain anything; the knowledge that you did not kill your own son would be offset by the fact that someone else died because you did not. That being a wash, I’d have to say do nothing because none of us can ever know what will happen – the guard could drop dead of a heart attack, a meteor could strike, the deus ex machina lifts your son off to the heavens, whatever.
petey mcgee – I guess you would answer the tiger? Me, I always believed that it was the lady.
October 21st, 2007 at 7:06 pm
petey mcgee–Oh, I see. You “love” your wife so much that you would be willing to kill her.
October 21st, 2007 at 7:22 pm
I didn’t get number six at all. The pregnant lady plugged up the mouth of the cave? With her belly? I don’t understand.
Besides, any group of people w/ a pregnant lady in it still has someone else who is bigger, at least here in the states, lol
October 21st, 2007 at 7:57 pm
All of the answers to this are simple, if you just ask yourself “What choice is best for me and my future?”. When a moral dilemma occurs, choose with an amoral mind.
Take number 9 for example, if you help your wife then you are stuck with a cheating spouse, and if help the man, you just saved a guy who poked your wife and will most likely do it again to someone else’s wife. The solution is simple, help neither and find a new wife.
As for most of the others, just make sure you don’t have kids, abortion is legal for a reason, and thats to keep kids from happening.
October 21st, 2007 at 9:35 pm
10- I would refuse to pull the chair out from under my son and tell the guard that the innocent person to be killed should be myself.
9- I would try to save my spouse. Sorry, I’m just sentimental.
8- Drop your friend an anonymous note saying that he’s being cheated on. Disguise your handwriting. Let him follow up on it if he wants to.
7- I like the idea of telling the neighbor that you’ll provide his alibi if he confesses to your daughter’s rape.
6- Someone flatten the pregnant woman’s stomach while the others push her out of the cave. The human body is surprisingly pliable. She’ll probably have a miscarriage, but at least everyone else (her included) will be saved. It was also a good idea to detonate the dynamite in a weak spot in another part of the cave.
5- Before you run into the water, grab something that floats for your daughter to hold on to while you rescue your niece. Or, have your daughter help you save your niece.
4- Take the blame. I couldn’t live with myself if I didn’t.
3- Say the drugs were planted.
2- Torture him. Torture his wife if necessary. They won’t die from torture, but other people definitely will die if you don’t try it.
1- Everybody swim to the boat with your friend in it. Take turns having people in the boat and people out of it holding onto the sides until help arrives.
October 21st, 2007 at 11:09 pm
I am truly amazed at how many different answers have come up – I kinda expected everyone to agree for the most part. Aside for a couple, that didn’t happen. The best thing is it got us all thinking before work on Monday
October 22nd, 2007 at 3:19 am
10. shoot myself
9. let them both die. cheaters can go to hell
8. not tell my friend. (but figure out a way to catch them red handed later)
7. hahaha…no dillema there….let the bas*ard rot in prison
6. oh god..un-answerable….wud probably group together and blow us all up thus solving the problem
5. niece first…since shes my responsibility….what wud i tell her parents if she died????
4. shoot myself
2. make it look like torture….but not really torture her….wud be just as effective
3. i’d say “its my stupid stupid son’s”….and then i’d shoot my son
1. easy.shoot myself.
October 22nd, 2007 at 3:26 am
10. I would go for the guard. Your son is dead anyway, no matter what you do. You are most probably going to be killed too at some point. Going for the guard gives you the possibility of revenge, an honourful death and to save the other person the gard was going to kill.
6. Using the dynamite at another place in the cave.
5. Try to save both at the same time. You don’t know if your assumption of your own strenght is correct.
4. I would take the blame, and be a person i could live with after getting out of jail.
3. Say that it is my sons stash.
2. You can´t defend freedom by destroying it
1. I won’t pay for my rescue with less possibility for the others to be saved.
October 22nd, 2007 at 4:37 am
Shebab: you don’t have a gun – the two options in the list are ALL that you have
Lasse: Same for you on your number 6 – the dynamite will only work in that one place – you are just avoiding the issue
October 22nd, 2007 at 5:10 am
Jamie: How dare you get people to think before Monday morning chaos hours!!!
October 22nd, 2007 at 5:21 am
Ravyn: Because I’m the boss! Now get in line!
October 22nd, 2007 at 5:35 am
*lines up*
I already said I ain’t got answers for these. But that was also pre-Monday Chaos hour. I am in the middle of chaos hour now (that would be getting my kids ready for school and on the bus).
October 22nd, 2007 at 5:37 am
These are generally easy sitting at a computer, but in real life it would often be hard to be so detached. But anyway, for what it’s worth…
10. Refuse to pull the chair away. The blood will be on the guard’s hands, not yours.
9. Save the wife. Not for any vindictive reason against her lover, but if you have to make a choice, it may as well be someone you know. And whatever they did, that’s no reason to let them both die. If you really loved her (as you should if she’s your wife), you wouldn’t be able to stand by and see her die, whatever she’d done.
8. Don’t tell anyone – it’s none of your business. If it comes out later and you’re questioned about the mail (unlikely), just say you didn’t bother reading it.
7. You have to tell the police that he didn’t do the murder. “Maybe he paid someone else to do it” – that’s not for you to decide. As for what he did to your daughter, two wrongs don’t make a right. One day your daughter may feel more able to talk about what happened, and you can deal with it then, through the proper channels. Perhaps that all sounds a bit glib, but I couldn’t imagine myself doing things differently.
6. Dynamite, I’m afraid. Needs of the many. Unless, of course, they’re all very old or suffering from incurable diseases.
5. Save the niece first. In real life, you’d always save your daughter, though, wouldn’t you?!
4. If I was looking at the CD player, how do I know I hit a person? The woman seems pretty sure she did. I would be honest and say “I may have hit someone but I don’t know” and let it be decided in court, as it should be.
3. At this point, whatever happens and whoever takes the blame will ruin your marriage and destroy your relationship with your son. Tell them the bag’s his.
2. Torture is never acceptable. It’s possible to evacuate crowded areas on a country-wide basis if needed, and your time would be better spent doing that.
1. Stay on the boat you’re on. There’s no guarantee your friend’s boat will fare any better in the long run, and also if you fail to make the swim to the other boat (which is quite probable under the circumstances), you’ve just killed yourself and risked nine other lives for no reason.
October 22nd, 2007 at 6:06 am
Ddd: excellent responses all.
October 22nd, 2007 at 6:37 am
Wow! I can’t imagine what I’d do in real life for any of these situations, but here’s what I think I should do:
10. Get up on the chair with your son and hold him. Even if you pull the chair out from underneath him someone else in the camp is going to die anyway, so doing so would only delay the inevitable. At least this way the guard killed your son, not you.
9. Theoretically there should be more than one paramedic in the ambulance, but in this case it seems like it’s only you. I would have to prioritze and save the man who could be saved first. Maybe get him stable then try working on the spouse. I couldn’t just “let” either one of them die, especially since being a paramedic would be my job in that situation.
8. I would confront the man who requested the email be unblocked and tell him that if he does not confront the friend and tell him that he’s cheating with his wife then I would. Idiot shouldn’t be writing or receiving personal emails at work anyway. Besides, who would ask for a personal email from the person they are cheating with to be unblocked knowing full well that the email has to be opened?
7. Give the alibi. You don’t know that he “hired” someone to kill his wife. Besides, you can tell the attorneys that you think he was the man who raped your daughter. Hopefully this has already been looked in to, but if not it will at least come out now. Be the better person.
6. Unrealistic. If the woman could get into the cave then there isn’t any reason she couldn’t get back out of the cave. Wait until the water gets a little higher the push her through. The water should help her slide through easier. I also liked the idea of using the dynamite somewhere else.
5. Try to rescue both of them. Have your daughter help kicking. You can at least bring your daughter closer to shore then let her go and focus on getting your neice in. Upon reaching the shore, beat them both senseless for not listening and drive them home. Vacation is over.
4. Since it says “you can see that you hit a person” then you have to own up to it. It was an accident after all.
3. Ask for legal counsel, then talk about your sons options. He has to confess to it and pay the consequences of his actions. Do not let your wife take the rap. Even if it means he has to spend a long time in jail or worse. If you let your wife confess and she’s in jail for the rest of her life, your son will probably still be using drugs back home.
2. This is a tough one. Torture is illegal and unfortunately this scum bag has rights too. But I would still threaten him. If you torture him or his wife then the judge in the case may have to dismiss any charges and he’ll be let go, possibly to blow up more people later. Try your best to ascertain general locations and evacuate as many people as you can.
1. Stay with the lifeboat. Try to get your friends boat over to help bail. Or send them off to get help.
October 22nd, 2007 at 6:58 am
jfrater>> You are right. As for nr. 6, i would not pay for my life with someone elses (and her unborn child). So i guess its dinner with the fishes for me.
But of course, this is easy to say now, with the sun shining in from the window and a nice warm cup of coffee besides the keyboard.
October 22nd, 2007 at 7:28 am
Lasse: heh yes – everything is easy when you are outside the situation
purvislets: your answer to number 6 is hilarious! I can just see it (and I don’t want to!)
October 22nd, 2007 at 9:09 am
10. No way I could kill my own son. Not ever!
9. I would save my spouse, then file divorce papers. (Just for kicks I read the list to my husband and he answered, without hesitation, “I would let the lover die, save you, let you recover and then kill you myself.”
8. I would not tell my friend about the infedelity, that’s none of my business.
7. This is a tough one for me. I think I would let him go to jail for murder. Although I like the answer above of blackmailing him into confessing to the rape.
6. I don’t think I could kill one person to save the rest. I just don’t think I could do it.
5. I would try to save them both! I couldn’t let a child die.
4. I’d fess up to the hit and run.
3. My son would have to get busted and I would appeal to the US to intervene on our behalf.
2. Torture him, leave the wife out of it.
1. I would stay and help the other 9 bail water as long as we could.
October 22nd, 2007 at 9:19 am
Pashan: number 9: hahah. I like the rest of your answers too – very decent
October 22nd, 2007 at 9:43 am
10. Won’t kill my kid. If the guard kills someone else, its on his head, not mine.
9. Family first, save the wife. Although this is kinda stupid because there is almost always TWO people in an EMS unit.
8. Company policy says I can’t give out the info in the email. But it doesn’t say I can’t confront the cheating wife.
7. I’d provide the alibi. After all, I don’t know 100% the guy is guilty of either the rape or the murder.
6. I’d first ask the pregnant woman if she was willing to sacrifice herself. If she says no then I wouldn’t be the one to use dynamite. Murder is murder, I’d rather drown.
5. I think this one is unanimous: try to save both
4. Tell the truth
3. If you choose to break the law then you choose to face the consequences
2. I’m not convinced torture works. People will say anything to make you stop. So, no torture.
1. Start bailing
October 22nd, 2007 at 10:22 am
It’s funny all the people on here who would hand their son over for torture or execution, but wouldn’t torture a confessed bomber to save a city full of people. As the father of 4 boys, I know first-hand the stupidity they’re capable of, but I would never turn them in over something as trivial as a small amount of marijuana. I’d say that the bag was mine.
October 22nd, 2007 at 10:44 am
10. I don’t kill my son. The guard is only trying to screw with my mind anyway. It’s not my responsibility.
9. Save the wife, if she doesn’t make it, you know the bastard died too.
8. I wouldn’t tell. It’s not my business, and the fact that they use company email systems guarantees a screw-up at some point. If it’s one of two people I think about, I’ll tell him anyway.
7. I don’t provide the alibi. If for some reason I did not arrange for the sob to have an accident, he can rot in jail for the rest of his life for all I care.
6. Not smart of the pregnant woman to come along. If there is no way for her to go to the place where she entered, I wouldn’t want to try and suck O2 out of salt water. Besides, who would be so dumb to try to get a pregnant woman through a hole she clearly doesn’t fit in. Besides: if everybody got out first, and then she stuck herself into the hole, plugging it, she’d survive because she would be free to breathe and people could devise a solution once the tide goes out.
5. The three of us either make it or we drown together.
4. Traffic specialists will come in and they will determine the true cause [they are quite good where I live]. Just own up, but chicken out halfway. This is my worst dilemma, actually.
3. His mother is not going to take the fall for his stupidity. If I hadn’t managed to get through to him when he was younger and, knowing we’d be going to a country with these very strict laws and being aware of my son’s history with recreational pharmaceuticals I would have implored him to not do anything that he would regret for a very long time, it would be partly my fault too.
2. Torture the wife. Leave him scott free [well, if anyone dies, life in jail of course] and torture him by knowing he was the agent of the torment of his wife. No mercy.
1. I go to the friend’s boat. Because I’m gone, the boat will be lighter and ride a little higher in the water and that’s going to take away some of the burden of the guys doing the hosing. And besides, in a true survival situation, you look out for others when the situation allows for it [because you'd want a helping hand from a stranger too], but in the end you need to live.
October 22nd, 2007 at 12:26 pm
9: Save the man first; he’s more likely to be saved and HE didn’t betray your trust (well, it’s possible you might know him, but he’s not married to you and isn’t bound by the rules of fidelity).
October 22nd, 2007 at 7:21 pm
I think you do what you can live with. These aren’t decisions that can be made on the spur of the moment – you would act on them on the spur of the moment according to the way you have lived your life.
I wouldn’t hang my son. Figuring we’re all doomed anyway, I’d take my chances and invite the guard to shoot me.
You try to stop the man’s bleeding and also try to save your wife. In a situation like that, there’s the shock of seeing the shape the people are in, and the realization of the affair is probably something you haven’t even grasped yet. If you loved your wife before, chances are you still love her. Normally you would try to save both.
You do nothing and release the e-mail.
You do the ethical thing and tell the police the man has an alibi. If he did something wrong, he WILL be found out.
You see if you can bomb another part of the cave and put a hole through it.
You would try to save both and get encourage your daughter to kick or stay afloat in some way. Maybe have the niece ride on your back and have your daughter hold onto your legs and kick, assuming she’s light enough that you can still kick.
Own up to the accident. An accident is just that, an accident, not punishable by the electric chair.
Tell your son you’ll do what you can to get him released, and seek help from the U.S.
Well, the torture may not work or may not work in time so you’re in trouble any way you look at it. And if his wife doesn’t know anything and he won’t talk, that’s no good either. You could THREATEN to torture his wife as a last resort and take her away to another room so he won’t know you’re NOT torturing her and see if that gets him to talk. Beforehand you should be trying to figure out where he’s been and evacuating and trying to reason with him. There’s always a shot of sodium pentothal.
Well, there are three things you can do besides jumping to the other raft. You can start the bailing schedule OR everyone can jump and hold onto the side of the working raft with people taking turns riding on the boat, or putting a child there or someone more frail. Or you can send someone else over there who maybe isn’t in as good a shape as you are. That will also lighten the boat.
And yes, I remember “Abandon Ship” with Tyrone Power. A tough film! I couldn’t do what he did, I’m afraid.
October 22nd, 2007 at 9:30 pm
my only coments are for the lifeboat one…first, a raft alone can have anywhere from 10-20 people in it with a modern lifeboat being able to hold 70 full grown men. Second, you would have a life vest and could survive a couple hours in the water with that, depending on temperature, time of year and time of day as well as the marine life in that area…but i would probably stay
in all the others…
10. Don’t kill my son, the other person will most likely die anyway, as will my son, but not by my hand.
9. Save my wife
8. Keep it to myself and don’t tell
7. Provide alibi proving me to be a better person
6. Use the dynamite, though it could possibly cave in, which screws everyone over
5. What type of wimp can’t carry two 7 year old girls? i would save niece first and hope my daughter made it.
4. I would probably let her take the blame, though i would most likely get caught later.
3. I let my son take the blame and call the U.S. embassy, they wouldn’t execute a child over a small amount of mariuanna, jail? most liekly, but not execution.
2. I would torture the bomber, but not his wife, unless she knew about it.
October 23rd, 2007 at 1:41 am
few postulates before we begin:
1. there is no greater deed of love than to sacrifice one’s life for fellow human
2. it is better for a righteous to die, then unrighteous, cuz righteous will be saved by death, and unrighteous will be condemned by death.
3.However, unrighteous may become righteous only if he lives and sees a deed of uttermost love. If he doesn’t become righteous, he is beyond salvation, hence, he is as good as dead anyway.
4. There are no other viable solutions then ones described, meaning that i assume it is not possible to save all involved, for that is always the first choice.
#10. Concentration camp – People that end up in concentration camp are already dead, it is only a matter of exact time of their burial. The only purpose of staying alive in camp is to convert as many unrrighteous to righteous, by deeds of mercy and sacrifice. So i would ask my son to jump from his chair, and by that to save other prisoner (P1). If he refuses (too afraid) but is righteous, kill him (P2). If he isn’t righteous and other prisoner is, ask the guard to first kill the other prisoner, maybe that act of sacrifice will convert son to righteous(P3). If neither are righteous it is better to kill the son, cuz otherwise he might be tortured prior to death.
#9. The Car Accident – Wife said she’s sorry, talk to her to make sure she redeemes herself completely, and she’s probably going to die anyway, so let her die. Other guy should be saved, so that he may became redeemed (P3).
#8. Spam Filtering – I wouldn’t inform the collegue. If he has to find out, he will eventually. However, i would talk to wife, and try to convince her to stop with cheating and come clean with her husband.
#7. The Neighbor – Save the rapist by testimony, but make sure he understand that through your love he is saved, so that he may become righteous and confess rape(P3). So come clean with him but don’t bargain.
#6. The pregnant woman – Ask the pregnant woman is she willing to sacrifice herself, same as in case #10. If she is righteous, she dies. If she isn’t, ask other 9 people are they willing to die so she might live. If they are righteous, they die. In all other cases, she has to die.
#5. Drowning girls – If really not possible to save both, even if helping each girl to stay afloat for 5 secs consecutively, save the niece first, cuz then you would have 50% chance for them both to live.
#4. Car Accident – Tell the truth. If she really believes that she’s guilty, say that nevertheless you’ll take the blame, maybe she’ll became righteous (P3).
#3. Drug Bust – Atleast here you don’t have to see is your son righteous, he definitely is not. Therefore, you take the blame, maybe it will make him become righteous (P#)
#2. Mad Bomber – Talk to guy and try to make him tell the truth without torture. If that fails, talk to wife, to see if she will participate willingly. If she is righteous, she will endure some pain in order to save people. She can even pretend to be tortured, in order to get details from her husband. If she is not righteous, and will not help you to save hundreds of innocent people, she is part of the crime, and there is nothing you can do to turn her to righteousness. Only if all that fails, i would torture them both, since i would be sure they are beyond salvation (P3).
#1.Lifeboat – If there are 0% chance to save all people on boat, there is no reason for anyone to stay. I would tell them that we’re beyond salvation, and i would ask them to join me for swimm to other boat. I would accept to save my life only if i could save all other lifes before me.
However, why not join two boats, and make group of 19 people who will remove water from leaking boat? 15 people can work together while 4 people rest, and boat could be afloat for more then 5 hours.
October 23rd, 2007 at 8:44 am
Im really surprised at all of the different answers people are giving. Most people seem willing to sacrifice themselves; i wasnt really expecting that to be honest.
10. I would stand with my son til the very last minute; the guard will do what he wants to anyway.
9.I would tie something around the mans wound to slow down the blood flow, giving my spouse more time to live and more time for me to work on her.
8. I would release the e-mail; my job isnt worth the risk and the husband deserves to know.
7. I would report the man’s alibi and all of my suspicions about his wife and my daughter.
6. Use the dynamite in another spot. Im sure i couldnt live with myself if i sacrificed a woman and her unborn child for my own life.But why is the pregnant woman leading them out?
5. I would grab my niece, and tell my daughter to grab on to her to help keep her (my daughter) afloat. Together they would probably weigh the same as an adult so i should be able to make it to shore. The adrenaline rush should probably help also.
4. Tell the woman what i believe-that i hit the person. I couldnt live with the guilt.
3.I wouldnt let my spouse take the blame over myself. Punishment for drugs in other countries is severe; id make my son confess and help as much as possible.
2. Copy off of an episode of 24 and make it look like you were torturing her when you really weren’t-hundreds of lives are at stake, but chances are his wife is innocent.
1. Tell my friend to get his lifeboat to come over to them and help them bail out. If they couldnt do that then i wouldnt leave.
October 23rd, 2007 at 8:55 am
Jack Bauer has pretty much been through every one of these scenarios.
October 23rd, 2007 at 10:01 am
Some of these are made easy because I can’t swim. But the one with the dilemma of providing an alibi, remember that if you don’t provide the alibi, you are allowing the real murderer to skate and commit a murder without being held accountable. You would have to join OJ in the search for the real killer.
October 23rd, 2007 at 3:18 pm
for number 6: take out the baby using a sharp rock. then proceed to eat the baby. then that bitch oughta fit back out the hole.
October 23rd, 2007 at 5:54 pm
im kinda surprised and a little dissappointed. I think a lot of people are answering what they “should” answer. Im also jealous most people have time in the morning to visit the site
October 24th, 2007 at 1:00 am
10. Do nothing. The guards hold the position of power and will do as they please. Do not be responsible for ending your son’s life. The other innocent inmate is probably you.
9. Apply a perfunctory tourniquet to the man’s neck (see #10 for tying instructions) and save your wife.
8. She’s slipping up in other areas. Your friend probably already suspects something is awry. Send him JFrater’s moral dilemma list. He knows you work in IT.
7. 1st rule in the military, “Never volunteer unless ‘asked’ [ordered] directly.” Did you make contact with the cho-mo in the restaurant? Are you 100% sure it was him? Did he see you? It may have been a Doppelganger. Remember, time of death is an estimate. He may have done his deed prior to arriving at the restaurant.
6. Deliver the baby. Use the dynamite.
5. Provide your daughter with encouragement and direction. (Come on sweetie swim with me.. we’re going together, you can do this) grab your niece, go with the flow of the rip tide – not against it and you can save them both.
4. You don’t know what happened. Tell the woman she doesn’t know what happened. Wait for the police. Tell them what you remember. The “bump” may not have been the pedestrian. Forensics will sort it out.
3. “Its her bag” jk. You say nothing and ask for the US Embassy [in my case].
2. If the suffering of his wife will provide hard and fast results – yes. If he doesn’t care about her, torture him- while evacuating the building of course. (I had to temper that…)
1. Stay on your own boat. The other one might spring a leak as well.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:33 am
Awesome list, here’s what I think are the right things to do ^^
10. Don’t kill your son.
09. I’m sure emergency workers are instructed with some sort of guideline of what to do in these situations, so I would follow that. I guess it would probably mean saving the guy.
08. Ignore the mail. She will probably be caught anyway.
07. Tell the police.
06. Don’t use the dynamite. I do not believe in “the needs of the many outweigh…”.
05. Save the niece.
04. Tell her/the police you did it.
03. Step forward first. It’s your responsibility anyway to make sure your son doesn’t break the law.
02. Do not use torture.
01. Stay in the boat / call out to the other people for help.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:40 am
BJEsomar: I presume you are religious – do you not think that your first premise is incorrect? Surely the greater deed is to give up your life for God? It also makes me a bit nervous that you are presuming to know whether or not a person will be “saved” and using that to decide that a person deserves to die.
Wow – you guys are really thinking hard about these things – most of the answers are very impressive.
October 24th, 2007 at 3:05 am
jfrater
First premise is set by Jesus himself in NT. In short it states Love => Sacrifice.
That’s a strange thought that best thing in God’s eyes person can do is to die for Him. What benefit has He if I die? Does that justifies suicidal bomber, that they died for their God? I think that greater thing is to live for Him, to be living testimony of His existence. I’m not sure did I made myself clear: I do not decide is the person righteous or not, persons actions define his state of heart. Even a evil person could be willing to die for his friend, but to die for people you don’t know is for me a sign of righteousness. And in all “to die for or not to die for” cases, we are actually talking about strangers that we have to save in a cave or in a boat, right?
Anyway, it’s a great theme, cuz it includes divinity and humanity. It would be great thing to ask religious scholars, what would their God do
October 24th, 2007 at 3:13 am
Bjesomar: Okay, I get your point – thanks for clarifying. How about this dilemma to make it a bit tougher on you: reconsider each of the moral dilemmas with the presumption that all of the pertinent people are “righteous” according to your terminology. Do you have to answer differently?
October 24th, 2007 at 5:12 am
In that case, i have no problem for putting any number of righteous to death, acc to Post 2.
I believe, i would try to minimize total number of dead people, so in case #10 it means i kill the son, and in case #06 kill the pregnant woman. However, looking from the behaviour of Jesus, maybe abstaining of any action could be answer, He didn’t seem to do much when faced with lose-lose situations.
But it is interesting to note that you didn’t notice that in case #02 my morale would make me torture the wife in either case
October 24th, 2007 at 5:14 am
10) I would probably kick the chair if the guard was serious that he would kill us both. If my son looked really upset, I would fight the guard, kill as many guards as possible and try to free my son.
9)I dont know the guy so i have no reason to WANT him to live. He has been sexing my wife so i now have a reason to want him to die. So i would pretend to try and save my wife, who will die guilty, and then he will also die because i didnt help him first.
I would tell him I think she is cheating, but not tell anybody about the email. If she didnt get caught I would go and tell her I know she is cheating and I would bluff that I have evidence to show her husband. If the guy didnt believe me and called me jelous, I would lose my temper and show him the email.
7) I would let him go to prison for murder, and I never forget. When he returned, I would set him up for another crime, because he will be more suspicious having just been released on a murder charge.
6) Everyone knows extreme sports and hobbies carry risks. So if a pregnant woman risks doing it, she knows she can die. I would try my utmost hardest to push her out the hole in the cave, if not, use the the dynamite.
5)Take my trousers off and puff them up and tie a knot in the legs. Give this to my daughter, take the neice to the shore, shallow enough where she can stand up, go and get my daughter who has more chance of surviving thanks to my wonderful flotation device.
4) Out of all the crashed cars, I am the one who knows for certain I hit the person, therefore I would say that the cars crashed first, and that I am unsure who hit the person, I would tell police I dont think it was the lady, but im unsure in what order everything happened.
3) Would be pretty horrible to let my son ruin his life, but at 18 years old he must have realised all this would happen.
2) Torture him, I dont see how his wife would need to be tortured but torture her aswell if needed. Sounds pretty harsh but I would ask all the citizens if they felt I did the right thing by saving all there lives. If 90% responded I did the right thing I would be happy, even if i lost my job.
1) If they were all healthy, and fit, and were genuinely trying to save each other, I would stay. If they were panicky and half assed and not helping, I would leave. Survival of the fittest.
October 24th, 2007 at 5:25 am
Bjesomar: Okay – so let us say that all the people in a concentration camp, by their example of suffering, have made many people righteous – meaning that they too are righteous, is it okay for them all to be killed?
Also, I am concerned about your point that an unrighteous person won’t be saved so should be killed – how do you know that five years in the future he would not become righteous? Why do you get to make the judgement?
October 24th, 2007 at 5:30 am
Kieran: your number 5 is hilarious! Very Macgyveresque
October 24th, 2007 at 5:41 am
1. Before i answer, let me explain the basis of early christianity spread.
People were so vigorous in their faith, they didn’t practiced religion, they lived it. Inspired by their living-faith example, thousands converted. In order to stop religion from spreading, the Adversary tried to kill all righteous. However, by accepting death in forgiving and inspiring manner, executing christians converted even more people to christianity, and made opposite effect then intended. The point is: if many are righteous, then it is best for as few as possible to die, cuz then there is better chance that remnant will spread their faith.
2. That would be the “insulting Holy Spirit” case.
Do you know that in NT Jesus said: “whoever insults Son of Man, it can be forgiven, but if one insults Holy Spirit, it cannot be forgiven”
How is that possible, i ask your opinion, that God cannot forgive certain things?
October 24th, 2007 at 5:55 am
BJesomar: I am aware of the “insulting Holy Spirit” – however St Augustine and the early Church fathers considered this to mean the sin of not repenting at the last moment. That would mean that there is no living human being that can not be forgiven. But regardless, you still can not say that you have the power to know whether a person is or is not in a state of sin. If you go to this article on the Catholic Encylopedia, and scroll down to “VIII. SINS AGAINST THE HOLY GHOST”, there is a larger explanation of the concept
October 24th, 2007 at 6:14 am
i’m surprised that nobody has said that all of these situations are the fault of the bush administration and that number 1 is impossible because the holocaust never happened. besides this list was already done better by asian directors john woo and mekii takashi.
October 24th, 2007 at 6:23 am
DiscHuker: Argh!
October 24th, 2007 at 6:41 am
Well, it seems that I understood it little differently, so please bear with me as i try to explain.
, if rejectment would lead to eternal condemnation.
What can change man’s path from evil to good?
It can be many things, but basically it is an incident when man is moved by certain action so deeply in heart, that he realises his “blindness”. That doesn’t happen without strong testimony of Holy Spirit to that person’s spirit, and person suddenly realises the truth, so strong is the Spirit’s testimony.
But in mind, person can reject the obvious truth, and therefore makes his heart hard as stone. Such was the case with King Saul from OT. In such case, person is beyond salvation, cuz if the person rejects direct Spirit-to-spirit testimony of Holy Spirit, nothing bigger can be done for him to soften his heart.
Therefore, that person is utterly condemned, it cannot be saved anymore.
So in the view of the Morality Cases, i would suppose the wife is condemned, if she does not agree to the deal. But it should be one mf-charming deal
October 24th, 2007 at 6:50 am
Bjesomar: thanks for the answers – I found them very interesting
October 26th, 2007 at 10:16 am
I cant answer all of them, but
9. I’d save my wife, the guilt would be there for ever if you didn’t at least try to save her. Besides everyone knows EMTS don’t come one per ambulance. Someone else can get the other guy.
8. I’d probably wind up talking to the wife. Tell her that she should stop, and/or confess to the husband, but I wouldnt say anything to him.
7. I’d tell the police. I want vengeance, but I want it to be just. Losing his wife if he didn’t do it would be some fraction of justness for his crime.
6. Dynamite the lady. It would suck, but it would be saving more lives and I’m sure this lady would understand.
5. I’d rescue the niece first. Yes I would have to live with it, but the guilt would be greater to have someone else piling it on me than if it were just me.
4. I’d talk to the police making sure she talked to the police and claimed to have hit the man first. I’d tell them I think I killed someone and if there are two people who both think they ran this person over, yea both of us may get in trouble, but they may also discover that one of us is guilty or they may even discover the guy was already dead and we both hit him. Besides what makes me so sure I hit him anyway.
2. Yes, I would torture the innocent wife. Most mad men have something they love and something they cling onto with their every being and while he may not care about her, he may also love her more than anything and no one can bear to see the ones they love hurt. I would hope she would understand why the police were doing it, but maybe I have seen too many movies.
1. I’d have to jump ship. It may be selfish but they are also wearing life vests and there would be all sorts of things floating around they could cling to. Cruise boats also have homing signals and whistles on their vests in case something like that does happen.
October 27th, 2007 at 8:15 am
10) wouldn’t pull the chair…damn germans were heartless and would kill everyone anyways
9) i’d sit back and watch them both die….but not before saying “I’M sorry.” with a grin
8)I’d tell my boy…loyalty.
7)his problem not mine…let him get raped in jail
6) as sad as it sounds she would have to go…that would be a really tough decision for one person to make…probably should require a group vote.
5) the niece..i was trusted with her safety..hope that my daughter is as strong as i think she is…either way i’d probably die trying to save both..
4)this one is difficult…i’d probably keep my mouth shut
3)I’d say it was mine…he’s my son.
2) torture..no doubt..any means neccessary
1) damn who knows…
October 28th, 2007 at 4:17 am
10.I would die first.
9.Don’t know,would have to really happen to know that.
8.Say nothing
7.Say nothing
6.let the people vote,then i wouldn’t feel so guilty.
5.Both or,die trying.
4.Sorry,i would say nothing again.
3.I would take the blame before i would let my wife,But in this case,my son.
2.Torture his dog first.Alotta men like that care more for thier dogs!!
1.This is another one where it would really have to happen for me to say.I try to avoid ships & planes.
October 28th, 2007 at 11:48 pm
Well I have answers, but I’m not sure that they wouldn’t change if it happened in real life. ^^;
10. Concentration camp: I would attack the guard. I couldn’t live with myself if I killed my son, and I couldn’t live with myself if another innocent person died because of me. Besides, if I refused and someone died, his family members or friends would kill me anyway; probably more painfully. If I didn’t refuse, and my son died, the guard would probably kill me for being a coward anyway.
9. The Accident: Emergency workers usually work in pairs, don’t they? Let your partner else deal with the lover. I’d tend to my spouse.
8. Spam Filtering: Confront the wife. Give her an ultimatum: Tell him or I will.
7. The Neighbour: Tell the police. After all, the wife was probably innocent and we don’t want her rolling in her grave because the wrong man is in prison. Let God be the judge when the man eventually dies.
6. The Pregnant Woman: Laws of physics – something that can get stuck can get unstuck, right? Pull the woman back in, get everyone out, and let her plug the hole again so she doesn’t drown. Get someone to rescue her.
If that was physically impossible… Ask the woman’s permission. If she says yes, use the dynamite. If she says no… Beg forgiveness and use the dynamite anyway. ^^; The people in the cave have a right to live as well.
5. Nieces and Daughters: ‘you realize that there is no way you will be able to get both the girls back into shore on your own.’ Doesn’t say you can’t drag them both out of the rip. :p Drag them both out of the rip, then let them swim back. You can help them if they’re struggling.
4. Hit and Run: I don’t even drive yet. XD But, you know, it’s your fault if it’s your fault. Own up and deal with the consequences.
3. Drug Bust: I have zero tolerance for drugs. If your son is stupid enough to try, let him deal with the consequences.
2. The Mad Bomber: Torture the man. If you don’t, hundreds of people will die without you having done your best to stop it.
1. Lifeboat: I would stay in the sinking boat and help. I’d probably regret it, but I’d stay anyway.
November 3rd, 2007 at 11:56 am
mama always said ,”stupid is as stupid does.” now i know who she was talking about.
November 11th, 2007 at 2:37 pm
The easiest choice is number 9, let them both die and laugh while you watch.
November 11th, 2007 at 4:01 pm
seeing as I’m socially psychotic, my judgement is not clouded by morality
so the answers are
10 – hit him with the chair
9 tend the guy and while your doing it tell the wife what your gonna spend her life insurance money on when it pays out
8 blackmail her lover for cash then beat the shit outa him and video yourself doing it for your mate
7 what? you should have killed him weeks before the restaurant thing – go do it- take your time – enjoy yourself.
6 pocket the dynamite there might be a cave in – just snap her spine or something she’s dead anyway
5 tough shit neice but you ain’t mine
4 fuck that shit forensics on the car will nail you anyway – get your story straight about how you where rear-ended INTO the victim
3 hard lines kid, but your room would be a great place to put a den – maybe I’ll get me a pool table with the money I’ll save feeding you…
2 yup, get out the pliars and make sure your both standing next to his wife when its time for the bombs to go off
1 b – thats not even a tricky one
November 26th, 2007 at 12:22 pm
What is it with everyone and thinking outside the box? These questions are like yes or no questions.
One or the other. No other choices. No saving them both. Just A or B.
November 28th, 2007 at 2:38 am
Agreeing with oneway, stop squirming around the dilemma’s, answer straight damn it.
10. I would not pull the chair, who cares about another inmate, innocent or not
9. Wife of course, she was a bit unfaitful, so what
8. I’d shut up, it’s not my problem someone is cheating someone else, friend or not.
7. I would not offer alibi, if there was even a remote chance the guy had done the deed to my daughter.
6. Blow the fat cow up, why did she try to go first damn it.
5. Daughter first, too bad for the niece.
4. I would confess having been the one driving over the victim.
3. I would say the drugs are my son’s, stupidity must have a price and sometimes it is a big one.
2. I’d torture the bomber, wife, their kid, grandparents, mom, dad and any other I could think of to get the info. Personally if needed.
1. I’d save myself, life does not hand out medals to dead people.
November 28th, 2007 at 12:13 pm
My main problem with most people’s response to number 2 is that there is still no guarantee that he will reveal the locations of the bombs. In addition he may simply make up a false location for the bombs. Remember he only has to buy enough time for the bombs to go off.
December 3rd, 2007 at 3:01 pm
These are the best 10 you could think of? Most of these are pretty easy to answer. Some of them are downright stupid in how easy they are, like the pregnant woman in the cave. How is that even a difficult choice?
December 11th, 2007 at 11:44 pm
10. I’m definitely not a utilitarian, I guess. I would not take part in my child’s murder.
9. Since when do emergency workers travel alone? Well, in this improbable scenario, I’d try to save my wife first, because she needs more help.
8. She’ll be found out eventually. I wouldn’t compromise my job.
7. I’d testify to his alibi. I couldn’t let a murderer go free, and while it’s tragic that my daughter was raped, I can’t behave immorally to try to enact justice. Clearly, karma caught up with the rapist already.
6. We’d have to take the chance that the dynamite would not kill her.
5. As with #9, I’d tend to the one who needed more help — in this case, it would be my niece.
4. I would take responsibility. I couldn’t let someone else suffer when it was my fault.
3. “It’s mine.”
2. I’m on the fence about torture, and since time is of the essence, I’d put more energy into finding and disabling the bombs, and continue to have an officer pressure him to or provide incentive for him to reveal the location. I would never allow an innocent to be tortured.
1. How the hell did I come up with that formula? Whatever. I would stay on my current boat. We’re in this shit together, and my survival may not be guaranteed on the other boat; for all I know, a shark could attack that boat.
December 11th, 2007 at 11:52 pm
I can’t believe some people would refuse to help on #9. It’s your job as an emergency worker…you’ll probably lose your job for shirking your ethical responsibility. Karmic payback for being so unforgiving.
December 13th, 2007 at 9:33 am
the mad bomber – morally justifiable to torture the man’s wife.. now that s a little stupid.. if he IS mentally ill, how can anyone be sure that torturing his wife wud actually make him talk..
but the drug thing is the best one..
December 13th, 2007 at 9:35 am
if u ve got to, torture the bomb squad into doing their work…
January 5th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
I haven’t read all the comments on here, but I am fairly shocked by the pragmatism of most of the answers I have read. Still, faced with these moral dilemmas, I can’t definitively say that I would react any differently, and that is what drives me nuts. The vindictive side of my soul wants to torture the bomber and jump out of the life boat, and let the cheating spouse and his/her lover die, even do something as simple as rescuing my daughter first. But I know with every fiber of my being that to do any of these things would immediately weigh on my conscience, and I would probably torture myself with my self serving choice for the rest of my life. That said, I am now getting off my soap box and am going to answer the moral questions…
10. Okay, either I’d be terrified of death and just do it already, or I’d be terrified of killing someone and wouldn’t be able to do anything, probably resulting in my own death anyway.
9. While not helping is not an option to me, I honestly don’t know who I’d choose to help. Actually, yes I do. Assuming I love my spouse (I married them after all), there’s no way in hell I’m not going to save my spouse if I can. This does not mean, however, that I would refrain from yelling obscenities at my spouse while saving them, because, face it, I’d be ticked, no matter what happened. Especially if she died anyway.
8. I’d do my job, and if it was really bothering me that much, I’d ask my supervisor what to do, or if it was all right if I shared the information. Assuming I even got that permission, I would probably then confront the cheating spouse (it’s the wife, right?) and ask her to tell the truth to her husband before I went public with the info.
7. I have to agree with those who feel the need to murder this man. This is my daughter we’re talking about, and I’m going to protect her no matter what. On the other hand, I can’t protect her from jail, so I would alert the police to my suspicions, even if they can’t do anything, and then move, and then, after seeing him in the restraunt, take a deep breath, get really mad, and call the police and admit that I saw him or someone who looked exactly like him at the time of the crime. (I was raised to always do the right thing, but this doesn’t mean I’m gonna be nice about it.) Hopefully the murder investigation will uncover evidence in the (probably cold by now) rape case for my daughter.
6. How small is this hole, exactly? And once again, what on earth is a woman pregnant enough to get stuck in a hole doing in a cave by the ocean? Clearly she is close to term. (Either that or really fat to begin with) And why does this guy have dynamite? Is he a psychotic demolitions expert or something? ANYWAY… I have to go with trying to get the woman out of the hole and back into the cave and then letting everyone else go through first and then pulling her back through the hole so she doesn’t drown. This way, nothing explodes, and no one risks a long and painful death, or a really fast death. However, if this were not an option… We obviously didn’t come in through this hole, unless we’ve spent a few months in this cave, so let’s all turn around and go back the way we came. This lady is able to breathe, we can come back to this entrance with a rescue team and get her out as soon as we can. Barring even this, then I say, someone down there has to have a cell phone!!!! I mean, please. Someone just call for help! (Sorry, this turned out to be really long)
5. I can pretty much honestly say that if I knew that my daughter was the stronger swimmer I would shout instructions to her while saving the niece. It’s just a matter of telling her how to escape the rip tide. Besides which, do you think that your sister/brother/whoever you got the niece from is ever going to forgive you if you don’t at least TRY to save the niece? I wouldn’t. However, if it was a situation where I knew that one of them would die, I would go for my own daughter.
4. If I knew without a shadow of a doubt that it was me, then I can’t believe that eyewitnesses wouldn’t corroborate that, and I would tell the truth. Also, if you admit to it, you are much less likely to get actual jail time, I know a guy who was in a similar accident, (he actually did kill someone and it haunts him to this day) and while there was talk of sending him to jail for a very long time, I think (can’t remember, we aren’t that close and he doesn’t like to talk about it–don’t blame him) repeat: I THINK that he only got a few months with parole, in addition to having his liscense suspended and lots of community service. It’s clearly an accident that this unnamed victim was killed, and this woman probably hit the dude after I did anyway. So technically, either of us could be the killer. Anyway, that’s getting into semantics a little, and bottom line is, I was the first one to hit the pedestrian, so I’m going to admit to it. And looking back, that’s not an easy punishment, but it’s a whole heck of a lot softer than what this scenario presents.
3. Okay, here’s the thing. I believe that if it’s illegal, it’s wrong, period. Yes, extenuating circumstances, self defense, I get it, but the fact of the matter is, my son just got busted for having illegal drugs in his possession. Yes, I am TOTALLY AGAINST illegal drugs, however, due to the fact that this is a foreign country, I have to say that I would not let anyone in my family answer the question unless and until we got leagal council from an AMERICAN. Preferably my very own, very reliable lawyer who I would get shipped to me on the next flight possible. (I know lawyers aren’t a commodity, but, still, I’m trying to make a point here.) What my son has done is wrong, but I want to make sure that he gets extradited to the USA before he gets punished, because no way am I going to stand by and watch him possibly take death for something he may not have even known was a mistake. (I am not against or for the death penalty, I merely think that it’s an overreaction in this case, and completely unnecessary as a form of drug related discipline)
2. Torturing him would be putting ourselves on the same plane as the Nazis. I’m sorry if this offends, but I actually find the torturing and tormenting of human beings a more vile and disgusting practice than out and out murder (in most cases). Torturing is never okay. However, I cannot stand by and let thousands of innocents die. So, item number one: PSA effective immediatley to evacuate as many as possible from the areas where the bombs are. Item two: Bomb squads. Lots of them. Item three: While the act of torture itself is reprehensible, physical or mental, I have no objections to threats of extreme violence to the bomber’s person or family, as long as there is absolutly no intent to carry them out. Item four: Well, now would be as good a time as any to start believing in superheros, now wouldn’t it?
1. While for a moment or two it would be extrememly tempting to jump out of that lifeboat, and into assured safety, I can honestly say that unless it was a storm and there was little hope of survival once in the water (it’s the Caribbean, you aren’t going to die as soon as you get wet) I would stay in the lifeboat. However, as soon as the boat sinks, any other boats in range are fair game. There is of course, the possiblity that this is an Alaskan Cruise, in which case jumping out of one lifeboat into that cold Pacific water (unless we’re off the coast of CA or something) is not going to save you, regardless of whether or not there is another lifeboat waiting. It’s called hypothermia and frostbite, people. Which you’re getting anyway, due to the bailing and the hole in the boat. Same with a trans atlantic cruise. Mediterrainian (did not spell that right at all did I?) cruises, I assume the same principles as in Caribbean cruises apply here. It’s the Mediterrainian. You aren’t about to freeze.
Anyway, aside from my shock (it shouldn’t shock me anymore, but it still does) at the total depravity of man (oooh, Christian concept there), really some of this is quite unrealistic. Although the answering of moral and ethical questions is always an interesting discussion.
January 13th, 2008 at 4:06 am
This is another dilemma situation I read once.
You’re a train tracks operator sitting in your office on the fifth floor of the control room overlooking the train station and monitoring the tracks.
A train is about to arrive when suddenly you notice that there are 5 kids playing on the track where the train is about to arrive. You have the control to divert the train to an adjacent track, but to your horror there is 1 kid playing on that track too. What do you do?
All the smart alecks just assume that the kids are deaf so they cant hear the train coming; its hypothetical!
Most people I asked said that they’d divert the train, as many believe the lives of 5 are worth more than the life of 1.
So you diverted the train. What if later you found out that the kid that died refused to play with the others on the first track because he knew that a train was about to arrive and he tried to warn them but they didn’t listen!
This may sound a little anti-democracy but I guess the moral of the story is that just because a majority says so, doesn’t make it right.
January 15th, 2008 at 4:26 pm
no one can forget the classic ”pulling the plug scenario”
January 17th, 2008 at 7:10 pm
Ouu, fun list.
10. Make sure the son knows and understands that he will die no matter what I do and save a man’s life.
9. I would save her lover first and if there was time save the whore:P Her lover might not have known she was married, and another person might be able to come and help you out.
8. Tell the guy you have reason to be suspicious about his wife; make something up, like you saw her with another guy. He’ll check into it.
7. I would come forward with the alibi. There isn’t enough evidence to say he raped the daughter.
6. Dynamite. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
5. Save the niece first while screaming for someone else’s help to get your daughter, and, in the meantime, tell her to keep kicking.
4. We’d both talk to the police, explaining what happened. For all you know, she may have caused the accident.:P
3. Ensure the officer the son would get his ass whooped in public:P Doing drugs is bad enough but bringing it on a plane? Idiot. I’d let him take the fall.
2. Torture the wife if torturing the guy doesn’t do anything. Rather have two bruised bodies than thousands of bloody corpses.
1. Depends. If everyone was really half-assing it and being stupid, to hell with them. If they were actually trying, I’d stay and help and make sure the friend knew exactly where we were.
January 21st, 2008 at 3:40 pm
Morality is a cloak of lies we wrap around ourselves to shield us from the thought that we are no different from animals. Well, that being said, here are my answers:
10 – Pull out the chair. Killing is killing and animals kill their progeny all the time.
9 – Stop the man’s bleeding and let your wife die. He’ll be pretty fucked up about the situation and probably suicide within the month. Problem solved.
8 – Ignore the email. Just do your job, which isn’t to deal with other people’s problems.
7 – Tell the police. Nothing says “closure” like the snap of handcuffs. See if they’ll let you punch him in the yam bag a few times before they take him away.
6 – Use the dynamite. Honestly, a pregnant woman is a real hindrance to survival, despite what movies and TV tell us.
5 – Okay, this may be a little out of character, but I say save the niece and go back for the daughter. Even if the daughter drowns a little, you’ve got at least another two minutes before there’s any permanent damage. Next question.
4 – Let the woman take the fall for it. You can’t be sure you really did kill the guy (unless there’s blood and shit on your car). Besides, she’ll get a lighter sentence for it, if the jury decides to convict her.
3 – Tell the cop that it’s you son’s bag. Bad move on trying to sneak back some ganj, junior. Now you’ll be an example to others, until weed is legalized, then you’ll be a regrettable statistic.
2 – Torturing the bomber’s wife doesn’t seem to be worth it. How much do you think he really cares about her, knowing that he’s set up bombs to kill hundreds. Personally, I’d set him up on an autopsy table, administer a local anesthetic, and, starting at his feet, slowly dissect him. Set up mirrors so that he can see exactly what you’re doing. He’ll crack in about 5 minutes, unless he’s really batshit crazy.
1 – Go with your friend. The chances of survival are greatest.
Now, before I’m flooded with hate mail, yes, I’m aware that I’m a bastard. Thank you for noticing. Yes, I know that Jesus/God/Zeus/Buddha will probably look down on the things I just said, but I’ll more than likely get the thumbs up from at least Satan and Shiva, maybe Odin too.
All I can say is, I’m a rotten bastard and I’m not in the business of making people feel all warm and fuzzy. I’m here to let you know there are still mean people out there in the world, and I’m fairly certain there are more of us than most want to admit. From the priest and his kiddie porn fascinations to the thug who holds you up at the ATM. Evil takes all forms and most of them look human. Keep that in mind.
January 22nd, 2008 at 3:57 pm
The comments are more interesting than the article itself. And a reminder that there are people who think very differently from yourself – and worse, think they’re absolutely right!
January 23rd, 2008 at 7:26 pm
A Moral Dilemma
Here’s a dilemma for you… With all your honor and dignity what would you do? This test only has one question, but it’s a very important one.
Please don’t answer it without giving it some serious thought. By giving an honest answer you will be able to test where you stand morally.
The test features an unlikely, completely fictional situation, where you will have to make a decision one way or the other. Remember that your answer needs to be honest, yet spontaneous. Please scroll down slowly and consider each line – this is important for the test to work accurately.
You’re in Florida…In Miami, to be exact. There is great chaos going on around you, caused by a hurricane and severe floods. There are huge masses of water all over you. You are a CNN photographer and you are in the middle of this great disaster. The situation is nearly hopeless. You’re trying to shoot very impressive photos. There are houses and people floating around you, disappearing into the water. Nature is showing all its destructive power and is ripping everything away with it.
Suddenly you see a man in the water, he is fighting for his life, trying not to be taken away by the masses of water and mud. You move closer. Somehow the man looks familiar.
Suddenly you know who it is — it’s George W. Bush!
At the same time you notice that the raging waters are about to take him away, forever. You have two options. You can save him or you can take the best photo of your life. So you can save the life of George W. Bush, or you can shoot a Pulitzer prize winning photo, a unique photo displaying the death of one of the world’s most powerful men.
And here’s the question (please give an honest answer):
Would you select color film, or rather go with the simplicity of classic black and white?
January 23rd, 2008 at 8:38 pm
lol@95
January 23rd, 2008 at 8:39 pm
well, lol @ 95
that shouldn’t have come up as an email link, lol
January 30th, 2008 at 10:37 pm
10. Let the other people die. They’re probably going to anyway.
9. Let my wife die, she’s a cheatin’ you know what and she’ll probably die anyways.
8. I wouldn’t tell him. I’m sure he’s a great friend, but it’s not my business.
7. Let him go to jail…that a-hole raped my daughter!!
6. I’d let the preggers lady die…
5. I’d have to take my niece first, it’d be hard but if she’s definately gonna die and my daughter might live, I’d take the niece.
4. I would let that girl take the blame!! I don’t know how well I’d live with myself, but at least I wouldn’t be in jail!!!
3. I’d tell him it’s my son’s. If he’s stupid enough to do it, he can suffer the consequences.
2. Why would you torture his wife…you should just torture him…
1. SCREW THOSE OTHER PEOPLE!! I don’t know them, I’m savin’ myself!!!
February 6th, 2008 at 1:06 pm
10) The problem suggests that I have some freedom of movement. I would tell my son that I love him and try and kill the guard as quickly and brutally as possible. If that were not possible, I would tell the guard to “f” himself. Hes a killer already, there is nothing that will stop him from doing it again.
9) I would treat them both equally and hope not to lose either. Once they were all better I would beat the living crap out of both of them.
I would make sure that when the guy answered the email – that it “accidentally cc’d” the guy. They would never be able to trace it to me – and problem solved.
7) If I was 100% positive that the man raped my daughter – he would not live one millisecond past the time that I found out about it. I would shed crocodile tears in front of the jury and claim that I acted in “passion.” The suckers would believe me and let me go. I would spend the rest of my life trying to help my daughter recover from her trauma and to be able to grow up and trust men again.
6) If she got stuck she can get unstuck. Take a little more time – be calm, and get her the hell unstuck.
5) I would save them both. Adrenaline can turn you from a 90lb weakling into the Hulk.
4) The setup to the accident seems like its suggesting that you were not paying 100% attention. Its an accident. Tell the cops what YOU think happened, let the chips fall where they may. They will figure out who hit the guy anyways. Lying about it will get you in deeper doo-doo than just telling your version.
3) I’d get my son a good lawyer. Once he was off the hook I would take him home and beat the everliving crap out of him.
2) The whole idea of “torture” being bandied about these days is really funny. If you keep someone awake for a few days they will tell you anything you need to know. How is keeping someone up past their beddytime “torture?” You could alternately – waterboard him. Waterboarding TRICKS you into thinking you are drowning and are about to die. You are not going to drown and you are not going to die and there is absolutley 0 damage done. Smashing someone’s finger one at a time with a hammer until they confess is torture. Keeping someone awake for a few days or making them think they are about to drown is NOT torture. There is absolutely positively no moral dilemma here AT ALL.
1) This is the poorest example of the bunch I am afraid. Plug the hole in the boat with something – clothes, a hand, an arm a leg – whatever. Problem solved.
February 7th, 2008 at 9:06 am
10) I wouldnt go to a concentration camp in the first place, I would rather die,and there are generally warning signs before they start rounding people up.
9)I’d treat the guy first, after all, he might not have even known she was married, and even if he did, you didn’t know him, so he doesnt owe you anything, its your wife’s fault for cheating. Except a) I wouldnt ever get married anyway and b) ambulance drivers never have , and never will ever ride alone, so this is a ridiculous scenario anyway.
8)I would write a fake letter on an old typewriter to the guy’s wife in the name of the guy who sent her the email, and make sure that I sent it at a time when my friend would find it. You dont have to tell him specifically about the email.
7)If I was that sure I would have done something to him myself anyway.
6)There is no way that she can be that stuck, several people with a fear of death woul;d kick her fat ass out of that cave in 2 minutes.
5)Id grab the daughter and tell the daughter to grab the neice, then swim with both.
4)I wouldnt run over a pedestrian in the first place because I’m not an idiot.
3)It doesnt really matter who’s it is , in a place like Bali you could buy your way out of it, and if not they would probably imprison all 3 of you anyway.
2) Is this even a question?
1) Firstly, I’m not into calculus and physics, and I honestly dont think anyone could make that calculation. Id stuff the hole with clothing and keep bailing.
How about a truly horrid scenario with no right answer? What if an insane sadist put a gun to you head and told you that you had to have sex with one of the following two things :
1)a live puppy or
2)a dead baby.
Then what would you do?
February 7th, 2008 at 9:08 am
Mount Teetar: I would tell the sadist to pull the trigger… I’d rather die myself than harm an innocent, dead or alive.
February 11th, 2008 at 3:35 am
Hmm… My first post on list universe. This list was really facinating, but as some people stated, most answers to me are pretty obvious. As in, as soon as I read each senario, I knew what I would do, no pondering. Morally, what would be the right thing. But there was one that as I looked at other people’s responses, I didn’t see this suggestion. Maybe I missed it, but I have a different answer for #8. So here’s my take-
10. I would have to pull the chair out. I would be able to do that knowing my son would finally be free of the horrors of the camp and would be at peace and in heaven. It also would satisfy the guard’s cruel desire for fun for the moment and hopefully save the other man. Also, if I refused, it would probably end up being more than the other man who died- it probably would have escalated and more bystanders killed. One or 20 people killed didn’t matter to the Nazis. In their eyes, all the prisoners would be dead eventually anyway. I did have another thought that maybe I’d turn and attack the guard instead, but again, it probably just would have led to the other guards getting mad and killing more innocent people. But if I did pull the chair, I’d probably die of heartbreak soon after.
9. Since it’s my job, I’d attend to the person who needed the most help most quickly. I’d tell my husband (substituting in this case) that I loved him and forgave him. I wouldn’t want my last words to him to be of hate, even if he had betrayed me. I would find time for anger later. But would try to save his girlfriend. But for goodness sake- there’s more than one person in an EMT crew! Not like the other guys are just gonna stand there and watch while I anguish over it. They’re trained to work on more than one task at a time…
8. My answer is different than other people’s- go to the cheating wife first. Tell her that you know and are now in a dilemma. Tell her you are going to give her a chance to come clean with her husband (not just end the affair but admit it to him) within a week, or you will do it because you care about your friend and want the right thing, even if she doesn’t. That way you won’t get in trouble for leaking an email, and she has the chance to do the right thing. And you also won’t have your friend finding out some other way later and coming back to you saying “you knew and didn’t tell me?”
7. I would tell the police and be an alibi. Not because the scum deserves any mercy, but because I won’t sink to his level and lie. I am better than that and need to be moral and upright to help my daughter get better. He’ll get what he deserves eventually. Here or at judgement day. I have more important things to deal with than getting revenge on the scumbag. Helping my daughter heal.
6. This one made me laugh. I can just picture this lady stuck like a cork and all the people pushing on her butt to get her loose… not very likely! When I was pregnant I was at the back of every line, huffing and puffing! LOL. But really- dynamite? What do you do, make her hold it? If you blasted the hole, more than likely it’d just get more blocked. So you keep pushing- pregnant ladies aren’t all stiff, there’s some squishy belly there to work with! Besides, if the tide’s coming in, you splash some water on to add some lubricant. If all else fails, you push her back through (that HAS to be possible!) and everyone else goes through and then you try her again till it’s too late. (Oh, and by the way, it’d be two people losing their lives- the unborn baby is a person too)
5. It’s amazing what you can do when adreneline kicks in… I’d take both of them and give it my all to get them back. I’d tell mt daughter to hang on to my shirt and kick, and give more help to my niece who was panicing. I’d die trying. Also, my husband wouldn’t just be standing there watching- he’d be right along side to bring them in.
4. I could NEVER live with myself if I let someone else take the blame. I would admit it was me at the scene. Also, with forensics and technology as they are, they’d soon figure out who it was that hit the guy anyway.
3. Well, if it was either gonna be me or my husband who spoke up, and I knew he was gonna take the blame, I’d try to beat him to it. And I would say that it was my son’s. As much as it would break my heart, it is his responsibility and his fault. And I could do more good on the outside fighting for him than in prison. I’d also have my husband and other kids to think about. Darn hard part of being a parent- when to let your kid suffer for their own mistakes. Sometimes you have to let them though, and it’s not fair to the rest of your family to go down for his mistake.
2. Well, let’s think about the aftermath- what would be said if thousands died and it was found out that they could have possibly been saved if torture had been used on the guy. There would be an uproar. Up until the bombs actually went off, he should be tortured to get the locations. His wife on the other hand, should not. She did not do the act, even if she knew about it or approved of it. Besides, as others noted- if the bomber was crazed, he probably has already lost touch with everything and wouldn’t care about his wife.
1. Hmm… that’s alot of calculating going on in such a frantic situation. I take it they remembered their notebooks and pencils on the lifeboats so they could do the math. So use the paper to stuff the holes. Seriously, I could nver live with myself knowing I let those people die. I would call to the other boat and have them come along side. We’d do the whole 9 scoop water and one rest thing except we’d also trade off with the people in the other boat. That way there’d be 9 scooping and and 10 resting. Do trades in 5 minute intervals and that would give everyone 45 minutes of scooping followed by 50 minutes of rest. This would also extend everyone’s energy so they could keep it up for 10 hours instead of five. Don’t bet on my math or anything. It’s all so goofy anyway. Too many variables involved to have an easy answer. (Ex- are any of the people kids? how many men vs women? etc)
Ok, that’s all my great wisdom for now. Fun to spew it all out for the world to adore once in a while.
Oh, and Mount Teetar- that’s truly a sick thought. He’d have to pull the trigger.
February 14th, 2008 at 12:20 am
Newsong you miss the whole point. This is an exercise in selecting one of the choices, not creating a 3rd choice “find a weak spot in the cave wall” Are you an idiot coming up with that?
February 15th, 2008 at 11:06 am
First I would just like to riddicule Mount_teetar for his answers, then agree with Kevin on his points. The point of the scenarios is to choose a path based on YOUR ethics, there is no right or wrong answer. Utilitarians would choose the greatest good for the greatest amount of people, while Kantian ethical persons would choose the path that was 1) universal, 2) corresponds to your sense of duty and 3) treat people as an ends, and not a means to an end.
That being said:
10) Not kill the son
9) Save the man because he can be saved (and yes, there are ambulances with one medic on it. It’s called a “first response” vehicle.)
8)Not tell your friend, but you can confront the wife.
7)Tell the police you saw him at the restaurant.
6)Blow up the pregnant lady
5)Save the niece first, as your daughter has a chance on staying alive.
4)Not admit to running him over. Just tell the cops what I ABSOLUTELY knew, which was that I hit something solid.
3) Admit the bag is mine.
2) Torture both of them.
1) stay in the boat and bail.
February 17th, 2008 at 2:49 am
moralvsright, that is some dilemma you put forward! I would go with black and white film to capture the sombre mood.
Interesting that you chose Florida as dubya’s place of death. Florida, the land where the governor can recount votes as many times as it takes until the count is just right for his brother to be elected president.. ahh the irony.
February 26th, 2008 at 5:37 pm
I would kill the guard
March 3rd, 2008 at 12:30 am
10. I kill my son. After all, each of the other inmates is somebody else’s son.
9. Assuming that the lover has a high chance of survival with proper medical care, I save him, allowing my mortally wounded wife to die if need be.
8. It’s none of my concern. I carry on, business as usual, and keep my job.
7. I provide the neighbor with an alibi; a rapist on the streets is better than a murderer.
6. I use the dynamite. The life of the mother and her baby aren’t worth those of all the others.
5. I take the niece back first, so as to improve the odds that they will BOTH survive.
4. I take responsibility for my actions; any other choice would be dishonorable.
3. I implicate my son. Blame goes where it is due, and nowhere else.
2. Torture and/or kill whomever is necessary in order to save a substantially greater number of lives.
1. I remain onboard, hoping that help will come along while prolonging the lives of the remaining crew. If I die, so be it.
March 5th, 2008 at 3:36 am
9 – Ask someone else to handle the man while you help your wife. You probably have a partner, or enough bystanders or police to help you with the man.
8 – Let it be.
7 – Ask your neighbor about your daughter, saying that it’s better to go to prison with a clear conscience. If he confesses, tell him to admit the rape to the police, and then offer the police the alibi.
6 – Depends on the size of the group.
2 – Just talk with the wife, and if that doesn’t help, take the bomber to a crowded area. It’s not your fault if some madman had placed a bomb in that area earlier. Also claim that the bomber will not be given any credit for the bombing.
March 24th, 2008 at 3:02 am
2 – no use torturing the madman’s wife. it’s very unlikely that he cares if his wife gets tortured.
March 31st, 2008 at 12:03 am
10. Kill ur frickin son hes going to die anyway.
9. Save my wife but they should both burn in hell.
8. Keep my job its nonoe of my bussines.
7. Make a deal with him admit that he rape her and youll give him an alibi.(He’ll go to jail either way)
6. Use the dynamite aand kill the woman.
5. Id take the niece first what would i say to her parents if she died.
4. Id admit it otherwise it would be me who should be shot.
3. Say that the bags mine.
2. I dunno
1. Jump the boat.
April 1st, 2008 at 5:41 am
Fab!!!
I am in middle school and we studied this as PRS (philosphy religious studies). we all liked it well done!!! Nice web.
I will notify everyone of my friends about this web. i am sure they’l love it!!!
April 1st, 2008 at 5:42 am
Oh BTW i am not English, i am chinese. I hope that isnt offensive
April 1st, 2008 at 5:45 am
IT MAKES ME THINK
and also my friends.
My friends love it!!!
F-antastic
A-s
B-eetles (band)
lol just thought of that…
if u do create more of these webs about moral dilemmas notify me and i will spread it via e-mail to my friends.
My PRS teacher seams to be so involved with moral dilemmas.
Bye for now…
April 1st, 2008 at 5:46 am
ITS EVEN BETTER THAN WATCHING MS!!!
April 30th, 2008 at 7:30 am
I really only have one thing to say… from the stand-point of a philosophy minor and a logical thinker.
Most of you are not answering the question being posed. Most of you, especially the person who specifically noted that “most of these are not moral dilemmas you just need to think outside the box to make a decision” (paraphrased), are operating on “reality” situations rather than hypothetical situations with clear conditions.
Each of these moral dilemmas should be taken as they are:
If you do A, then B will occur.
If you do C, then D will occur.
THERE ARE NO OTHER OPTIONS. There is no choice E or F.
for example #10
There is no “attack the guard” option in hopes of getting yourself killed. There is no “refuse then ask the guard to kill you as the innocent” (First of all the guard is sadistic, therefore he would obviously NOT end your pain and shoot someone else.)
These moral dilemmas were created not so that people would think of ways OUT of the problem but to see what people would choose based on completely restrictive outcomes.
If A is not done then B will not happen. Would be a more accurate way of saying it.
Example: If you choose not to help your daughter, there is no “bring your niece halfway and hope she gets to the shore then turn back to save your daughter”
If you choose not to help your daughter, and instead help your niece, your daughter will have a coin-flip’s chance of living.
This assumes you MUST bring your niece ALL THE WAY to the shore. There is NO other variable that can affect the 50/50 survival rate of your daughter, you just have to gamble.
Example: If you choose to rat your son out for drugs, HE WILL DIE or be IMPRISONED FOR LIFE. NO WAY OUT. If you choose to stay silent and your wife confesses, SHE WILL DIE or BE IMPRISONED FOR LIFE.
THIS is how you should be thinking of these dilemmas and which option to pick. STOP creating “outs” for yourself, that is NOT the purpose of this exercise.
AFTER saying all that, here are what I believe to be the MORAL thing to do in each case (which, upon further review, would show that really there isn’t a moral thing to do since there is no moral theory out there that has proven to be infallible)
10. LEAVING ASIDE THAT IF YOU ARE AN INMATE YOU ARE NOT INNOCENT ANYWAY. One should not kill their son. I say this based on the moral theory of Integrity where one is responsible for one’s own actions. If you refused to pull the chair out from underneath your son you should not be responsible for the innocent’s death since, ultimately, it is the GUARD’s choice that the innocent inmate will die. The control that the guard offers you is only an illusion in order to remove your Integrity factor. On the other hand, based on Utilitarian values, you would pull the chair from under your son since it would be the choice that would cause the least amount of adverse consequences. However, since utilitarianism is a flawed theory, I personally would not pull the chair from underneath my son.
THIS QUESTION HAS NOTHING TO DO ABOUT YOUR SON’S REACTIONS, the moral dilemma should not be based on if “your son can accept the fact that you are trying to save an innocent inmate”.
9. In this question, whoever you choose not to rescue will die, so it does not concern any real moral theory. Help your wife, he will die, help him, she will die. The little twist here is that EVEN IF YOU HELP HER she MIGHT die, whereas if you help him he WILL survive. That decision alone should be enough for you to, morally, save him. However, (speaking of personal feelings now) there are many more reasons to save him.
#1 “i’m sorry” doesn’t cut it, people who have affairs are never truly sorry or else they wouldn’t have done it in the first place. People only say “sorry” when they are caught to try to lessen the blow. “sorry” could also have been uttered because of desperation and she wants you to believe that she’s sorry so you’ll try to save her first. Of course, she could actually be sorry BUT…
#2 it is always always always the person-who-cheats’ fault. ALWAYS. They are the only ones with a social contract (unspoken: dating, legalized and written: married [ in this case written since it's your wife]) that binds them to monogamy and faithfulness. The only thing the lover can do is attempt to PERSUADE your partner to cheat, however, ultimately she is at fault for succumbing to it. It matters not if it was YOUR fault to begin with, making her marriage unhappy and thereby causing her to find an alternative, SHE should divorce you FIRST instead of cheating.
Therefore, based on emotional and non-moral reasons, saving the man would still be the path I take. I mean come on, my wife’s gonna be the bomb so what warm blooded male would NOT try to steal her from her husband?
8. THERE IS NO “SECRETLY FIND A WAY TO CONVEY TO YOUR FRIEND THAT HIS WIFE HIS CHEATING ON HIM” option.
This question really depends on intention. The reason behind each decision would be the deciding factor.
If you choose not to tell your friend because you are afraid of losing your job, then that is an immoral reason. What makes the bond of friendship so important to our society? Because it is a categorical imperative to honour the social contract that we’ve made with someone to care for and protect them in return for the same thing (according to morals) Of course, this imperative is overridden if your friend has broken Hobbes’ version of the Social Contract as it pertains to the whole of society ( which means if your friend has broken the law, then it breaks his contract with society, therefore he is also exempt from the sub-contract of friendship that is, itself, enforced by the umbrella contract of the Social Contract)
If you choose not to help your friend because you pretty much swore an oath of confidentiality when you took this job then that is the moral decision. Telling the truth is a Kantian Categorical Imperative. Keeping promises falls under telling the truth. According to the Universal Law Test, the breaking of promises whenever one desires to is self-destructive to the existence of the “promise”. Therefore if we were to accept that promises do exist, then we must honour them unless dire consequences outweigh the triviality of the promise itself.
Therefore, if the only reason I would not want to tell my friend is because I’m afraid for my job, then I should tell my friend.
On the other hand, if I were to not tell my friend because I am honouring my oath of confidentiality, then I should not tell my friend.
Emotional (therefore it has nothing to do with morals)
reason for latter decision:
Your friend will never know you knew and if she’s cheating on him he’s doing something wrong in the first place (since, logically, if you marry someone it means you loved them to begin with and they did something [ or neglected to do something] to keep that love burning)
7. I KNOW how TERRIBLE it would be to have your daughter raped by a disgusting excuse for a human being. HOWEVER, you are NOT allowed to kill him or hurt him in any way EXCEPT in the way described by this question. No matter how much you want to do it, that is not the purpose of this exercise and this question, so please, refrain from doing it.
That being said the moral thing to do would be to speak up and provide the alibi. IT WOULD BE VERY VERY tempting NOT to and let him rot in jail. HOWEVER, that would be a decision made BASED ON EMOTION and NOT rational moral thinking.
Rapists should be tried and punished for RAPE, NOT murder. Although we would like to believe, especially if you are the parent, that life-sentence is too short for someone who has raped your 8 year old daughter, the judicial system doesn’t work like that.
This argument, in very basic and non-emotional terms, would be like punching someone back for punching you. Eye for an eye. However, if you were to NOT speak, thereby condemning him to a murder sentence, then you are effectively stabbing a man for punching you, which is a grossly disproportionate retaliation in comparison to the previous action.
Emotional aspect to the response (outside the bounds of these questions):
After you provide the alibi, you could always then ask the man to confess in return for your kindness in providing him the alibi for murder. This of course may not work but hey, you did your part morally. Remember, YOU are held responsible for YOUR morality and HE is to HIS. There is absolutely NO moral justification to allow him to be thrown in jail for murder rather than rape.
6.BESIDES the fact that if a pregnant woman is stuck in the mouth of the cave then she’ll die ANYWAY from starvation, she should be blown up.
This case is a very defined case of utilitarianistic values. Although it is justifying treating people as a means to an end rather than the ends themselves, in this case the lives of many outweigh the life of one (especially if the woman is going to die of starvation anyway if they don’t blow her up, but that is outside the bounds of this question). The question should have been more specific about the fate of the woman.
On the other hand, blowing up the woman would fall under the maxim of “It is ok to commit murder (murder being the killing of an innocent) if it will save you”. This is obviously a very flawed maxim, however it is the case in this situation. It matters not how many lives are at stake, using the probability metaphor, Pocket Aces will win 70-80% of the time preflop against any other two-card hand in texas hold’em. However, it does not mean that if you do not win the first two or first three hands then you will win the next eight or seven consecutive hands because they are each considered separate events. This is how we should view the people in the cave, as separate events that hold no sway over the choice between self-sacrifice or sacrificing others. In this case, it would be the MORAL thing for you NOT to blow the woman up. The deciding factor in this moral dilemma is the focus of the decision-makers.
The decision-makers are the ones with the dynamite, not the pregnant lady. Therefore it is IMMORAL for the dynamite-holders to blow the woman up for their own sakes, HOWEVER it WOULD be moral for the woman to volunteer to sacrificer herself and vice versa if she decides to be selfish.
The latter would fall under the same maxim “It is ok to cause the deaths of others in order to save oneself” however voluntary self-sacrifice falls under the maxim “It is ok to sacrifice oneself in order to save others” which is a perfectly acceptable maxim.
Final decision: With the information we are given in the question (meaning the woman will live if the rest die) then the MORAL thing to do would be to let the tide drown you.
5. THERE IS NO CHANCE OF SAVING THE NIECE IF YOU SAVE THE DAUGHTER. KAPUT. NONE. No more trying to wiggle your way out of it.
Therefore it is an easy answer. Morally speaking you are OBLIGED to save the niece. 0% vs 50%, obvious. The only reason the titles of daughter and niece were placed in this question is to appeal to your sentimental sides. Morally, however, you MUST save the one with a higher chance of survival.
Emotional Response: I’d save my daughter, and screw morality, but this exercise is here for people to think about the MORAL way.
4. Easy… very very easy… and also THIS QUESTION ASSUMES YOU WILL ABSOLUTELY go to jail if you confess, and the other option is that YOU MIGHT go to jail for LONGER HOWEVER you also MIGHT NOT EVER go to jail.
This question should not be considered with “maybe i’ll get a lighter sentence if I fess up” in mind.
You must, morally speaking, confess. You just must. You did it, you confess.
Pretty obvious, if you are not going to confess then you are being selfish and being selfish is immoral.
3. THERE IS NO “confess so I’m the one tried so they can both live” and there is no “maybe they’ll get away” and there is no “we’ll just book it” or “consult a lawyer”
The consequences and options are given: Kid confess, Kid die/imprisoned for life; Wife confess, wife die/imprisoned for life.
MORALLY speaking the son should take the blame. Same dilemma as #4. He did it, he should take the fall.
Whether or not your wife will ever forgive you is not what matters, what matters is the morality of the situation. letting your wife take the blame would leave the criminal (your son) free of responsibility and that is unacceptable; morally of course. I’m sure that any loving parent, in the face of their child’s potential death, would step in an willingly sacrifice themselves for their child’s sake, but that is not the moral thing to do, that is the emotional/sentimental thing to do.
2. Morally speaking, out of all the other ones, this should be the hardest one to answer because this question does not deal with sentimentality but true impartiality. To some, torture is worse than death, and to some the vice versa. As an advocate of capital punishment for proven murderers, child-molesters/rapists I would say that the madman has forfeit his right to rights by threatenning to potentially (and that potential is an unavoidable one) kill 1000 people. Therefore it would be completely fine to torture him to find out where the bombs are. However, it would be completely inappropriate and unjustifiable to torture his WIFE to accomplish the same thing. SHE has not forfeit her right to rights, therefore SHE cannot be submitted to torture, even if it is to save 1000 people. Again, this would fall under the maxim of “It is ok to kill someone in order to save others” which is actually very debatable, but since our society has already established that treating people as means to an end is IMMMORAL then we cannot torture the wife to save even a million people… MORALLY. Realistically, however, you would.
Verdict: Moral to torture madman, Immoral to torture wife.
1. Again depends on which moral theory you rely on.
Utilitarian point of view: Jump ship, better for one guarunteed life than no guarunteed lives. This applies if it wasn’t you jumping but someone else.
Kantian point of view: stay in the ship, everyone should be given the same chance of survival. Maxim invoked if you jumped ship: “It is ok to save yourself at the cost of other lives” flawed maxim, therefore it would not be ok to jump.
ship.
The moral decision, therefore, concerns the same problem that #6 had to deal with: the focus of the decision-maker. Since the decision-maker is the one being saved, it would be immoral for the decision-maker to jump. However, it would be the moral thing to do if the decision-maker was the one to decide that SOMEONE ELSE should jump.
Since this question’s decision-maker is also the one to be saved, it would be the immoral choice; therefore he should (I should) not jump ship.
Leaving morals aside: I’d jump the fuck over. FUCK the rest, I want to live. Who says the rescue team would come around in 2 hours? Who can possibly blame you for wanting to jump ship? If any of the others were given the same choice, they’d all grab at the other ship.
If anybody wants to comment on my decisions PLEASE DO SO USING A MORAL STANDPOINT because I know VERY WELL what I would choose to do if MORALS weren’t an issue. I want to see counter-arguments using moral theories not “you are so heartless blah blah blah”
April 30th, 2008 at 7:38 am
oops… I mean lower chance of survival for dilemma #5
May 4th, 2008 at 4:17 am
for #1
use some ingenuity – get your friends boat over next to yours and either lash the two boats together, providing greater buoyancy for the damaged boat. Or have a rope so the friends boat can almost pull the damaged vessel while they bail the water. The lashing would def be the better option, however this is not possible is those on the friends boat are a$$holes…
May 5th, 2008 at 6:47 pm
Many of these don’t seem so tough to me – its more a matter of placing the needs of the man yabove the needs of your family.
As for number 7, I think I”d have to provide the allibi on pargmatic grounds, insofar as it simply isn’t possible to *know* he did it unless you saw him. There are plenty of people who have given their lives, and taken others lives, for that which they were convinced of. Just because you believe osmething with intensity doesn’t mean its true. And if we allow people to act on intuition rather than proof, the entirety of civilization goes down the crapper.
May 5th, 2008 at 9:01 pm
Shroom,
While I feel your frustration about people “adding” options to your list , I feel that it is very patronizing to go a step further and explain what YOU consider to be the only true and correct answer to any given scenario. It turned me off to answering, after enjoying reading the entire thread. One shouldn’t have to “debate” how they feel they might react in a hypothetical situation. While your thoughts on the subject are just as interesting as the other posters, I feel your dissertation on the assumed correct responses was very off-putting and the tone was more than a tad condesending.
I could be wrong, as tone is hard to “feel” over the internet, but it killed the entire thread for me.
May 5th, 2008 at 9:04 pm
sorry.it should read “the list” not “your list”.
May 6th, 2008 at 10:56 am
Shroom,
I owe an apology. Your exuberance in discussing a topic was not cause for me to judge it’s merits. I blame it on posting on day two of no sleep due to an abcessed tooth which put me in an intolerant mood. Feeling slightly better today, so I will now join in and answer the dilemmas posed.
10) My son is already a dead man, but it will not be by my hands.
9)I would follow triage protocol. If I were not able to distance myself from emotions in that type of job I would most likely have already been filtered out.
8)Have actually been in a similar situation. I would follow company procedure and let the chips fall where they may. There’s a reason the saying “Don’t kill the messenger” is still around.
7)I would not step forward.
6)The dynamite blast would likely cause a cave in, unless the said person with the stick was a demolitions expert. So all are likely to risk death with either option. Better one than none.
5)I would rescue the niece while explaining to my daughter to follow me by swimming parallel to the beach, avoiding the rip that will wear a swimmer out and allow rest breaks, such as floating, until my daughter has regained her breath and strength. While the scenario said to choose one to actively save, it did not preclude communicating with the other victim.
4)In reality, prison is not a likely outcome unless there are mitigating circumstances (drugs, alcohol, etc) since these were not mentioned, I will assume it is not a factor and explain to the woman that I am not sure exactly what happened, and then give a truthful and factual account to the investigating officers and let the chips fall where they may.
3)If I had prior knowledge of my son’s love for the herb, I would consider it part of my responsibility to ensure he understood the laws before traveling. Since I had prior knowledge of a potential situation and did not do my part to prevent it, I feel I am also culpable. And as with question 10, I am morally responsible (according to my definition of parent) to prevent him from a lifetime .yes.a lifetime spent in a horrid prison or the death penalty, I would step forward and claim the bag.
2)The word “threatened” to me is the key to this situation. There is no proof. I would not resort to torture, nor would I involve the wife unless she were somehow incriminated in the supposed plot.
1)I would stay in the lifeboat. In for a penny, in for a pound. Dance with the one that brung ya. Or insert any other quaint phrase that applies.
I found it interesting that many replies seemed to contradict each other. Some would fight heroically to save a doomed son from hanging, yet would let them suffer the same potential fate if a small amount of drugs are involved.
We are such complex and interesting beings.
May 6th, 2008 at 12:00 pm
Hahah my bad, my list wasn’t a “be all” list, it was just what I thought was right, and I wanted to know the decisions other people would make based on the moral stand point rather than to try to wiggle out of each situation by trying to add a new twist to them. My opinnion is FAR from being the absolute answer to each situation since morality is actually supremely debatable and mine are only based off a few different theories established by some major philosophers
Sure it may sound condescending, but hey! Sure it’s encouraged to think outside the box, else how would our world progress right? But I feel in this exercise the situations should be taken at face value where the outcomes are already established. I’m pretty sure we’re not supposed to be trying to find a solution where everyone is happy. Only when one can settle down and realize that there are only two outcomes can one THEN get depressed about which option in the dilemma one should pick. It’s not as emotional and stressful to try to think of a solution to solve all the problems rather than to HAVE to pick between your neice or your daughter.
Getwhattamean?
May 6th, 2008 at 1:23 pm
Shroom,
Thanks for your gallant acceptance of my apology. I henceforth promise not to post when delirious with pain.
May 9th, 2008 at 10:00 am
10: I would jump the gaurd, even if I died in the process. Not like so many people aren’t gonna die anyways.
9: I don’t know what I would do. Is she sorry she was cheating, or sorry that she got caught?
8: I would tell my friend that I think he should see the email, though it wouldn’t be easy.
7: I would let him go to jail… play the ignorant one.
6: Try to get her out of the way harder! If she is stuck there, she is gonna die eventually. It also depends on how old the other people. if they are all old geezers, they should just die. if they are young, and maybe some children with them, blast her out of there.
5: I would try to save both of them. I love my brother way too much to be able to tell him “your daughter is dead, but it is okay because I saved mine.”
4: I am a strictly honest person. That statement right there should let you all know what I would do.
3: Well, the decision I would make in this one completely contradicts the statement i made for #4. I wouldn’t let my son take the blame, and I would never let my wife take the blame for something like that! I would use my cunning to try to get out of it, but i am not the only genius in the world ^^
2: Evacuate the city!!! Everyone get out right now!
1: well, I would like to believe that I would stay in the boat and try to last for those 5 hours. However, I know that I would leave and join my friend on his boat.
May 9th, 2008 at 7:30 pm
Dear Shroom,
albeit I agree with your Moral answers for each dillema (i thought your explanation of each of them except #10 were flawless), I must point that the purpose of the exercise is actually verify if people stick to the non-Moral answers.
The dillemas are dillemas because they present a difficult choice between what is MORALLY expected and what is EMOTIONALLY compelling. If it was not so, they wouldn’t be dillemas at all, would they?
And even so, I must disagree with your Moral view about #10. Integrity theory does not apply to the scenario at hand. The guard gave you the options so if you choose not to kill your son he will kill any other inmate. You know he’ll do it so YOUR choice will trigger the events. Of course he is responsible for the killing but what that particular exercise presents is that the two possible outcomes are trigged by YOUR course of action. The guard acts just as an instrument of impending doom, forcing you into the moral dillema, much like the agonizing and approaching death of #9 and the water of #5 and #1.
I’m sorry about any typos, mispellings and english grammar errors, for I am not a native English user.
June 5th, 2008 at 7:09 pm
Okay, see what ya think of these.
10. Not pull the chair. The bastard’ll kill another inmate anyway.
9. Save the man. He has a chance to live, and HE wasn’t cheating on me. She was.
8. Talk to the friends wife on the down-low (after printing out a copy of the incriminating e-mail with the footprints on it – that way, the twit can’t try getting me fired without me turning the e-mail over to her hubby… I’m ethical, not stupid).
7. Assuming I hadn’t killed the creep myself when my kid was molested? I’d tell the cops the truth.
6. I’d use the dynamite to close off wherever the tide was coming in and tell the pregnant lady to scream for outside help. Duh….
5. Knowing how well my kids swim? I’d save my niece first (I swear my kids are part tuna).
4. Tell the woman to calm down – I’m pretty sure it was my stupid fault.
3. No way I’d let my wife or my son run the risk of the death penalty for marijuanna. I’d take the rap and call in the Canadian consulate ASAP!
2. Torture the mad bomber. Don’t bring the guys wife into it unless I had evidence she was involved… but IMPLY to the bomber I’d hurt his missus.
1. “Screw you guys! I’m taking the next boat!” (You didn’t say that any of my friends or family was in my original lifeboat, so tough luck to them)
June 20th, 2008 at 6:04 am
10. Really, I think I’ll just look at my son’s eyes and hope that he understands. It’s a terrible choice, but I shouldn’t risk another man’s life for my own selfish reasons.
9. This decision was ina way, spurred on by the sentence “Even if she gets attention there’s a very high chance she’ll die.” Again, I shouldn’t tend to my wife first just because she’s, well, my wife. I would save the man, although I’ll do it a little reluctantly. I wouldn’t leave the man to die just because I most probably hate him for what he’s done. One should never be blinded by hatred. After all, the man has a life too. I’ll do my best and see if I manage to save my wife after I save the man.
8. I would tell my friend about his wife’s affair. This concerns somebody’s marriage. I think a marriage is VERY VERY important. It’s not worth it “betraying” the friendship between me and my friend for the sake of my job. I know that a job is really important but, sometimes, morals are just equally as important.
7. I’ll tell the police exactly what I saw: Him at the restaurant, eating…yada yada yada. I’ll leave the case for the police to solve. After all, it’s not like I’m a professional FBI or some sort of great detective. I can’t prove him guilty of the murder, nor can I prove him innocent. Maybe he did pay someone to kill his wife. However, I’ll tell him that I will tell the police that I saw him at the restaurant, and that MIGHT, but not 100%, prove him innocent, that is if he is. (but that’s up to the police and judge to decide)On one condition, he must confess to the police about the rape incident.
6. I will not kill the woman. This has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with her being pregnant or not. The woman is innocent. Who gave you the right to end her life JUST because you can save more lives? It’s like killing one innocent child to save 99 criminals. People, MORALS!!! So what if you’re holding a stick of dynamite in your hand. I would never ever actively kill a per son like that, unless she’s stuck with the dynamite and I can only save her by killing every other person in the cave. If not, I WILL NOT kill the woman.
5. Honestly, I’d save my niece. Cos’ I have enough trust in my daughter that she can swim to safety or at the very least stay afloat till I get to her. I have faith in my daughter.
4. Seriously, some of you have NO, NADA, NONE, ZERO INTEGRITY. Take the blame. You did it, you pay for it. The guilt’s not worth living with even if you get away with the jail sentence. Trust me.
3. My son did it, he pay for it. I know that this is a hard, cruel and even sadistic choice, but sometimes, that’s the way life is.
2. DO NOT torture the wife. She is innocent. What gives you the right to torture her just for something that her husband did. She is innocent. Meaning, she probably didn’t know about it at all. Even if she did, she did not participate in her husband’s terrible terrorist activities. This proves that even if she knew what her husband was doing, she disapproved and disagreed with his actions. Or maybe she was simply too meek to turn her husband to the police before that. Or she was threatened and blackmailed by her own husband. And, the important thing is, THE BOMBER IS A MADMAN. He would just watch his wife die without an inkling of guilt or even concern, for that matter. Torture the madman for all I care, but torture him just enough to get the information needed out of him. Then stop immediately. Torture is not something funny. It’s very serious, although the bomber deserves it, after all, it is illegal.
1. I will STAY. Who gave me the right to run like a coward and abandon my comrades or rather, risk their lives to save my own skin. It’s a tough decision since it concerns my own life. Still, what’s the point of living when you’ve got such a heavy burden of pure guilt to carry on your shoulders. Die a fighter. Don’t live a coward. The value of a coward isn’t worth half a penny of a brave fighter who struggled to stay and help the rest as much as he could until the very end. All I can do is pray hard that the rescue teams would arrive soon enough to save all of us. I know my friend signaled for me to go over and join them on their boat so I don’t have to continue bailing water out and I can save my own life. I really appreciate him and I would like to thank him for that. I’ll shake my head and mouth “thank you” before their boat goes out of sight to let him know that his concern and kindness is greatly appreciated, just in case I might never get to get a chance or opportunity to thank him.
June 20th, 2008 at 6:19 am
Shroom, your answers to the exercise are (almost) flawless. BUT, you shouldn’t give politically right answers. This exercise is NOT for you to give answers based on morals. The questions are just LINKED to morals. At that particular oint of time, when placed in the exact same situation, YOU DO NOT HAVE TIME TO REASON YOUR CHOICES OUT. YOU DON’T THINK ABOUT MORALS. EVERYTHING HAPPENS WITHIN A SPLIT SECOND. YOU DO IT, OR YOU DON’T DO IT. The (almost) in the first sentence is due to your choice for dilemma 6. I absolutely DO NOT agree with that reasoning. It is CRAPPY. Other than that, I agree with all of the other answers you gave. Although for some dilemmas, I have very different reasonings for them.
June 20th, 2008 at 11:04 am
I think it’s pretty much impossible to know what you’ll do in any situation until you’re actually in it. We all know what we think we’d do, but you can’t really know.
June 22nd, 2008 at 6:54 am
First a bit of praise/flame.
Seymour – Congratulations. Trying to take the moral high-ground while showing no moral fibre, quite a good trick, are you in politics?
Shroom – At last, someone who understands the game, there are NO other options.
(But you don’t get away scott free. 1st line of the “Concentration camp” scenario. WHAT? The inmates were guilty?)
Too many good/bad posts to comment on everything but anyone who has made the effort to think & reply deserves to be praised.
Now it’s my turn to incur the wrath of the readers.
Concentration camp
Isn’t this the same as “Drug bust”? The boy made a decision (escape/smuggle) that had a consequence (hang/jail).
Anyway, as the father you would not be saving an innocent man, you would be creating a guilty one by murdering your son. Treat the guard with contempt, ignore him & his actions, by joining in you accept some of the guards guilt.
The accident
The wife is having an affair, the lover is not (Yeah, yeah, he could be cheating on his wife, whatever.) Emergency workers are trained how to prioritise, this should be the deciding factor.
Spam filtering
Ignore it. Your moral commitment is to your promise of confidentiality. Why try & force your views onto others, your friend may suspect the affair but is happy to ignore it as long as it’s discreet.
The neighbour (Correct spelling, I’m English)
So there’s enough evidence to convict him already, will your testimony make any difference to that? The law has to prove guilt “Beyond reasonable doubt” ALL the evidence should be made available for the court to make a decision.
(Here’s a thought, there’s enough evidence to convict even though you know he can’t have killed his wife. Could the “Evidence” provided by your daughter also leave room for the mans innocence?)
Pregnant woman
Is it right to sacrifice an innocent person to save others?
On this occasion I agree with Shroom (I think) the only person who can decide is the woman herself.
Nieces & daughters
Save the niece first then go back for the daughter she may still be alive, the other way round is condemning your niece to certain death.
Hit & run
Say what you see. You may have hit the person or it could have been the kerb. You were wrong to take your concentration from the road but that doesn’t make you automatically guilty of everything else that occurred.
Let the courts make the decision as to guilt.
P.s Did the bloke jump out in front of the car suicide style?
Drug bust
The officer asked a question, answer it. He wasn’t asking who owned the drugs, who was guilty, who should go to jail he asked who the bag belonged to.
The mad bomber
I don’t think torture is justifiable especially on innocent people so carving up the wife is out.
Torture against someone with mental health problems? (You said he was a “Madman”) Isn’t “Not guilty through insanity” an absolute defence.
Get someone to pretend to be a lawyer, to protect his “Fifth” rights the “lawyer” would need to know the facts. Any confession would be inadmissable in court but the bombs will be found.
(Shroom – I think this falls within the rules, doesn’t it? Looks like I just promoted you to moderator)
Lifeboat
Just realised this question is the hardest simply by having me involved in the life/death decision does that show me up as a coward? Hippocrite? Both?
Do I owe the others anything? Do I condemn them to CERTAIN death by swapping or just increase their risk?
If we were being chased by lions should I stay with the slowest person & help them along to increase their chance of survival (We MAY reach the safety of the trees)?
Well, that’s a darn sight more than 30 seconds gone by so I’d best take my turn at bailing.
Not very philosophical answers but they feel right. I’m a moral person so any decision I make must be moral.
Of course what I would ACTUALLY do is run, fight, kill, steal, lie, do anything to save my kids, partner, self, extended family, friends, others (In that order) & fuck anyone/anything that gets in my way!
P.s I’ve got a book “100 Moral Dilemas” I stole it! Pick the bones out of that!
June 22nd, 2008 at 1:44 pm
10. What I would WANT to do: I would look to see if he was ready to be hanged… If the look in his eye says “I’m ready to take responsibility,” I’d pull the chair… Otherwise, I’d take the place of him.
What I would ACTUALLY do: I’d probably take to long trying to think of what to do, ending in (most likely) both our demise.
9. What I would WANT to do: I’d save my wife first. When they get better, we can try to work out our marraige. After I help her, I’d do all that I could for the partner.
What I would ACTUALLY do: After I had seen them and finally understood that she was having an affair… I’d probably stand there in shock, unable to move or think muchless save two people.
8. What I would WANT to do: I would not say specifically that his wife was having an affair, but I would drop subtle hints. Besides, THEIR marraige isn’t MY problem.
What I would ACTUALLY do: If we are good friends, I’d tell him durring an outing to lunch or something. But if we were just acquaintances, I wouldn’t say anything. Besides, THEIR marraige isn’t MY problem.
7. What I would WANT to do: I would tell him the “Alibi… confess” thing.
What I would ACTUALLY do: Move somewhere else and try to forget the whole thing.
6. (Well, that certainly is a strange situation…)
What I would WANT to do: Light the dynomite (even though the cave would become pretty messy and her insides would end up being washed to shore.)
What I would ACTUALLY do: Get some one else to light the dynomite… Pretty much the same outcome.
5. What I would WANT to do: Use my superhuman stregnth to save both!
What I would ACTUALLY do: Frantically save my child then check if the niece is alive.
4. What I would WANT to do: I’d take the blame. After all, it was an accident.
What I would ACTUALLY do: Same.
3. I’m not touching this one with a sixty foot pole.
2. What I would WANT to do: Torture the bastard and save people!
What I would ACTUALLY do: Why on earth would I be working for the gov’t?!?!
1. What I would WANT to do: Fuck those people! I’m getting out of here!
What I would ACTUALLY do: Stay. No guarantee my friend would get out alive either.
June 30th, 2008 at 11:52 am
9- id let both of the bastards die… what goes around comes around…. =-)
July 15th, 2008 at 10:15 am
concerning the one with ur wife and her lover in an accident,its a no brainer.let the lover die and try to save ur wife.if ur wife survives-shes lost her lover and shes stuck with u. u can watch her writhe in pain for the rest of her life with the guilt of a)having had an affair and b)having killed her lover
July 16th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
Number 3 is by far the hardest choice to make.
I read a lot of comments above wich said that the son should take the blame, because it’s his fault and he deserves it. Well, it is his fault – but that doesn’t mean it’s right that he gets punished for a bit of marijuana!
I have no idea what I would do.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:13 am
10-Hit the guard on the head and make a run for it with my son and others
9-I’m not the only friggin person on the job, someone else can save the partner while i save my wife
8-Confront the person, if they deny, go straight to my boss and say they are using business emails for pure pleasure.
7-First of all, I wouldn’t have moved after my daughter got raped, I would’ve beaten the shit outta my neighbour.
But if I didn’t do that I probably would just stay quiet. Hey, the man can get away with rape, who’s to say he cant find a lawyer?
6-Do whatever it takes to get the pregnant lady (who is indeed a dumbass for getting stuck somewhere during her pregnancy) out of the place she is stuck in. If it goes in, it should come out right? Or ask the crazy idiot with the dynamite if he has any soap or liquid dishwasher so we can ease her out.
5-Get my wife to help me. Or if she can’t swim either, in which case i regret taking this trip with her, get a floaty large object, get both kids to hang on, and drag them to shore. Then yell myself hoarse at them for being so irresponsible.
4-Take the blame, then suicide. Pay for the dead guy’s life with mine, I couldn’t live with the fact I’d killed someone. ALl thoe years in jail would make me go crazy
3-Higher a lawyer for my kid. If we won the case for my son’s stupidity I’d force him to move out. No way am I having marijuana around the house.
2-Torture that idiot until he speaks.
1-Smack the idiot who was lowering the boat, and then attempt to get back on the ship and gather materials for patching the boat up. Oh yea, and tell my friend on the other boat to tell my family I loved them.
Needless to say, these “Moral Dilemmas” were caused by some idiots. But seriously, this is all jsut written down. After watching so much television, with drastic situations like these, such as when faced with your wife cheating what would you do, it isn’t as dire as situation 9, but honestly, chances are seriously slim of you being a paramedic and finding your wife and her secret lover all smashed up.
August 2nd, 2008 at 2:55 pm
1. This is the only one I can answer. I’d stay in the boat, and try to let my friend know that if he is rescued first, that we can’t last long.
August 16th, 2008 at 7:56 pm
Ok…
10: Pull out the chair as instructed, then kill the guard with the chair (or at least try).
9: Tell her you forgive her, then save her lover. She dies happy and her lover has to live with the guilt, you go on living knowing everyone got what they deserved; she was forgiven but paid with her life, her lover will live a life of guilt, and you are free from the betrayal.
8: Confront your friend’s wife’s lover, he KNOWS you read the email, the information does not leave the company, so you keep your job, and, knowing that he has been caught out, the lover is likely to change his ways.
7: Do not provide an alibi for him, he may be guilty of this crime, but he is guilty of the rape of your daughter, so he deserves to be punished, even if it is for the wrong crime.
6: Use the dynamite to blow everyone up. You are a team and should all go down together.
5: Save your neice and take the risk with your daughter, a risk is better than certain death.
4: Admit that you did it, you can’t let someone else suffer for your guilt.
3: Turn him in, he is guilty and the victim of his own foolhardiness, no one else should suffer for his guilt.
2: Torture the crap out of him, why should it matter if one scumbag suffers to save hundreds of innocent people, as for his wife, if she was aware of his crimes but stayed with him anyway, she is just as guilty and so is fair game for torture, if she was unaware, but torturing her is the only way to get the details from him, do it, but go easy and make sure she will suffer no lasting effects.
1: Stay put, you’re part of the group’s dilemma now and you shouldn’t leave them to save your own skin.
Of course some of these solutions would be harder in practise.
August 17th, 2008 at 10:35 pm
Ryan (140) Who? I missed something here.
JFrater
For all the comments of mine you have erased (Why, I don’t know)why should this pass?
August 17th, 2008 at 10:54 pm
JFrater
I’m serious. This is beyond ugly
August 17th, 2008 at 11:07 pm
Vera: I wasn’t aware of the comments here – I have removed them. When you register as a user you get a little link beside each comment to use for reporting abuse – a good way for me to keep track. Fortunately someone else saw your comment and told me I needed to investigate
August 19th, 2008 at 3:04 am
10. pull out the chair, because he was dying of cancer anyways.
9. revive the man and go out to tea with him. kick your wife beforehand. sorry just isnt good enough.
8. kill the wifeand husbad. track dow he lver and kill him. serve the tim in jail. problem solved.
7. let him sit in jail, jacking off over an 8 year olds under developed body. sicko.
6. blow the shit outof the pregant lady. she an cop it for being so stpid and leading them all into that predicament.
5. if theres a 50% chance of etting the daughter out second, then get the daughter out second. for fucks sake, you wouldnt even have that muc time to calculate that. fucking idiots. just go with what your heart says. maybe call out for help. that would work. think of the possiblities noob.
4. how can you even be sure you hit the erson in the first place? all it said was you felt someting soldid. you probably glanced a telegraph pole as you drifted off he road, span in front of another car, the other car swerved and hit the person. the lady cops it.
3. point at a random balinese senior citizen. it could be funny.
2. yeah. because we are human and we jack off to hat kind of shit, and afterwards wipe the man sauce on animals. its normal.
1. goto the friends boat. when your drifting away from the sinkin lifeboat, make funny faces and call out taunts as you watch them struggle. hehe.
August 21st, 2008 at 10:04 am
10. I would not kill my son. I would pretend to walk up to the chair but then I would grab the guard’s gun and shoot him and any other guards near me. Then I would shoot the rope to free my son and we all try to escape. I know it sounds like something from a movie and unlikely to work, but if it didn’t then I would die but it wouldn’t matter because I would probably die anyway.
9. I would help my wife and call for backup to help the man.
8. I would tell my friend but make him promise to not tell anyone how he found out.
7. He probably wouldn’t be alive to kill his wife but if he was I wouldn’t say anything unless I had any doubt that he raped her.
6. I would lask the pregnant woman what she wanted and decide based on her answer. If she said to kill her I would be less willing to because she was willing to sacrifice herself for us. If she started yelling for us to not kill her I probably would. Either way I wouldn’t want to be the one to light the dinemite.
5. I would drag them both sideways out of the rip tide. Everyone should know to not fight a rip tide but swim parralel to it. I don’t see why I wouldn’t be able to drag both of them to the side and let them rest and then swim in on their own.
4. I would ask everyone around me what they saw and whoever they saw hit the person I would believe them even if it meant I was responsible.
3. I would say it is my son’s but that it is medical marijuanna. They wouldn’t be able to tell just by looking at him whether or not he really had the symptoms of someone who needs it. They would probably take him to a hospital and while waiting for the results I would try to run from the hospital with him. P.S. How could he be dumb enough to bring weed on a plane?
2. I would torture him but at the same time have all of the cops searching for the bomb. If he doesn’t answer then I would pretend to torture his wife. If she doesn’t cooperate then she isn’t innocent so I’d actually torture. If I find the bomb and then he tells the judge that he was tortured, then me and all of the other officers would lie. It’s his and his wife’s word against the entire police force.
1. I would stay and help. Although I don’t see how I would figure out all of that math before we sank. Then I’d tell my friend to get help because there would probably be enough empty seats for all of us in other boats.
This is a very good list and I thought about it a lot. I think the hardest ones are Concentration Camp and Drug Bust (maybe because they both involve dangerous escapes and risking my son’s life.)
September 3rd, 2008 at 4:23 pm
10. The son is going to die anyway so pull out the chair. Might as well make the best of a bad situation.
9. I’d be tempted to walk away and screw them both. But its simple; I owe this guy nothing and as long as there’s a chance to save my wife, she comes first.
8. Confront the friends wife and give her an ultimatum that either she tells him or you do. If she bites and tells him herself, you’re saved. If she calls you bluff then I guess you just have to think about #1, i.e. just keep your mouth shut and do your job.
7. I’d relish having the bastard rot in jail.
6. Numbers will decide it. If there are more than two of us stuck then I’ll use the dynamite. However, if I’m stuck with someone I love (child or spouse) then tough luck pregnant woman. If I love the pregnant woman then God help anyone trying to blow her up. Hopefully I’m not stuck with my kid while at the same time the pregnant woman is my wife.
5. This ones the toughest I think but I’d try save them both until things reach a point where it’s clear I can only save one or the other. In that case the daughter will come first.
4. This ones simple. I’d man up and take responsibility for what I did.
3. The son’s a dumb prick. But then what’s a man good for if not for protecting his family. I’d have to take the rap for the son.
2. Torture the bomber and the wife if necessary. The torture might not kill the wife, the bombs will certainly kill many. The good of the many outweighs that of the one in my book (as long as I’m not personally invested).
1. I’d jump off the boat. I don’t know these people and certainly do not owe them my life.
September 16th, 2008 at 7:58 pm
Why would you do this to me? D:
September 20th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
10. Rush the guard and try to kill him before you and your son are killed. Take as many out before you go.
9. Go help someone else let em both die they deserve it.
8. Send it and tell your friend
7. Only help him if your asked.
6. Light it
5. Your daughter
4. If you can live with the guilt then let them feel responsible
3. Your son’s, he is eighteen. He made the bed, he has to lay in it.
2. Torture him, let the others go.
1. Jump and swim you can always throw the weakest one on the new boat off to help the others.
September 25th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
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October 4th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
10. I honestly don’t know what I would do. Probably kill my son… You know, I don’t actually know if I could stand doing that… Oh man I’m glad I’ll never be in that situation!!
9. I feel I’d have a duty to my husband and save him. Well, I’d hope to be able to save them both…
8. I would not tel them. (Knowing me I couldn’t help myself though…) Secrets always come out in the end anyway. And I’m sure that if my friend was a true friend they would understand if they knew I knew and didn’t tell them.
7. Honestly I wouldn’t do anything out of laziness. But having to choose,I would let the police know he was at the restaurant. If he did pay someone I’m sure the police would find out.
6 This is so sad… I don’t think I Can decide… I would want to save the others, but I honestly don’t know if I could bring myself to kill a pregnant women…
5. I would save my niece first. And tell my daughter to be strong and that I love her (Just in case… )
4. If I was careless enough to do this and it happened I wouldn’t let someone else take the blame for it.
3. I would tell them who’s it is.
2. Torture her.
1. I wouldn’t leave my boat.
October 4th, 2008 at 5:10 pm
I think the big question is not “what would you do in these situations?” but “would you actually act the way you just responded if the situation actually arose?”. We can come up with whatever answers we’d like, but would our strong moral convictions supercede conflicting survival instincts.
What is the cost of one’s life? Is one equal to another? Can you make that call? Do you have the right or competence to judge what makes a man more worthy to live?
Many things can change the answers one gives, such as their upbringing, religion, and mood. When asked whether they would save their mother, spouse, or child if they could only save one, a vast majority of Asian people respond with “mother”, because you can always have another child and another lover, but never another mother.
That being said, here are my answers:
10. If the Nazi wants to keep killing, let him. Don’t let him break your love because that would be the last thing he could do before he had you. Don’t kill your son.
9. I’m not sure of the EMT policies- I believe it would be to see who has the highest chance of living and save them. I think that, seeing as how your wife would die anyway, treating her and not him would kill him by negligence. Save him, then try to save her.
8. It’s actually a judgement call. Your friend may already know and may even approve of it! (Who knows, huh?) I suppose it wouldn’t hurt if the opportunity arose to help the path to knowledge a little, but in the end, keep it to yourself. (You could also “accidentally” forward the e-mail to your friend, but that would be difficult to prove as accidental.”
7. Again, you don’t know 100% this is the guy- could be someone who looked like him. I would tell the police.
6. Has anyone tried wetting her head/neck to see if it could be loosened? Maybe apply a cold pack. If she’s still stuck, then it’s the good of the many over the one/two.
5. I’d try to throw something to my daughter and get my neice. Still, I would tell her to be calm and save the neice first.
4. Since I wouldn’t know 100%, I would say, as mentioned above, that I’m not entirely sure it was me but could have been.
3. I would suspect it would be more probable for you to pool your resources and try to get him out of jail than him and your wife. This was *his* mistake, not your’s, and he is old enough to make those decisions.
2. Again, this assumes that he cares that much about his wife. Wouldn’t you have egg on your face if you tortured her and he didn’t care? Don’t torture her.
1. I don’t think I could put myself before so many people. I would stay in the boat, but then again there’s no guarantee that someone else wouldn’t.
October 7th, 2008 at 6:21 pm
10. i wouldnt push the chair, hes my child i wouldnt be able to live with myself.
9.i would save the man 1st because the wife as a slim chance of living.
8.i would keep my mouth shutt i have a family to provide for. plus karma always bites you in the a**
7.i would not tell the police he had it coming to him and he can rott in jail for the rest of his life for what he did to my daughter. and he probally paid somone plus that mans a sick bastard.
6. i guess i would use the dynamite because we would be saving 9 people instead of 2.
5.save the daughter 1st.
4.in reality you probally wont be stuck in jail so confess.
3.I dont agree with kelsi or whatever thats way up in the beggining of the comments.
i wouldnt be able to just tell the police that they were my sons because i would feel horrible. if he died and i would never be able to see him again. but i wouldnt take the blame for his mistakes. if i raised him right he would be a man and take the blame.
2.i would torture the mad man but not the wife. she did nothing wrong that we know off and its against the ammendments to torture but its also against the law to kill 100s cause you want too. so torture the crazy man butt leave the wife alone.
1. jump off and save myself. sorrry!!
October 13th, 2008 at 10:31 pm
10. Use hand to hand combat techniques to disarm the guard, then eliminate as many other guards using his gun. I sacrifice myself, but take out murderers with me.
9. Assuming both have equal odds of survival, save my wife.
8. Inform the adulteress of your information and request that she confess to her husband. If she does not, inform her husband.
7. Come clean with the police with all of your information.
6. If everyone is willing, let the pregnant women and her child live. If not, it depends upon how many people are trapped.
5. Save the niece, as the choice ensures one survivor, with a possibility of two.
4. Again, come clean with the police with all of my information.
3. I would come forward and take the blame. Once my wife and son were safely back in the US, say that it wasn’t me and request extradition.
2. The bomber is threatening 100s of innocent lives. It is known that the bomber is guilty. Any means are justified to save the 100s, so torture the bomber. Torturing the wife is not needed.
1. Remain on board to help the 9.
November 6th, 2008 at 1:04 pm
To start with I saw some extremely-ultra-super-duper smart comment guy. This is a dilemma! It sez there is no way out except two. Kill or beat the sadist guardian with chair or some far east tactics, buh! You’re not Bruce Lee or Arnold Civardagezer.
Meh, I’m an opportunist I love my life an’ I do every dirty rotten ways to save my life hehheh A’ma really bad guy >:D
10) I won’t kill my own son. If he will die, others must suffer!!!! The guardy will kill another people anyway.
9) Save whose chance to survive is higher. So, I save the man. No women no cry eh eh? I buy some cold beer and live the life.
Hehheh isn’t it simple? I simply don’t want to be fired. Let him to enlight himself. Not by me. I love my job.
7) A life-time prison should be too merciful. Assey nothin. After a moment I kidnap him and let all kinds of animals rape to him. Seconly I kidnap his relatives do them the same and let the bastardos rot in that room with crucified (Slow death crucification, means they will die because of thirst with high pain). >:D (Not kiddin, A’am serious)
6) Oh my Gosh what should I do? Hahahhahahhaahahhaha I’m laughing this question with my butt. Does this need an answer? Explode her.
5) This is a hard question. There is two ways: If the niece is my brother’s daughter I will save my niece. Iffff it’s my wife’s relative I don’t think, f*** off! I firstly save my own daughty.
4) Haha it’s easy peasy as number six. Guilt her, let her rot in the prison. I love myself, I have nothing to loose, am I an idiotic hydrotic magnetosphere resonans? No.
3) Har har har! Easy as a pie, mmmmm pie. I guilt her before she guilt herself and we will have a really good daddy sonny relationship. Didn’t you play Fallout 3? No womy no cry.
2) Torty everybody who is in the job. Because I will get a promotion because of this. Promoty=Money. If it’s not, I will get really angry and let him explode the city. I love firewurgs and slayation of innocent peepl.
1) Is this a questy? No it isn’t. Save my life. If I find a gun in that boat, fire at them so they won’t suffer. Or I changed my mind. Make a hand gesture to them and LET THEM SUFFER GREATLY!
I hope you didn’t find me evil, opportunist and sadistic as the questy 10 guardian. I’m a good person who always wants his profit. I hope I didn’t offensed any peepl. If I am, a’am terribly sorry as a pie, mmm warm apple pie.
November 7th, 2008 at 7:46 am
Pardon me. Correctin somthin on numbry seven
7) A life-time prison should be too merciful. Assey he was innocent, I say everything to save him. Is it my forgiveness? No. After a moment I kidnap him and let all kinds of animals rape to him. Seconly I kidnap his relatives do them the same and let the bastardos rot in that room with crucified hooked with sittn stake(Very slow deathy thingy in Ottoman Empr, means they will die because of thirst with high pain). >:D (Not kiddin, A’am serious)
November 7th, 2008 at 2:23 pm
1.Ideally you should stay for the greater good but then again, honestly though I’m selfish and I would go, plus if you stayed you could’ve all died, but if you go, atleast one person has 100% chance of survival. 2.Interrogate the crap out of him, and pressure his wife but not to an extreme. 3. let the kid take the blame, he has a better chance to get out of it with both parents paying court costs..plus his dumb ass did it. 4.You did it, fess up. 5. You should save the niece and try to get your daughter second since she has 50%, but people are selfish so they’d prob. save thier own..this reminds me of “The Good Son” 6.Who cares if she’s pregnant, greater good.7.Let his ass burn, rape victims are only in jail for a couple years if your lucky…fuck him back. 8.I’d tell my friend, you can get another job, he can get another wife..plus they could never trace it back to you legally. 9.Save the Wife! You love her! Its in the marriage contract! That other guy was fucking her, he’s a bastard. 10.You can only control your actions, if you want to kill your own son and can live with it, go ahead, I wouldn’t.
November 7th, 2008 at 2:40 pm
9)If your going to take up the “professional” thing to do, it just got unprofessional when you discovered it was your wife, and became personal…so you can’t act professional. You don’t just stop loving the person you married in an instant..if you truely love her you will save her. If your only letting her die because of cheating, then you never loved her. Switch your wife to your wife who’s done nothing or your child, and see what response you give.
November 11th, 2008 at 3:52 pm
10. Ideally, I would try to kill the officer and make an escape with everyone I could. Realistically, I would know that there is no hope for my son and, even if he could live, it would be a miserable existence. I would take the chair to spare him that.
9. I would save whichever one had the highest chance of living and try my best afterward to save the other. I would make sure my HUSBAND knows that, if he is the most likely to die, I didn’t deny him medical attention because I wanted revenge, but because he had practically no chance of surviving. It would not be my job to play god and decide that the man I love should get the better chance to recover, especially if he’ll probably die.
8. I would do nothing. My friend could not hold me accountable for something that could have endangered my job. If he/she were to ask me directly, I would probably say that I knew, but I wouldn’t reveal how.
7. In this case, I would give him the alibi. Yes, he took something precious from me, but two wrongs never make a right. It’s also possible that my generosity could evoke guilt in him, enough that he might confess for what he had done… Maybe the guilt would be punishment enough.
6. In dilemmas involving “one person or all of them,” I tend to decide based on age. If most of the people stuck were young, and there were many of them, then yes, it would be necessary to kill the woman. However, in this case, it doesn’t even seem that the woman herself can be saved, so she and her child will die anyway. Sadly, the woman will have to die to give other people the chance at life.
5. It was the responsibility of the girls to not go into the water, so I would go with my instinct and save my daughter. That may not sound like logic, but it is to me.
4. Are you kidding me? That’s just selfishness versus self-sacrifice. Yes, there’s my family to consider (if I have one) but it was my fault, my carelessness. This is not a moral dilemma: I would turn myself in without question.
3. This is difficult simply because of right and wrong: the person who made the mistake should take the blame. However, if my HUSBAND (why are all these questions geared toward men?) was about to claim it, if he was the most capable of supporting the family alone, I would, of course, step forward instead.
2. It is justifiable to torture the bomber. The reason the law is in place is, really, to prevent torture from being used in instances where it is not necessary or not justifiable (because that is such a fuzzy line for sadists.) In this case, he is to blame for the possible death of hundreds of people, and he deserves such a punishment if it is needed to avoid those deaths. His wife, unless a co-conspirator, cannot be tortured with any justification.
1. If I alert anyone else of the boat, there will be a clamor about who gets to live and likely it will waste time. If everyone is busy deciding who gets to live, we will probably all sink, or one person will miss the oportunity for rescue. It’s better to save one life, my own, than to take a chance on how gracious the other people will be in a desperate situation.
November 14th, 2008 at 4:46 pm
Not a great list. Most have fairly basic answers based on self versus group or logically justifable answers. The mad bomber is probably the best. However reviewing some of the comments it’s surprising how different people really are and how inconsistent they can be. e.g. Anna (no 157) says for number 7 that two wrongs dont make a right but then says for number 2 you should torture the bomber! (Sorry for picking this out Anna but it really struck me as interesting). For what it’s worth here are my answers.
10. Kick the chair. Your son will die whatever you do and you are saving someone else – there is no dilemma
9. The wife/lover bit is just trapping. It’s basically a case of helping one person ensures the other dies. You apply logic to help the one most likely to survive regardless of the affiar etc (unless your Will Smith in I Robot of course!)
Again no major dilemma involved.
8. Probably the most lame. Even if it didn’t involve your job who are you to screw with someone else’s marriage! You say nothing and don’t feel bad about it.
7. Getting a bit better but fairly easy to justify to yourself saying nothing.
6. Again a bit better but you don’t use the dynamite. You believe something else will happen (rescue etc) until it’s too late.
5. Again too easy with no real dilemma – you rescue the niece which means both may survive.
4. Again no real dilemma. You were bent down for the CD and didn’t see what happened – the women may be right so you say nothing.
3. Again no real dilemma- if the boy is that stupid he takes his punishment – he needs to learn.
2. The only one that deserves the title ‘top 10′ and a classic does the ends justify the means. The classic answer is of course No, you don’t torture people, you may get the answer another way.
1. Lame, lame, lame. You give someone 5 hours they will believe they can survive. You stick with the boat.
November 21st, 2008 at 12:24 pm
What a great site. My first visit… My first comments figured may as well get the hard one out of the way.
10- do not pull out the chair, they will probably kill you along with the others anyway.
9-save your wife if she has the better chance of returning to a normal life, blood loss will probably brain damage him, (besides you want her alive so you can kill her)
8-send an an anonomous to the friend that his wife has admitted to someone he knows that she is having an affair. disclose no details from her message.
7-give the aliby, with a sketchy past he may have many more suspected crimes and will likely be investigated anyway
6-use the dynomite, if I were the preg woman I would not be able to live knowing many people died when it could have been just one and a fetus
5-save the neice first, then daughter, best chance for both to survive. daughter is probably aware neice in more trouble and if you save her when you could have saved both, she nor you will forgive yourself
4-Tell the truth… one of the biggest problems in todays worl is people not taking responsability for their own actions. If you could let someone else take you dues than you probably should be put away before it happens for real
3-tell them it is your son’s and hope he learns to become a responsable adult when he’s done facing his consequences, again accountability, your wife does him no favor by trying to lie, when they don’t find womens things in the bag it will be either you or him. She is only implicating all of you at that point.
2-if someone has set up that kind of circumstance they don’t care much about anyones lives, so torturing him or his wife would be pointless. evacuate best as possibe and execute the bomber
1-if it was a cruise ship the chances of rescue within just a few hours is very high, especially when they disappear from tracking stations. Stay and help, give everyone the best chance.
December 1st, 2008 at 12:01 am
10. The noose is already on his neck. He’s going to die regardless. I’m going to die regardless. So is the person I would supposedly be saving. A Concentration camp is a death camp, and they intent on eventually murdering everyone there. My actions here would not have an effect. It’s just a cruel mind game, and I would refuse to play. They can kill your body, don’t let them take your soul.
I mean yeah, I could answer, “I would attack the guard, save my son, and lead a massive breakout”, but get real.
9. If tending to the man first means my wife will “definitley die” but tending to my wife first means that he will bleed to death, then it’s obvious. I tend to my wife first.
8. I do nothing, mind my own business, obeying the rules.
7. Well I’m not sure am I? I’m not sure he raped my daughter, I’m not sure he had anything to do with his wife’s death. Am I really sure I it was him in the restaurant. Time of death is not an exact science, and if he is truly innocent, chances are, he won’t be convicted.
6. This is just ridiculous. A pregnant woman leading the group? A hole in the cave just her size? And somebody brought dynamite?
5. Niece, then daughter. Try to save both.
4. What I WOULD do, and this is not right, is let the woman take the fall for it. If I was eventually found out to be the real culprit, I would insist that I didn’t know, and that the woman’s belief that she did it convinced me.
3. He’s 18, and he is the guilty one. I would not interfere if he gets in trouble, and I would not interfere if my wife takes the fall. They’re both adults and capable of personal responsibility, so I would not say a thing.
2. Hurting one guilty man, or even one innocent woman, to save the lives of thousands is a clear choice to me. Use the torture.
1. Stay in the boat I’m in.
December 2nd, 2008 at 9:04 pm
10. kamakazie on the guard; better then having guilt of killing the man or my son.
9. go into sudden deep medatation probably, and lose control of the situation, but if i could have chosen, i would have chosen the man.
8. my job is first, i signed a contract.
7. i would still feel guilty, I’d have to give an alibi, or go into deep depression, i killed an ant once, and didn’t eat meat for 2 weeks.
6. No way, i would have felt guilty like hell, i just killed a baby. would try to shove her out and die trying.
5. Try to save both and die trying, rather die trying then living guilty.
4. tell the cops it was me, the woman will testify against herself, hopefully we’d go to court and I she would proveme guilty of not killing the guy.
3. really guys? you’d kill your son for taking drugs? your fault your a bad parent. your fault for not checking his bag. your fault for not wearing a condom. I’d take the blame, hopefully my son would stand up, if he didn’t i’d curse him though. Didn’t he say he was a good kid?
2. no one’s read tom clancy? there’s evidence less ways too torture. anyway if the wife knows about the bombing, and refuses to tell us anything, is she really innocent? she just obstructed justice.
1. try to survive and die trying, i don’t like living with guilt.
December 2nd, 2008 at 10:06 pm
lol this is copypasta isn’t it?
December 5th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
Wouldn’t the first one be better (worse?) if the guard was threatening to kill you?
December 12th, 2008 at 6:47 pm
Well I doubt i’d be able to answer these they way i am about to if I was really in these situation but since I doubt i’ll ever be, i’ll take a crack at them.
10. Either way the blood is on my hands it seems. Since my son is going to die anyway,i’d expect him to understand. Even if there is no guarantee that the innocent will live if you pull the chair,it is guaranteed that said innocent will die if you refuse and so will the son. All those saying that the blood will be on the guards hands are pretty much right but I think some blame should go to the son,since he is the reason you have to choose. I’m not upping the body count because my son is lousy at escaping. Since he dies anyway, I am removing the chair.
9.Since there is a high chance my wife will die any way,I will save the man and if she is dead by then…i’d be heart broken but it’s far better than ending up saving neither. Sorry wife, I choose the lover.
8.Pretty easy one. My buddy isn’t going to take care of me when I end up on the street for violating company policy. It’s not my business. I stay out of it.
7.This one is not a dilemma because I don’t really have that choice. It’s not like we were alone in the resturant. Someone else would probably have said something not knowing his history. However if no one did,I would be keeping mum. He deserves to rot. I’d consider it vindication.
6.Women usually expand outward when they are pregnant.But thats a non issue. Why would a woman who is so far along be with us anyway? And unless this woman is an amazon or something,how could she be plugging the hole? I’m I to believe that we have enough space to ignite dynamite and get far enough away that it would only harm her and ensure our safetly but be cant just have her move her pregnant ass out the way and have her come out last? If this scenario made sense i’d blast her. Sorry lady but you would have died anyway (How would she have gotten out of this cave? Sure she’d be able to survive the tides and such but who says rescue is coming? Besides if the group had choosen to drown I would have definatley pulled her down with me.
5. It’s kind of funny that i’d never have to make this descion. I cant swim. They’d both end up dead. My daughter is the stronger swimmer. I would aid the niece first. Common sense. But I dont see why i’d need to swim one all the way back before getting the other. Why wouldn’t I be able to physically save them both?
4.I’d admit that it was me only because if i didn’t i’m sure someone else would have saw it and told on me. Besides,what if they weren’t dead? It only says that they look pretty bad off and you think they are dead but you cant possibly know that unless you check which you did not.
3.My son would not cause my wife to be arrested under no conditions. Sorry skip,should’ve known better. He takes his medicine.
2.legally i’d say no. But since it is established that he definately planted these things and they definately will kill people,I would torture him. His wife too. Not that it would be likely to work. The guy is willing to kill millions,do you really think he’ll be soft for his wife? I refuse to believe she would be completely innocent. Even if she was innocent,she’d get it too. So would anyone else who we think that torturing them would get him to speak.The lives saved outweighs the torture. Not much of a dilemma. Now if it was left ambigous as to whether or not he was responsible…I’d still do it. Better be safe than sorry.
1.This scenario is kind of silly. Am I to believe that none of the members of my sinking ship would attempt to rush the boat? Am I to believe that the others in the fixed boat would really let me on even though they couldn’t save anyone else. If I can get onto the other boat,I would. Self persevation and all that.
December 17th, 2008 at 10:17 am
Im doing a post on concentration camp.Well i know it would be hard but i would pull the chair from under my son.But afterwards i would kill myself because i would have felt so bad for doing that to my son.But i could not just have the guard kill my son and another innocent person it just wouldnt be right but i would feel terrible about it period.
January 5th, 2009 at 11:26 am
Lydia: I do NOT agree with your number 2. The innocent woman cannot be blamed for her husbands crimes; what are the chances that she knew her husband was mad when they married? People can change in the most unexpected ways, she shouldn’t have to suffer for him.
January 8th, 2009 at 11:43 am
one thing i have noticed about alot of peoples answers to number 3 is that letting your own son hang is insane. As a parent it is your job to protect your own offspring to the fullest extent. Yuor son could be sent to prison for life or executed and you would let him die. I see all you asses that would let him take the fall as cowards. Weed never hurt anyone. By letting your child die because of some weed makes you a jackass. And yes in turn you may die in his place, but THAT IS YOUR JOB AS A PARENT.
pregnant women should not be in caves to begin with so that prob wont happen.
EMT’s dont arrive to accidents without a partner. As a firefighter myself there will always be more help on a scene. This situation wont happen if you work as an emergency medical tech. If by chance it does, save the wife. screw the other guy.
With the niece and daughter, save both at the same time. the daughter is stronger in the water so have her hold around the neck and have her help kick to the niece and then to shore. Saving two 7 year old girls is easier then saving a grown man or even a grown woman. They dont weigh that much. Also bad parenting for letting them out of your sight near water alone. dumbass
With the rapist, tell cops hes that you saw him and let them go from there. and for the rapist kill him.
January 25th, 2009 at 9:20 pm
It’s interesting to me to see how many people respond to the first by saying they would never kill their son; but then in the end turn in the 18 year old son who is ‘in general, a good kid’ with possibly dire consequences. Drugs or no, in both situations they are your theoretical sons. The answers who said they’d seek legal council make the most sense.
January 26th, 2009 at 12:48 am
10. I would let the guard kill my son to save innocent inmates.
9. I would save the man first. And then will quickly come back to save my wife.
8. I would call up my friend and inform him regarding the email.
7. I would call up police and inform that ex-neighbor is innocent.
6. Use the dynamite to kill the pregnant women.
5. I would save the niece first and would quickly come back to save my daughter.
4. I would admit my fault.
3. I would save my son by telling that the bag was mine.
2. I think it is fine (though not correct morally) to torture the mad bomber’s wife. Our ultimate aim should be to save more number of people.
1. I would stay back to continue pumping water out. My staying back might help all the people to survive for some more time.
February 11th, 2009 at 7:21 am
10 – even if you save your son, he will probably get killed later on anyway. Better to let him die now than make him go through more suffering
9 – Save the man. If you love your wife, you would make it your priority to save what she loves.
8 – Tell the friend. If he is a true friend, and you are a true friend to him, you have to stay loyal. Quote “a true friend is a person who would take a bullet for you in a war”
7 – Tell the police. No matter how much you hate the person, no one should be punished for something they didn’t do. Also ask the police to investigate the rape earlier…maybe they can collect enough evidence to tie him to the rape?
6 – Blow her up. A small sacrifice considering how much more people would be saved.
5 – Save daughter. She is your daughter. You can’t love anyone more than your child. If you save the niece and your daughter drowns, then you will never be able to forgive yourself. If your niece drowns, you might not talk to your brother/sister/inlaw ever again, but at least you have a complete family.
4 – Admit to killing the person. As with number 7, no one should be punished for something they haven’t done.
3 – Say that the bag is mine. A parent must always sacrifice themselves for their child.
2 – Torture the bomber and the wife together. If it works, great. If he is truely mad and sadistic and still refuses to tell and the whole thing blows up, well, at least you died trying.
1 – I would go to the other boat. At least that way you have 100% survival chance, and the others are still left with some chance. (alternatively, why cant you go onto the otehr boat, and tell the others to hang on to the rim of the other boat as well? That way everyone will be saved)
February 17th, 2009 at 11:01 pm
10. Doesn’t matter what you do here, you have no control over any aspect of the situation. Given that reality, the most immediately appealing response is to attempt to take control by attacking the guard. However, I would probably just do nothing but play defense and use whatever life was left in me prevent the guard from killing anyone, especially my son (all the time throwing moral invective/appeals at him, ‘what if your mother was here?’, ‘if a good god exists, you’re going to hell!’, etc.).
9. Save my wife. I’m not so possessive or jealous as to hold it against my wife for ‘cheating’ on me in the first place (though I would think less of her for keeping it a secret). I don’t care that the man was her lover. He would be receiving no attention from me even if he was some random person in another car. If both end up dead and I go to the witness stand and they ask me “your wife had a 10% chance of survival and her lover had a 90% chance of survival, why did you choose to work on your wife?”, I’d say, “Bitch, go watch iRobot. I loved my wife and had nothing to with the accident. Leave my widowed ass alone.”
8. Tell the friend, but tell him not to tell you told him. Simple. Or just say, “man, I’ve got a hunch your wife is cheating. You should try and work on your relationship or something”. There are subtle ways out of that one.
7. As much as you may hate the man, the best thing to do here is to inform the police as accurately as possible. Speak truth to power. Then let them do their job, but not before mentioning the whole rape thing to them again.
Then get your daughter some damn therapy already.
6. Admittedly surrealistic scenario, but hey, what else are thought experiments for? I’d say, blow her up. It sucks, but everyone is equally innocent here and there are more lives to be saved by taking the action. But wait for the tide to come in and try to lubricate the blockage before lighting the fuse, please. Use the dynamite only at the last minute with no options remaining.
5. I like some other person’s suggestion of holding onto them both and calling for your spouses help while still afloat. But I would probably save my daughter first if that wasn’t an option. Again, both equally innocent/guilty, just who do I care about most? My daughter. MY GENES WILL LIVE TO SWIM ANOTHER DAY BWAHAHAHA!!!.
4. My bad. Here’s my license, won’t happen again.
3. Sorry sonny boy, you’re a dumbshit. I thought I raised you better than that, but since I didn’t, sucks for you. Zero tolerance drug laws may be retarded, but not as much as violating them in such an overt fashion.
2. Here’s what I wanna fucking know: If you don’t know where the bombs are, how do you know there are any bombs at all? Whose word are you taking, the mad bomber’s?
But let’s say you can theoretically know there are bombs without knowing where they are – how do you know the torture will elicit the information? It depends largely on just what type of insane the mad bomber is. If he’s truly mad, he’ll never tell you. In either case, never torture the innocent wife. Anyone who advocates her “guilt by association” is mistaken at best and depraved at worst.
1. Abandon ship. Sorry. Two hours vs. five hours, who knows when rescue will arrive, I’m getting off the boat. I’m not going to risk my life just so all ten of us can experience the unbridled joy of our last 3 exhausted hours together.
March 1st, 2009 at 10:57 pm
ehh no comment. hard choices.
March 5th, 2009 at 3:46 am
10. I’m not pulling the chair out from under my son. Let the other guy die.
9. Save my husband, the asshole. I would do sod-all for the other person, I owe her nothing.
8. Don’t tell my friend about the email. Avoid them like the plague until he finds out, which he will eventually. I wouldn’t want to be on friendly terms with her, either. Assuming she’s not violent, I might tell her I know. And that maybe it’s time for her to let *him* know.
7. These are two separate crimes. I have no idea what the “evidence” might be that makes it look like he murdered his wife, but I would at least let the world know I saw him. If he’s going to go to jail, it should be for as rightful as reason as possible. I hadn’t even considered the possibility at first, but I like ben’s idea of blackmailing a confession out of him.
6. a) I refuse to believe there is *no* way to shove and push a soft, flexible human being out of a tight spot. b) Use the dynamite somewhere else. c) This is just like prisoner-ship-vs-civilian-ship dilemma on “Batman Begins”! Should anyone seriously get it into their head to use dynamite on a pregnant woman, take it and throw it into the rising water.
5. I’d go for my daughter first, although in the heat of things, I doubt that I wouldn’t have the energy to drag them *both* to shore.
4. Wait, why does she think she hit him? All I know is I hit something solid. For all I know, it could have been an already-dead body.
3. Idiotic retard. I would probably be frozen speechless, and if he (my husband in this case) spoke up first, I’d let him take the rap because he’s older and (hopefully) stronger, and might be able to handle prison better. If he doesn’t and for some reason my cornball son actually speaks up first, I’d let him go to jail and call the American embassy and beg for help. I would be horrible at lying in this situation, I doubt anyone would believe me if I said it was mine. The Balinese might have a zero-tolerance policy but I don’t honestly think they’d execute someone over *weed*.
2. This question has the most outrageous answers of all. WTF is wrong with you sick arsebags for thinking it’s ok to torture a guy’s family. Nope, that wasn’t a question. Torturing innocent people? Seriously? Are you still so damn medieval? Are you also the kind of people who take responsibility for the wrongdoings of all those close to you? I bet not. (Especially judging from the answers to the last question, you bloody insane hypocrites. Thank God that most of you who answered “torrtur the wiffe!!!” are probably too dimwitted or unmotivated to get elected to public office and hopefully civil service wouldn’t let you in the door. That’s saying quite a bit considering our last Administration.) Also, lydia: if that were true, everyone in the world would also instantly know when their spouse was cheating on them just by, I dunno, looking them in the eye. Obviously they do not. Please take your lack of ability to reason elsewhere.
As for the guy himself, I’ll be totally honest. Ethically I think torture is reprehensible. Personally I would probably snap in the heat of the moment and haul off and hit him. Hopefully only once, before my colleagues dragged me away.
People have been dealing with this question since the beginning of time. We have learned to find ways around it by now obviously, so I hardly see why this would even be a dilemma anymore. If it is, then 1) you are a caveman without a spark of creative ingenuity at all or b) not in a country with easy access to sodium pentothal (look it up).
And your main focus should be evacuating the hell out of those areas where you think the bombs are.
1. Giant cruise ship? Probably has like about a thousand and one other lifeboats right? Tell the others to paddle to the other boat ’til they go mad. Get on the other one. Repeat process until all on the failing lifeboat have found new homes. People desperate to survive will do whatever the can, they’ll do whatever they can against the current. And I bet the friend’s lifeboat won’t *totally* sink just because more than one person were added to it. In fact, I’d place a pretty large wager on it, evidence coming from here: the first problem on http://www.friesian.com/valley/dilemmas.htm, another set of moral dilemmas. This is hardly a question.
(These answers brought to you by the general theme of “The Highest Good is Physical and Psychological Self-Preservation, Extending Outward to Those Closest to You”.)
March 5th, 2009 at 3:50 am
Also, GrantYim: no it is not offensive to be Chinese. Straighten up, walk tall, etc. etc.
March 6th, 2009 at 6:39 am
10. i wouldent pull the cair
9. save my wife
8. i wouldent tell my friend but i would try to make him notise
7. i would not tel the police
6. use the dynamite
5. ofc i would save my doughter i think every one would do that
4. tell the police
3. i DONT know :S
2. i would tortture him
1. i would stay in the boat
March 15th, 2009 at 11:23 am
10. i would not pull the chair
9. i’d work on the man
8. i’d tell my friend
7. i’d say it was the former neighbour
6. use the dynamite
5. i really don’t know about this one
4. tell the police
3. i don’t know about this one either
2. i would use torture
1. stay on the boat
March 16th, 2009 at 1:16 pm
10. Thow must not kill. The deaths would be in the hands of someone else. You should not own responsibility for others actions. Maybe the guard won’t pull the chair out/kill your son. The future is unknown. – easy.
9. The accident. Save your wife man. Then you can give her shit for being unloyal. Pretend you forgive her then drop her like a tonne of bricks. She deserves that at least ah! – easy.
8. These woman are bad are they not. Tell your mate and get a new job or black mail the woman to get money, then tell your mate get a new job and pay the legal fine with the blackmail money. After all you’re breaking rules already aren’t you. Yep!
7. Ah David Bain all over again. You are making many assumption if you are absolute that he raped your daughhter and believe he murdered his wife. What if…just what if…he IS innocent. You could hold onto resentment for ever and not prove either way or you could move, deal with what is current in your life, help your daughter recover (Chasing him will make it worse) and let the Police with all their expertise deal with it. Of course tell the Police what you know. My belief look after you and your daughter move forward to achieve the best results for the rest of your lives.
6. Being a caver I would not use the dynamite. I would be carrying a knife and there are certainly more options available. C section perhaps, then the lady would be unstuck. Anyone know how to do one of these? Cut her up. Babies move inside the womb. Perhaps… Pull and pull and pull until her leg breaks (That was one I encountered). Don’t panic. Get a better Cave guide … yeesh! Patience. The water will help lubricate and just maybe thae tide coming in will actually help. But don’t blow her up and close the cave off completely by blowing the cave to pieces. You gotta be an expert to minimise damage ah!
5. To be or not to be – that is the question. Hold on to them both. Tread water for a while. Let the rip take you out to a point where the rip stops. Swim around it back to shore. Or wait for a while to see if other fanily will come to your help, yell for help. If no-one comes then and only then make a decision. Save your daughter. You did not cause the incident but you could have avoided it.
4. Own up. Easy. You are to blame. Give the info to the Police and it’s no longer your decision anyway. You don’t choose who goes to kail. But come on. Own up. You’re an idiot so may as well get out of the way of the public by being locked up.
3. Come on people. This is a bit silly. The wife claiming the son’s bag as her own. Wouldn’t that be a bit obvious. We don’t have enough information. ie: What size is dad compared to the son. How old is the dad compared to the son. What is in the bag other than maj. ie: If mum claims mens clothes as her oiwn then it would be obvious she would be lying and then would be arrested as an accomplice. If dad claims it as his and he is a fatty and son a skinny fella, or if dad is 70 years old and son is 25 then clothes styles would be obviuous and the Kings of Leon and Kanye West CD’s were not dads either.
Oh and come on Kelsi. Do you not realise that you are not turning your son in to the Police. You state he deserves punishment. Punishment in Bali is the firing squad you idiot. Does he deserve that? You gotta watch the news sometimes.
2. An unfortunate predicament. However torture is an unknown as to whether the information would be forthcoming. It is a future statement and no-one can predict the future. You would be as bad as the mad bomber if you tortured his innocent wife. Again you did not cause this. Torture the guy to death. Whoops! sorry about that. Oh well. Eye for an eye. It was worth a crack Nigel.
1. That’s a simple one. It appears that there are 19 people. 9 in one boat, 9 in another and you. Hop in the good boat. Come around to the other boat and rotate the people to ensure there are fresh hands. That way you’ll keep the boat afloat the longest possible. You could also consider rigging the two life boats together. There are always options available. Not always the ones presented to you. Think people think.
March 26th, 2009 at 9:10 pm
as far as number 7 goes, I don’t think it should have even made it as far as the proposed predicament. If I had a daughter and I knew the person who raped her was not going to be convicted I would straight out kill the man without hesitation. I think that most people with a sense of justice and honor would do that same thing. If not murder than exact due justice one way or another on the man.
March 29th, 2009 at 6:32 am
10 – Tell the guard to sod off. Realistically, you’re all going to die anyway, so getting shot and having yourself and your son a nice quick death is really the best option.
9 – I would get my wife out. I don’t care if she cheated and I don’t care if it’s not fair and I lose my job – that’s the woman I love and she is what matters to me in the situation.
8 – I would not say anything about the affair. Nature will run its course with the cheating wife. She will be discovered somehow. I couldn’t risk my whole (young) family’s welfare for the sake of a relationship involving only two people.
7 – Of course, I would let the cops know that the neighbour was at the restaurant when his wife was being killed. That piece of information may not even exculpate him from the crime, as he may have paid someone else to do it (as mentioned in the question) but I would not want to risk the outcome of him NOT being the killer and the REAL killer being set free because I wanted revenge for my daughter’s rape. But if he was cleared of his wife’s murder and went back to normal life, I would then find him and kill him, hostel-style.
6 – In the case of the pregnant woman, everyone dies but her. There is no way anyone would seriously blow her up with such little time to think about it. Also there would be too many opinions getting in the way to actually reach a decision. She lives, they die. I know I couldn’t do it.
5 – I would rescue my niece first, while yelling out to my daughter to hold on til I come back. They are both family, they are both dear to me, but my neice is more in need. I am certain my daughter will hang on if I encourage her and talk her through it while I am rescuing my niece.
4 – I would take responsibility.. after all, I DID it. No-brainer.
3 – My son is only young and he is my responsibility, so I will step forward. I would take the place of my wife or child in prison, especially when there is risk of torture or death.
2 – Torture the bomber’s wife. They are married and she will know what he is doing, so she is already an accessory to the fact for knowing about a planned crime and not reporting it. Therefore she is not innocent. She will most likely give up information before they kill her, so she keeps her life anyway.
1 – I stay in the lifeboat with the hole in it. Not one of the other 9 people bailed on ME, so why should I let them down? My life is not worth the lives of 9 others. Who knows, we might still be afloat when the rescue boat comes.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:04 pm
Understand these answers to be what I hope is true of me.
1. I stay in the boat and pray during my rest.
2. The bombers wife is innocent in this situation, torture him, but not her…
3. I step forward and say “I wasn’t going to smoke or sell it, think of it as a souvenir, please throw it away.”
4. Hug the lady, explain to her that you did it and take responsibility.
5. Niece than daughter probably, especially if the niece is not-yet-Christian and the daughter is Christian.
6. Pull the pregnant woman back in (not push her out), and send everyone out, then pull her back out and hold her head outside the cave so she can breathe.
7. Honesty, hopefully he will get caught for raping my daughter… But two wrongs don’t make a morally-acceptable.
8. I would talk to my employers, mentioning that I’ve read very sensitive and personal material. Asking for release, even at the expense of my job, to tell the truth, then quitting and releasing anyway if the employer says no.
9. Ooo. Tough, tough. I think I’d probably save the wife, but it might be better to save the man…
10. Call the guards bluff, who is totally innocent? Call him on that and I think he’ll just get mad enough to hang you with your son. Ya. I went there.
April 1st, 2009 at 7:15 pm
10. pull the chair if i could handle it
9. wife
8. easy tell my friend
7. the bastard will get what he deserves.
6. get the pregnant woman to OK it then use the dynamite
5. jeez that’s hard. think i’d leave it up to fate.
4. talk it out with her maybe split the blame since we both thought we did it
3. im surprised so many people would hurt their kids like that. I would say it was mine reflexively.
2. that’s what needs to be done. the constitution is based on morals not the other way around. If i would get arrested for doing the right thing then so be it.
1. Golden rule. do what you would want the others to do. stay with the old raft.
April 7th, 2009 at 3:00 am
10. pull the chair
9. the guy – can still love a dead body
8. blackmail the woman for sex
7. Let him rot for the root even though he in for the murder
6. stick it up her asshole and let it blow. worlds overpopulated
5. yeah
4. yeah
3. yeah
2. yeah
1. hi-jack the other boat with all the others
April 13th, 2009 at 1:17 pm
arent there usually 2 ppl in an ambulance…surely the driver could help!
April 13th, 2009 at 6:17 pm
10) Attack the guard. Horrible death for me but rather then let my child die without a fight. Without choice pull the chair. You get the chance to give some comofort before.
9) My spouse. Even if I divorce her the day after its still the person I fell in love with etc.
8)Not tell. I want to keep my job and and I would hate to in any way get involved in a friends relationships.
7) Let him rot.
6) Use the dynamite. Though I’d probably be suididal for a long time after. And only after trying everythign else to get her loose.
5) I couldn’t leave ether of them. Even if it ment all of us drowned I’d still fight to get both to shore.
4) Tell. Take responsibility.
3) No idea. Take responsibility and change my story as soon as family is home maybe. Or let the son take the fall. if he’s that stupid at 18 he deserves it.
2) Torture. Its wrong, horrible and I should get punished for it but its still innocent lives to save.
Torture the wife within limits. Which should give me jail but I probably have a school as mental image.
1) Stay. If I lived I could look myself in the mirror and see someone I respected. Its a risk but sitting in a boat trying to avoid meeting everyone’s eyes as they look at a person that left other behind to drown.
April 15th, 2009 at 10:39 am
Get a life
April 21st, 2009 at 5:42 am
these really make you think. we have done these in our re class and it really made a very good discussion point.
10… Kill the son (yet we don’t have children) so that one life is saved.
9… We would like to think that we would save the man because he has the higher percentage of life chance.
8… talk to the wife yet you might loose your job because of reading the email.
7… talk to the guy at the table. threaten him that if he doesn’t admit to the rape you will let him rot in prison
6… kill the woman, its her fault for coming caving when she’s pregnant cave anyways (also check if she is not just fat) lol
5… We would save the niece first then go back and save the daughter as then atleast you know you tried even if you have to live with no daughter and watch your sibling/in law raise their child. (should have given her swimming lessons.
4… we would want to own up to it because we couldn’t live with the guilt.
3… we would say it was our own to save the son (stupid plonker)
2… ????? no idea!!!
1… stay no matter what. atleast you tried
April 21st, 2009 at 2:13 pm
These are all terribly horrible situations, but I agree with many others when I say that there is a right and wrong answer to all of these. The right choice is to keep the innocent innocent, and save as many as you can. It may seem hard, but if you really look into it it is not. Except maybe in #1 where I would never pull the chair from under my son, that is just not right.
April 22nd, 2009 at 8:32 am
10.I would not pull the chair it would be too painful
9.Save the wife
8.Won’t tell anyone
7.Do not give the alibi
6.blow up the pregnant woman..
5.save your daughter first then collect the niece
4.own up , it’s your responsibility
3.he’s an adult , he should take responsibility for his action
2.torture him and pressure the wife for information
1.stay on the boat and help them to survive even if you don’t survive , you tried your best
April 22nd, 2009 at 2:45 pm
Interesting dilemmas, (except the pregnant woman and the blame for the death in the accident which I thought were quite black and white). The adulterous email and the rapist/(possibly) murderer neighbour had me totally stumped. The others, I came to a decision after some pondering. There really are dilemmas out there, and it is good to do some hypothetical thinking beforehand. Here is what I thought of each of the dilemmas:
10. Although it’s a tragedy to say, I would pull the chair. My son would die anyway and that other innocent inmate would live.
9. I would save my wife. Then, she would have a chance to rebuild our relationlship and show she truly was sorry. Otherwise, she would die an unredeemed adulteress at the hand of her husband, without a second chance.
8. Stumped! Although, if I didn’t have a family to support and could afford to lose my job, I’d tell my friend.
7. Stumped!
6. I thought this was black and white. If they used the dynamite, they would kill a pregnant woman and her baby, and would live as murderers and cowards. If they didn’t, they would die as innocent people.
5. I would save my niece. There would be a greater chance to save both kids. If my daughter died, at least I could say I tried.
4. I would take the blame. Why would I want to live with the guilt anyway?
3. I would tell the police it was my son.
2. I think the police should torture the bomber. I even think it would be justified to torture his innocent wife. At least hundreds of innocent people wouldn’t die. Which is better? Torturing one innocent person or leaving hundreds of innocent people to die?
1. I would stay on board. If my friends, (and I) sank, at least it wouldn’t be my making.
Here are three more I thought up:
1. You are walking in a park one evening. You see that a sadistic gunman has tied a six-year-old girl to a tree. He is holding a gun to her head and telling you to immediately sexually assault her, or he will shoot her in the head immediately. You, the girl, and the gunman are the only ones in the park. With the threats being immediate, you cannot contact the police to save her. You also feel certain that you cannot attack the gunman or pry the gun from his hand because he is much bigger and stronger than you and would still be able to shoot the child. Fearing the gun, the girl is screaming at you to sexually assault her, but she is younger than the age of consent. What would you do?
2. You are driving in a one-way street through thick woods. There is a gunman chasing after you in his car and shooting at you and you are fleeing with all your might to get away from him. Up ahead, you see a pedestrian crossing the street out of the woods. You figure you have enough space to stop before hitting the pedestrian, but because of the thick woods and the narrow road, you can’t drive around him. Would you
a) Stop to let the pedestrian cross, even though you are being shot at or,
b) Hit the pedestrian and continue speeding away from the gunman.
3. You are a paramedic and you have been called to a dike to save a young boy’s life because he is having a heart attack and could die in minutes. On your way, you get in an accident with your elderly uncle who you know and love dearly. He’s knocked out, but doesn’t appear fatally injured, but you feel certain that if you stop to help him, even if you call backup, the child will die. The only way you can save the boy is if you drive away immediately. Would you
a) Stop for you uncle
b) Leave and help the boy
April 22nd, 2009 at 8:37 pm
In case you’d want to hear what I’d do in the three senarios:
1. Totally stumped, but either way, I would kill myself afterwards. If this is how the game of life can go, I’m not playing anymore.
2. Stop for the pedestrian. It would not be worthy to save my own life at the expense of another innocent person’s.
3. Go to the boy. Maybe it’s hit and run. Maybe I’d even lose my job, but in this case, it would probably work out for the better.
Here’s an essay I wrote:
Right to Break the Law?
When I was in grade eleven, our English teacher asked us a very intriguing question. ‘Do you think that there is ever a time when it is appropriate, permissible, even right to break the law, and if so, when do you think it would be like that?’
In my opinion, it would be appropriate, permissible, or right to break the law either if the law was unjust, or if the circumstances were desperate and life-threatening and there was no other way.
Here in Canada, our laws have some defences considering such circumstances. For example, we have the defence of necessity, which only applies if the unlawful act was to avert a greater evil, there was no alternative course of action, and the unlawful act was not more than what was necessary to avert the greater evil. For instance, the law textbook at school suggested a fictional scenario in which someone was suspended from driving for being impaired, when his neighbour rushed over and asked him to drive her to the hospital immediately, because she had severed an artery and would bleed to death. There was no time for an ambulance to arrive or for her to ask another neighbour. Such a case may make it appropriate for the neighbour to drive her over.
Section 17 of the Criminal Code of Canada offers a defence in which a person is compelled with threats of immediate death or bodily harm to commit an offence. In Canada, this defence is applicable if the threats are directed at the person who is to commit the offence, or any other person, particularly the family of the threatened offender, but not to property or to animals, including pets. However, this section does not apply at all for the very most heinous and violent crimes.
Sometimes, a certain act may be technically illegal, but police either don’t know about it or the public has come to tolerate, ignore or accept it. For example, people sometimes squash a penny on a railroad track, let their children take small sips of an alcoholic drink, drive slightly over the speed limit, or let their friends in for free while working at a movie theatre. While such actions are technically illegal, tolerance usually applies to less serious offences such as the ones listed, where, if convicted, the offender may face a small fine or a short prison term. No person or police official would ever ignore something like murder, rape or robbery.
Even in Canada, there has been much controversy over the law, in which a person has disobeyed a law because he or she thinks it was wrong. I can think of two instances of this. In both cases much debate has arisen from the public about whether or not the disobeying of the law was right.
Firstly, our English teacher who brought up the subject, told us of a farmer called Robert Latimer who had an extremely disabled daughter. She lived to be twelve years old, but she could not read, write or speak. In fact, she had the mental capacity of the average six-month-old. Furthermore, she had to undergo dozens of painful operations throughout her lifetime. Finally, her father could not stand to see her suffer anymore, so he killed her. He was found guilty of second-degree murder and sentenced to life in prison with a parole eligibility of ten years. As a matter of fact, he committed the offence with a good awareness that he could be found guilty of murder. He insisted that he did the right thing and that jail would not change his mind. A later appeal court refused to overturn Robert’s conviction.
Secondly, a teenage university girl called Gwen Jacob thought that it was unfair and unconstitutional against ‘equal rights guaranteed to male and female persons’ that men were allowed to be topless in public but women weren’t, just because they had breasts. After seeing a group of men playing ball on a hot summer’s day with no shirts, she got the idea to walk home from school with nothing covering her chest. Police arrested her, and although she claimed that women’s breasts were anatomically no different than men’s, the judge found her guilty of indecent exposure. A later appeal court overturned her conviction on account of low offence to the public.
Other countries, particularly in past centuries, have had laws in effect that have not only cut peoples’ rights, but compelled people to commit evil deeds. For instance, in the movie Hidalgo, in which Frank Hopkins raced his horse across Arabia, a young woman was hiding from her father, because she didn’t love the man he had chosen for her to marry. Where she lived, if a girl would not marry the man her parents chose for her, it was the law that the father was to kill his own daughter, or face the death penalty or jail for a long time.
Take a close look at the law in Canada. We live in a free society with just, fair citizens. Therefore, our laws are usually fair and address the feelings of the public. However, the law is made by people and people do make mistakes. Constantly, legistlators are even making revisions, and amendments to our criminal code. For example, legal groups are looking at criminalizing spanking children, and raising the sexual consent age. We have even made some laws that have not worked out well with the public, such as the alcohol prohibition in the 1910’s, and the criminalization of homosexuality. To this day, the general public and legislators are addressing issues such as reviewing laws regarding euthanasia, how to determine if a material that could be regarded as obscene serves public good and should be protected under Freedom of Expression, assisted suicide, what emergency responders should do in EMVCs, (Emergency Medical Vehicle Collisions, in which a 911 vehicle, while on the way to an emergency, hits someone), and abortion. Law is an ethical puzzle that will probably never be solved.
The law is necessary to keep a peaceful, secure society, but may involve many justifications or controversies. When making a choice, it is necessary to consider the possible outcomes from the decision, and which is of greater necessity. As our English teacher told us, ‘Ultimately, we have to live with the decisions we make.’
April 22nd, 2009 at 8:50 pm
188. David Hopkins : Just critiquing your paper for a second – hope you don’t mind – I think it was *wrong* for that farmer to kill his daughter. Life is about good and bad “things” – for want of a better word – sure, learning, is a good thing. Not being in physical pain, that’s a great thing. *However* I’ve been through periods of considerable mental distress and emotional pain – things didn’t look good, but sport was always good, as weas music – and now I’m out the other side and I can safely say that I *could* live like that. You have to cope with the bad and enjoy the good, which that girl would have been doing I dare say. If here father couldn’t stand to have to deal with someone “suffering” – from what he saw, as I said, to her she probably wasn’t that badly off because she didn’t know anything else – then it is just plain selfish of him to take an innocent life, especially of someone who trusts and relies on him so much. I say let him rot.
All this “pity” given to disabled people – especially the mentally disabled – is crap. They don’t want it, they want to be treated normally. I know how insane that sounds, but just try it, when you pass someone with Down’s Syndrome, just give them a smile or a wave or just a nod, just like you would to any other pedestrian, cyclist or driver. They don’t have “bad” lives compared to “us”, just different ones. They experience things differently, not necessarily “worse”, keep that in mind. To them, you might be the insane one for acting like they’re different
April 22nd, 2009 at 8:51 pm
Anyone care to share why my comments are getting moderated?
April 22nd, 2009 at 8:58 pm
Also Dave, that girl walking home with no shirt on, WHY?
Ok, fair enough, it’s double standards. But once you grow them, why would you *want* to walk around without ANYTHING up there? It’s a matter of praticallity as well as an arbitrary law, for once a stupid law actually serves a practical purpose, so I think her trying to prove a “point” was just pointless.
“Yay! Now girls don’t have to wear shirts”,
“Well, you know, now I think of it… Shirts are kinda cool, I mean, it’s easier to walk around with one on…”,
“Yeah, you’re right…”
And it’s not a completely stupid law, I would’ve been a sex-obsessed little turd a lot sooner if the girls I’ve played sport with etc didn’t wear their shirts
-
April 23rd, 2009 at 11:19 pm
Good critique, Mark. You raised some good points in your arguments for both cases. However, I’m sure some pretty solid arguments for Robert and Gwen could be made by different respondents. Life is not always black and white. I personally have mixed feelings about both cases.
May 2nd, 2009 at 11:59 am
10 – Tell the guard to sod off. Realistically, you’re all going to die anyway, so getting shot and having yourself and your son a nice quick death is really the best option.
9 – I would get my wife out. I don’t care if she cheated and I don’t care if it’s not fair and I lose my job – that’s the woman I love and she is what matters to me in the situation.
8 – I would not say anything about the affair. Nature will run its course with the cheating wife. She will be discovered somehow. I couldn’t risk my whole (young) family’s welfare for the sake of a relationship involving only two people.
7 – Of course, I would let the cops know that the neighbour was at the restaurant when his wife was being killed. That piece of information may not even exculpate him from the crime, as he may have paid someone else to do it (as mentioned in the question) but I would not want to risk the outcome of him NOT being the killer and the REAL killer being set free because I wanted revenge for my daughter’s rape. But if he was cleared of his wife’s murder and went back to normal life, I would then find him and kill him, hostel-style.
6 – In the case of the pregnant woman, everyone dies but her. There is no way anyone would seriously blow her up with such little time to think about it. Also there would be too many opinions getting in the way to actually reach a decision. She lives, they die. I know I couldn’t do it.
5 – I would rescue my niece first, while yelling out to my daughter to hold on til I come back. They are both family, they are both dear to me, but my neice is more in need. I am certain my daughter will hang on if I encourage her and talk her through it while I am rescuing my niece.
4 – I would take responsibility.. after all, I DID it. No-brainer.
3 – My son is only young and he is my responsibility, so I will step forward. I would take the place of my wife or child in prison, especially when there is risk of torture or death.
2 – Torture the bomber’s wife. They are married and she will know what he is doing, so she is already an accessory to the fact for knowing about a planned crime and not reporting it. Therefore she is not innocent. She will most likely give up information before they kill her, so she keeps her life anyway.
1 – I stay in the lifeboat with the hole in it. Not one of the other 9 people bailed on ME, so why should I let them down? My life is not worth the lives of 9 others. Who knows, we might still be afloat when the rescue boat comes.
May 5th, 2009 at 5:16 am
193. Noor : I’m trying to hold my sides in as I type this. How thinly veiled do you want your Stalin-esque qualities to be here? I mean, you didn’t do to good a job of hiding them.
“…4 – I would take responsibility.. after all, I DID it. No-brainer…”
If you really think it would be that easy, maybe you need a reality check my friend. Either that, or you’re preparing your cult of personality speeches already?
“…3 – My son is only young and he is my responsibility, so I will step forward. I would take the place of my wife or child in prison, especially when there is risk of torture or death…”
This kid’s 18 for chrissakes! If he hasn’t learnt is he really going to?
“…2 – Torture the bomber’s wife. They are married and she will know what he is doing, so she is already an accessory to the fact for knowing about a planned crime and not reporting it. Therefore she is not innocent. She will most likely give up information before they kill her, so she keeps her life anyway…”
This is the one that really touched a nerve with me. Why the *fuck* would you even consider that as a first option? Tyrant in waiting right here. Maybe we should invent a Stalin-lite indicator – it would turn bright, bright crimson for you my friend.
Personally I wouldn’t even consider torturing this innocent woman, at all, even as a last resort. You however have fallen into the good ole’ guilt-by-association crap, and it’s up to your neck. How can you be *sure* – or even vaguely suspicious for that matter – that this woman has any knowledge pertaining to her husbands actions? If you can’t even be sure – or even get a whiff – of that, how can you sentence this innocent (last time I checked that’s the way it works?) woman to such horiffic humiliation and pain?
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not a liberal, ex-hippy, flower-power, save the whales kinda fella. I do however believe that torture, although not necessarily “wrong”, is completely pointless. There is *very* compelling evidence to suggest that torture is a poor interrogation technique at best, not to mention the thin line and slippery slope stuff.
“…1 – I stay in the lifeboat with the hole in it. Not one of the other 9 people bailed on ME, so why should I let them down? My life is not worth the lives of 9 others. Who knows, we might still be afloat when the rescue boat comes…”
There’s no guarantee that the other nine would die if you jump ship either. A real issue here – if read into further and extra assumptions are made or the hypothetical is expanded – is that, if these nine people are going to die *period* they are fooked, right up shit creek without a solid object in sight, then isn’t it better for at least one person to live?
I really didn’t mean to rag on you that aggressively mate, I do apologize – I am however, insanely lazy, so I can’t be bothered re-writing – but just keep in mind that, to me at least, you just came across as a Mao-in-waiting.
May 13th, 2009 at 9:50 pm
I’m really surprised at how many people would let their son take the fall for the drugs… Really? Sure, he did something outlandishly stupid, but he’s your SON for chrissake! He has his whole life ahead of him, and to let him rot in a squalid Balinese prison-cell for the rest of it just because he had some grass doesn’t add up to me. If you truly love him, take solace in the fact that you’re giving him a second chance at life. This is a gesture that he will never forget and will probably internalize, using it as a moral compass for the rest of his days.
It would definitely be a rough going for you (as would all the options on this list), but I think that taking the fall in this situation is without a doubt the right decision
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:10 am
195 macaroni : I pity the fool who thinks he has all the answers
June 4th, 2009 at 3:10 am
i HATE YOU MARK
June 7th, 2009 at 6:08 pm
#10- I would not pull the chair. I would take that moment to embrace him one last time before we were both killed.
#9- Save my wife.
#8- Tell my friend but make him promise not to tell where he got the information from.
#7- Keep my mouth shut. He deserves whatever comes to him and more.
#6- I couldn’t blow up a pregnant woman. I know that it would be better to save the others, but such a violent act on someone would be impossible for me to do.
#5- Save my daughter.
#4- Take responsibility.
#3- Step forward and take the blame. No matter how stupid my son is, I could never let anything happen to him like that. Either way it’s me or my wife that will end up taking the blame, so I would instead of her.
#2- Torture but not to the point of death.
#1- I would save myself.
June 9th, 2009 at 5:49 am
198 NikitaK : “#10- I would not pull the chair. I would take that moment to embrace him one last time before we were both killed…”
He’s not going to kill you and your son, he’s going to kill your son and an innocent inmate. That’s harsh, could you really live with sentencing someone else to die just because he didn’t want to “kill” – seeing as it’s going to happen either way – your son?
“…#7- Keep my mouth shut. He deserves whatever comes to him and more…”
a) We don’t know if he did rape the daughter
and
b) What about the guy that actually did do it? I’m pretty sure murder is a more serious crime than rape in most regions of the world.
“…#6- I couldn’t blow up a pregnant woman. I know that it would be better to save the others, but such a violent act on someone would be impossible for me to do…”
Well said, you didn’t say that it would be “wrong” because that’s a point of rather contentious moral debate – the ends and the means thing, what you end with and what you did to get there etc. I know I wouldn’t have a problem doing the said act, but that probably says more about me than it does about you.
“…#3- Step forward and take the blame. No matter how stupid my son is, I could never let anything happen to him like that. Either way it’s me or my wife that will end up taking the blame, so I would instead of her…”
I seem to be a minority here saying let the son have what’s coming to him… That was the easiest choice for me.
“…#2- Torture but not to the point of death…”
Please, refer to my 194. There is no proof that she knows anything (would you tell your spouse???) *and* torture has been shown to be a poor form of coercian. You couldn’t bring yourself to quickly and painlessly end a pregnant woman’s life to save others, but when it comes to someone who’s associated with a terrorist… you’re not so quick to condemn destroying her life, or possibly killing her.
Harsh
June 9th, 2009 at 9:24 am
Just my honest opinions, folks…
10. Kill the guard.
9. Surely you are not the only emergency worker there. In a real-life situation, there would be at least several, and both people could be saved. But, for the sake of argument, the logical choice would be to tend to the one with the higher chance of survival, namely, the lover. In this capacity, you are acting as a member of the medical profession, not as a betrayed spouse.
8. I would take the problem to one or more of my superiors (without revealing any names) and ask for advice. Then act from there.
7. Tell the authorities what you know- everything. Whether or not he is a rapist, you should not put his blood on your hands. No matter how “sure” you are about anything, you do not know absolutely what he did and did not do in your daughter’s case. There is not much in this case that is certain- act upon what you know is certain, and maintain your high ground. You may confront the man personally as well before saying anything to the authorities.
6. This is an absolutely ridiculous situation, but whatever. First, if only her head is stuck, as seems to be apparent, you should be able to pull her back into the cave with only a scraped nose, and then use the dynamite without hurting anyone. If not, you may be able to blast your way out through an alternate spot, or hack away enough of the rock to free her without using the dynamite. Again, ridiculous- who’s to say that using dynamite in a confined space would not kill her and possibly others anyway? The explosion could do serious damage to the entire area and inhabitants, and might even cause a cave-in. So much about this points to a no-win outcome.
5. Take your niece back first, and while you’re there, tell your daughter to float flat on her back, which requires very little effort. Better yet, before you even hit the water, grab a flotation device or something the girl can cling to until you return.
4. If you know for sure that you did it, own up.
3. Your son is 18 and should be adult enough to know exactly what he has done and the consequences. Therefore, if the drugs are his and you and your wife were not privy to their existence, the fault is your son’s alone and he needs to confess.
2. Sound every available alarm and evacuate the areas as quickly as possible. Then, if there’s still time, lock the bomber in one of the areas where the bombs are ticking. He should confess relatively quickly.
1. This is where I get selfish. I have to admit, though uncomfortably, that I would probably defect to the other boat.
June 9th, 2009 at 2:41 pm
200 moshmonster : You miss the point…
June 14th, 2009 at 11:48 am
Ok… if I miss the point, would you kindly tell me what that point is? Do you know?
June 19th, 2009 at 12:43 am
10. The son dies either way. Killing the son causes less immediate death and offers whoever would have also died hope to live another day and maybe make it out. However since everyone will probably die and the second death will probably happen anyway, the best choice may be to negotiate to be the second death. If you absolutely have to pull the chair, by being close you can tell your son you love him first for the very small help that offers.
9. Triage. You are trained for this. Save the man.
8.She is out of line. Company time is not to be spent in this manner. Attempt to get her fired and when the husband notices inform him why.
7. Be honest. Remind the police of the evidence against him for the rape, suggest he may have hired someone, but offer that you might have seen him, however it distressed you and so you left the restaurant. Offer that he looked stressed. If he gets off talk to him and secretly record the conversation to try to get enough info to prove he did either crime.
6. Pull her back.Escape, then restick her. Dynamite will likely kill everyone.
5. Triage. Save the neice.
4. While it is possible she, in fact, did cause the accident, since you were looking down you don’t know and are reacting on stress, it is also possible you did it. Ask her what happened again to help determine exactly why she believes this and tell the police everything you can.
3. I claim it, then squeeze my wifes arm and give my son then “I love you anyway” look and leave with the men.
2. Torture is a long process. In order to get anywhere you would need the time to accomplish something. Torturing his wife will not get anywhere because he knows that you cant really hurt her, if you do you have nothing to hold over him and you dont know how long you have. Even if you did torture, especially in a case like this, will rarely yield and significant result.
1. The difficulty seems to lie in assuming that this one boat will be either rescued or not in 5 hours. Why hasnt the whole lifeboat been split up among other boats already though? I would suggest that they do so and go to “lead the charge” If it were absolutely impossible to do however I would recommend flipping the boat and if that were impossible I would go. Boats are not easy to sink, I have tried, these kind are designed to float, even while completely full of water. Less weight means a better chance in that case and I dont think 5 hours is enough time. If anyone died and me remaining would have saved lives, I would have regretted leaving. I would also volunteer to help the rescue crews save this raft.
I may seem heartless at times here, overly professional then cruel then extremely caring but this is as I see it. The problem with these is you dont have an hour to consider them in reality. You have an instant. Go with your gut.
June 19th, 2009 at 12:52 am
btw mosh.
Kill the guard.
Awesome.
And I personally dont think your missing the point. I think you actually nailed it spot on, you gave your opinion, that was the point I think lol.
I can see it now, you grab the chair before your son is standing on it and brain the guard, you get shot, you grab your son and make a break for it and escape into the oncoming liberation army. You quickly enlist, get a tourniquet then come back and hand out some free lead to the guardhouse. Good movie idea. lol. completely far fetched but hey. HogensHeroes got nothing on this guy.
June 19th, 2009 at 10:51 am
I think I have come to some decisions for 7 and 8.
8. Tell the husband. It is best to stay loyal to your friend and his wife just can’t be allowed to get away with adultery. Being a first breach of rules, you’d probably get off with a warning. However, If the policies of privacy are really so uptight you’re not even allowed to help your own friends, this probably isn’t the best job for you anyway. Start researching another one right now in case you do get fired in the future.
7. Tell the police you saw the suspect in the restaurant, and tell them why you believe he raped your daughter. Tell them you believe he may have paid the murderer. As convinced as you feel, you don’t actually KNOW the whole story.
June 19th, 2009 at 10:08 pm
10. I’d try to do something against the guard. I’ll probably get killed, but I don’t want to bear the memory of having taken such horrendous decision, so I’m probably better off dead. As for my son, he will either be put out of his misery or he will have the memory of a father who loved him so much he sacrificed himself for him.
9. I’d save my wife first. Thinking outside the box I would probably try to save them both—if they die I won’t live feeling guilty, because I did try to do something. If at least one of them survives then I’ll be mildly happy.
8. I’d keep it a secret, but I’d try to find a justifiable way to unveil the sinful relationship. I wouldn’t tell my friend until I had a reasonable way to justify my finding while trying to keep it unrelated to my spam-filtering activities.
7. I would talk to him.
6. Depending on how much time we have, I would probably use the dynamite. This is probably the hardest dilemma in the list.
5. I’d try to save them both, not before shouting for some help. In my estimation it is very unlikely that either my daughter or my niece would die if both were aided by me.
4. We’re both innocent until found guilty beyond any reasonable doubt. I would pretend I know nothing, but I’d make her aware of her legal rights. Nobody knows I know I killed the guy.
3. If I say it is mine and they kill me, my son will know that he is a complete moron because his father was a moron himself. If they punish me, I would be taking a punishment for something I did not do. If they find my son guilty of possession of illegal substances there are things I could legally do to prevent unfair punishment, but I’m NOT going to sacrifice myself for him.
2. Torture him, there is no reason why we shouldn’t do it. Don’t torture wife unless it’s our last resort.
1. I’d probably save myself. I can’t say why but I can’t see any reason why I should stay in the damaged boat, to be honest.
June 20th, 2009 at 11:44 pm
3.Go to the boy. Maybe it’s hit and run. Maybe I’d even lose my job, but in this case, it would probably work out for the better.
Gee whiz!! What a traitor, hypocrite and a coward! You’d sacrifice your job for a kid…….oooooh, you’re SO brave (pure sarcasm). Okay, for starters, since when does a KID get a HEART ATTACK?! But anyway, do you really mean to say that you would actually leave your own UNCLE just bleeding in the road to help some stranger? Uncle may have internal bleeding and could die too! How would you like that on your conscience? YEAH, There is a paramedic there, the very person he requires, his own nephew, for crying out loud! But he just drives off leaving him to HOPE a CAR will stop to call for a medic. David, how COULD you?! Nephew or no nephew! Secondly, what if ANY medic could do what you claim you would do? It would send the medic force a straight drop to hell! With your profession, you would have been trained you just can’t save everyone! David, just stick to the 10 dilemmas posted which are much more realistic and hypothetical than anything you can dream up. My question to you: If there were a cyclist holding you up, would you seriously bash him to the street? Hope you never become a medic.
Also Dave, your dilemma #1 is an outright obscenity. Erase it from your head right now!
June 23rd, 2009 at 8:26 am
@moshmonster (202): Yes, these are questions of morality, not logistics. All of your brilliant work arounds – e.g. Your “solution” to No.6 – are crap. The point is that assuming you must answer with one of the above, which one and why. Not make up a fun story for everyone to enjoy.
June 23rd, 2009 at 8:29 am
@Bender (203): You also overlook the fundamental point of these questions. Seriously, No.6 isn’t a DIY escape a cave scenario, it’s meant to make you think. A pregnant woman, or the rest of your party, who would you kill? Is that a better way to put it.
N.B. The question stipulates that she is stuck, so you two jackasses haven’t done yourselves any favours by suggesting it would be as easy as yanking to get her back in the cave.
June 23rd, 2009 at 8:30 am
@Bender (203): Also, No.4, same thing. You have to assume you did it, or else why bother?
June 23rd, 2009 at 8:34 am
@Bender (203): Yet again, No.1 *facepalm* you have to stick with the basic assumptions of these questions or else they are pointless.
To simplify :
The raft you are on is going to sink in 5 hours. However, you may jump ship. If you do, you will be fine, but the raft you are currently in will only float for 2 hours.
It’s a lot less interesting this way, but hopefully it will penetrate your skull and register within your excuse for a brain.
June 24th, 2009 at 12:35 pm
Greenfan, I don’t know what makes you so firm, but I have given the 10 dilemmas a lot of thought, and most of them are not easy. I consider my mind to be very hypothetical, and that is why I posted three problems of my own. Maybe that was a little off topic, but my aim was not to advocate hit and run or child abuse any more than the 10 dilemmas ‘advocated’ either side of their situation. As for my first dilemma, I think I have come to the decision I could not assault the girl even to save her life. It would just be too painful.
June 27th, 2009 at 12:55 am
10. i would not pull the chair. try to attack one of the guards to get free (very unlikely)
9. do your job how your suppost to without having your personal relationship change procedure.
8. dont tell him it will unfold eventually. not your business maybe your misunderstood.
7. dont say you saw him its none of your business and he got what he deserved.
6. i would drown. couldnt live with myself if i did it. try to find another way out.
5. neice then daughter. in real life i might pick my daughter but i hope that if i had to make the decision id pick the neice.
4. you werent paying attention how do you know if you hit him or not? say you wernt paying attention and you might have hit him.
3. its his fault not yours he shouldnt be doing drugs anyway.
2. torture the guy, wife if neccesary. lives are on the line.
1. stay on your boat. likely you wont make it to there boat anyway. not worth wrisking 10 peoples lives for your greedy self.
June 30th, 2009 at 7:23 pm
“6. stick it up her asshole and let it blow. worlds overpopulated”
Arabtit, what are you saying?! Are you really serious? Maybe you’re trying to be funny. If so, it’s not working. With your logic of the world being overpopulated, it would be more desirable to let everyone drown! Voice your genuine opinion, but not in such a heartless and tasteless fashion. I’m surprised your comment hasn’t been deleted.
July 1st, 2009 at 3:40 pm
10. Pull the chair.
9. Help the lover. It’s your job.
8. Don’t tell your friend.
7. Tell the police you saw the man. The real killer shouldn’t be allowed to get away.
6. Use the dynamite to save the most lives.
5. Rescue the niece.
4. Take the blame.
3. Your son was foolish, but maybe step in if there was a risk they could kill him.
2. Don’t use torture. The bomber could lie.
1. Stay in the boat. They’re my friends and they need me.
For the 3 dilemmas in 187:
1. Obey the gunman. Murder is a worse crime than sexual assault and consent to murder wouldn’t be a defence anyway.
2. Stop for the pedestrian.
3. Help your uncle. It’s your job and probably ambulance policy for good reason.
July 4th, 2009 at 5:41 am
What I would do:
10) Your son is going to die either way so you need to take the first option. You don’t want an innocent man’s blood on your hand.
9) I would personally just walk away and let somebody else deal with it. Although it may have severe implications on my future career, I would very much doubt in that situation I would be stable to perform any medical procedure.
7) It is still not certain the neighbor raped the daughter, she might have just got confused. I would tell the police and stand up for him in a court of law, although I wouldn’t tell the daughter and it would be very hard to do.
6) In that situation I would accept my fate and die. Firstly there is no guarantee the stick of dynamite blowing up won’t go horribly and bring down the cave on everyone, even the pregnant women. Secondly that woman has been given a chance for her and her baby to live and taking it away would be murder.
5) I would save my daughter. I know it would probably be the wrong decision, but I would love her too much to let her go. Later on I would lie and say the niece was a lost cause.
4) This one is easy for me: admit it. You have no right to let that woman take your punishment.
3) Its the son’s responsibility. Although it would be difficult you must let him take the blame. Besides, if your wife did take the blame and got executed and your son got off without anything, nothing would ever be the same between you two again. That situation would also be the same if you took the blame and your wife and son went home.
2) If he’s a madman capable of mass murder I would very much doubt he would care what happened to him or his wife. I would just forget about him and focus on finding the bombs.
1) Go with the friend. Although it may be morally wrong, its a near certainty you will survive if you go with your friend. Even if you stay the chances of survival of for all ten people is still much lower.
July 4th, 2009 at 5:43 am
Random note. Why every time you write and eight and then a closed bracket does it come up with a smiley face? Is there anyway I can stop this from happening?
July 4th, 2009 at 7:41 am
@Norman (217): Use periods instead, that’s what I’ve resorted to
July 6th, 2009 at 2:01 pm
Tomo, (comment 90)
That is a very Utilitarian situation. It leads one to consider if the solution that would result in the least deaths (or harm) is the right decision. But is that always true? What if that one kid on that other track was your son?
(That would become sort of like the ‘concentration camp’ scenario).
Then there is the possibility of a conflict between certain death vs harm or possible death, as in my medic scenario in comment 187. Also, you can have certain death vs carrying out an unthinkable (but not deadly) action against the person who would otherwise die to save them, like in my gunman and child scenario (also comment 187).
A question to consider: Do you think that there would ever be a time when even the option with the least adverse consequence would still be the more morally wrong decision? (Hope this doesn’t sound paradoxical).
PS If you have anything to say about my scenarios in comment 187, I would be interested to hear what you would do.
July 6th, 2009 at 5:12 pm
This is not, per se, a dilemma, but it is something you might be intrigued to think about:
You are a child slave in Africa, laboring away 20 hours a day making rugs. One night, you have a dream. God comes down from Heaven and tells you that nobody, not a single person in the world is buying your rugs. You have no doubt that God really has sent you a message, and that the news is true. Do you feel:
a. Disappointed and anguished that you truly are going through this labor for nothing, with nobody even benefitting from your work, or
b. Pleased, because nobody is perpetuating your cruel treatment?
July 7th, 2009 at 11:02 am
10. concentration camp – Never pull the chair no matter how many inmates get killed. I would never kill my son. I would never kill anyone just because some sadistic guard is telling me to. If my son was slowly being tortured to death, however, that’s a different story. if they’re just killing with handguns, well, too bad. we’ll probably all get it in the end anyways.
9. accident – Save the wife. Too bad for the random guy. I never took vows to love him.
8. spam — none of my business. friend must be a loser anyways.
7. neighbor in restaurant — golly, it’s been so long…
i can’t be sure it was him. i guess he goes to jail. oh well.
6. pregnant woman / cave — a ridiculous scenario. we
couldn’t pull or push her out? no one has any lubricant?
what are we all doing in the cave? Oh well, can’t get her
out it’s dynamite time. convince the others to do the dirty work.
5. drowning girls . another stupid scenario. you grab both and hope for the best. if you all die, at least you died valiently. there’s no way you can assess whether you could swim back or not holding both of them. have your daughter hold the other’s head above water, and you just grab the daughter. lifesaving 101.
4. hit-n-run. another unlikely scenario. since when do
people go to jail for vehicular manslaughter? it’s a fine
and maybe some community service. just own up. unless
you’re a scumbag with previous convictions in which case
you would go to jail for a long time. in that case, easy
decision, the woman goes.
3. bali drug bust. let wifey do what she must. if the
son gets it, she’ll certainly be destroyed for the rest
of her life. better to have THAT on your son’s conscious.
2. torture the guy. then torture the wife. if she married
The Mad Bomber then she, of all people, had the single
best opportunity to stop him. She is NOT innocent.
1. if my rescue is insured, then i take that risk and swim. every man for himself. how am i supposed to know
that 8 people can’t bail as good as 9 if there’s 200
less pounds in the boat? another ridiculous situation.
no way could anyone discern that equation with accuracy.
there’s tons of risk of me just trying to swim to the
other boat. i’m still taking my life in my hands, but
i’d probably try.
July 7th, 2009 at 7:06 pm
Mark: Frankly, I couldn’t care less what you think about my solutions to these dilemmas. The fact that I chose to mix logic, realism, and morality is my choice. I have presented my opinions, and if you don’t like them, that’s fine, I have no problem with that. What I do have a problem with is you coming off as a high-handed snob and immediately calling me and Bender names when neither of us has disrespected you in any way, shape, or form. Kindly calm down- no one made you read what either of us read. You chose to yourself. Besides, I’ve seen other comments of yours, and you seem more interested in picking at other people than you do in the list itself, and that just makes you look petty. I could easily be just as nasty to you as you have been to myself and others, but I prefer to stay polite in this instance. Regardless, I do not wish to pursue this subject further- good day, sir.
Bender: Thanks! Though I’m not a guy, I’m a woman.
July 8th, 2009 at 12:24 pm
Also, Greenfan, if I were in the shoes of the medic in my scenario 3 in 187, I would probably go to the child and call a backup to help my uncle. That way, I would not be leaving him bleeding in the street and hoping a car will call a medic as you so bruskly pointed out. Just to say, there is no 100% moral way out of this scenario, so it is really not worth attacking one of the possible actions in such a nasty fashion.
PS My grandfather had a heart attack at age 16, so maybe this scenario is not entirely impossible.
Anyway, he made a sound recovery and went on to live a long and prosperous life.
July 11th, 2009 at 5:47 am
I don’ t agree that utilitarianism is a false theory, as shroom said. If it was a false theory we wouldn’t consider it so much as we do. It is a false moral theory as it doesn’t care about justice, morality and other platonic ideas. We make fan of it as a moral theory yet we vote utilitarian politicians to govern us whom in turn we don’ t respect. We say “please do the dirty (immoral) job for us and let us be moral agents”. Utilitarianism is a “government” theory, a practical theory for those who have the power to decide and have to treat people as numbers (politicians, generals etc).
I will try to answer the dilemmas applying Kantianism, utilitarianism, natural low and emotions as I see fit.
10. Concentration camp
How about the maxim “it’s ok to play the executioner’s role for someone who is about to be executed anyway, in order to save an innocent soul”. It makes sense to me. Utilitarianism also applies. But I wouldn’t do it. Strong emotional block. I would follow as my leader the one who could take the inside emotional damage and do it. (God did it after all). If he does it without emotional damage then he is inhuman or a robot, even rational.
Can the prisoner decide not to kill his son without guilt? (What a strange phrase).
I think he can’t. It is not his decision, that’s true, but, never the less, he can change the empirical result. We live in an empirical world where evil makes the rules. Like it or not we deal with evil and play by its rules. How about if the guard was about to kill one prisoner every minute? We should remember though that whatever he decides the guilty and evil part is the guard.
Way out: don’t have family
9. Cheating wife and accident
What is the Kantian thing to do? Help the one in greater need (wife) or the one who will be saved for sure. If there is a professional empirical rule you should apply it. If there isn’t (or even if there is) follow your emotion and save the wife. You are not a judge, not in your personal case. You are not a Kantian robot or Mr Spock. (Someone above mentioned “I robot”). You are human with emotions. Whomever you decide to save is ok as long as you do it having the right motive and that is to save and not to punish.
Way out: don’t have family
8. Cheating wife, spam
We have two contracts, friendship and the obligation to the firm. We also have to break one of them. Kant doesn’t seem to apply in the empirical world (dilemmas) because he says that we must keep our contracts. Where do we do the most damage? The firm will lose maybe some credibility. The friend lives in a lie. It is Sartre’s dilemma (go to war for the motherland (firm) or stay and help the mother (friend) to live). I would tell the friend. But if I had to sustain my family I wouldn’t. Why use my family as a mean and the friend as an end and not vice versa. Natural law. The dilemma is faint.
Way out: don’t have family
7. Rapist neighbor
The dilemma is faint. You think he is the rapist. There is no evidence. You have to be sure. Let’s say you are. If he is innocent for the murder then a killer is free. You have to say the truth. If there wasn’t for the free killer we could discuss revenge. It is illegal but we use it all the time. He was the one who broke the law first. Primitive justice, Primitive but justice. Is it better “no justice at all?” Strong emotional motive. Natural law. “Fiat justicia et ruant coeli”.
Way out: don’t have family
6. Pregnant
The pregnant can’t give you permission to blow her. She can’t negotiate for her fetus. It’s the abortion problem. That’s why they made her pregnant. To blow her up is very immoral, because she can be saved. Very grave transgression of the Kantian law. Very brutal appliance of utilitarianism. The decent thing to do is to leave things as they are. If the people in the cave are too many though, we should blow her. Common sense. Utilitarianism. Natural law (survival). I can’t really answer. It leads that we have to set a critical number of people. Bold man’s paradox. A moral problem is degenerated to elementary logistics.
5. Niece or daughter
Reason and morality say to go for the niece. But there is a strong emotional factor to obey at the cry for help of your own child. I can’t really answer. The point is not what to say afterwards to your brother or to your wife. I have to follow Shabab’s recipe on this. I would shoot myself. Luckily at this case and many others you decide by instinct and think later.
Way out: don’t have family
4. Car accident
Many people discovered in action that they were immoral. Before, they thought to be moral.
You say that you hit something solid.
3. Son and pot
Many people said that the son has to take his responsibility. It’s the Kantian thing to do. But moral laws apply to “persons”, to “moral agents”. That’s why the law doesn’t punish minors as it assumes they are not yet complete persons. When do we become complete persons? When we no more make false moral choices. We never become persons. For practical reasons though, the law consider us to be adults at 18, because it wants to punish us. The law wants to teach us empirically (punishment) to be adults. As long as we have our father we are not adults. The father has to take his son’s responsibility. But the son may choose not to accept it and claim his adulthood. It is also a cultural thing. In some cultures (Greece, Italy, Japan etc) there are strong relations of dependency in families. That’s why the father’s loss is traumatic and not in any way a typical event. The fact that the boy is 18 is irrelevant. It has to do with the written law and not with human relations and decisions. Those who said that the wife should take the blame were joking of course. Joking is good.
Way out: don’t have family
2. Mad bomber
The dilemma is faint. What kind of torture? Intense questioning? Breaking his fingers?
High officials have often to put aside their morals and act as utilitarians. But there are limits. When we exceed them often or easily the society ceases to exist. Why not to decide torture for a minor crime? An official could take the responsibility of the bombers’ torture and after the case is over to stand trial. But to torture an innocent is a destruction of the foundations of the moral values of the civilized society. If we do such things, it is better for us not to exist and the bomber is right to fight us.
Yet if we had to choose we would do even that. We would survive carrying our sins. All we need is a man to decide torture and a man to apply torture. The others will seat like ducks. And why should they do anything? Life is the answer to life. Or they will face the responsibility of the death of thousands of people and even theirs. I think that this dilemma is made to find out how low we can fall to protect us and those that we love (families). So:
Way out: don’t have family
1. Life boat
When we enter the life boat we become members of the crew. The crew has to obey the captain. Because of the absence of captain we have democracy (or if we have the time we elect an experienced man as captain). If the crew decides that a man may leave, then it’s ok. If a man is needed the crew won’t allow him to leave and he must stay. It’s not a single man’s decision legally, unless it is the captain. But even if it is the captain the people may decide differently (natural law). Survival comes first, before the written law. (in this case).
This case must be covered by the written law. It would be interesting to know what it says.
If there is a man among us too valuable for the human kind we could allow him to leave(?). But is there such a man?
July 11th, 2009 at 9:47 pm
@solaris station (224):
Hey, solaris, I really enjoyed reading your response to the dilemmas. I think what you said made a lot of sense, even if I don’t agree on everything. Watch out for Mark, though, because as I and others have found out, he apparently thinks he’s Yahtzee.
July 12th, 2009 at 4:32 am
To moshmonster:
Hi moshmonster. What’s a Yahtzee? I red above your solutions to the dilemmas and the little disagreement that you had with Mark. I see that in your answers, you try to think out of the box, that is to find an original and clever solution so that you will not have to face the real dilemma. Everybody whould do that in order to avoid the pain and the cost of the solutions to these dilemmas, and the really clever people would even manage it. Let’s say now, for the shake of argument that every solution out of the box fails and you have to apply the solutions that you are given by the dilemmas. You have to think in the box. Shroom (no 115) analyses it better. That is “the point” . Maybe in the dilemma no 1 you can think outside of the box by finding a way to organize the work in the life boat so that they don’ t need you and thus you may leave. (let’s say why not 8 people to work for 12 minutes and the 9th to rest, or something like that). In the other cases you are asked to think “in the box”. A witty example of thinking outside of the box is Jack11 (no 12)
July 13th, 2009 at 4:33 pm
For number 9, I would save my wife. But it would not be because I’m mad or because I hate her lover because when it comes to their lives it would be a lose-lose situation. But I would save my wife because if I had to pick one to save then I would pick the one I love. Since she is already my wife then I know I can forgive her because I fell in love with her and her actions won’t affect my love. The mans life wouldn’t mean as much to me admittedly but I would still feel horrible for letting him die being that I am a doctor and my job is to save lives. I wouldn’t forgive myself for letting my wife die
July 13th, 2009 at 4:36 pm
and also about number 9… A lot of people are saying that they would leave personal feelings out of the whole thing, but you see doctors are humans and married doctors love their wives dearly. You will find how extremely hard it is to turn on your wife like that
July 13th, 2009 at 4:42 pm
As for number 8, I ain’t about to get fired because my friend can’t keep a grip on his wife. I’ll just go over to their house everyday and watch the drama unfold slowly as I sit back ad watch while my family lives off my badass secret e-mail money
July 13th, 2009 at 4:48 pm
For number 7, the only way that I would let the man get convicted for murder is if I knew that he would not get sentenced to death. Only then would I come in and save him from execution. But I would blackmail the fuck out of him after that shit. If he gets sentenced to life then I would let that bastard rot in his cell
July 13th, 2009 at 4:57 pm
dammit, #6 pisses me off lol. I would not want the pregnant woman to die so my first instinct would be to push her fat ass through the hole but if that fails then I think that they should blast it because there are a lot of lives at stake. and of course i would not want her baby to die along with her the good thing is that she won’t have to live knowing that her baby is dead this way the pregnant woman can be with her baby in death and the other people can live. now a lot of people would argue that they will only be together in death if you believe in that kind of thing but still it would be better to have her die with the baby because any loving mother would die anyway knowing that their baby is dead. SO IN CONCLUSION THE MOTHER DIES WITH HER BABY AND EVERYONE ELSE ONLY HAS TO LIVE WITH THE FACT THAT THE PREGNANT WOMAN IS A BRAVE HERO
July 13th, 2009 at 5:04 pm
okay so for number 5 i would go get my niece first because at least my daughter would be okay enough to hold her head above water until i get back. now yeah i understand that my emotions would be running extremely high at the thought of my daughter struggling but if i save her first then my niece would definitely die. so get the niece as fast as possible as i yell to my daughter to keep to the top as best she can and go as quickly as possible to get my daughter. this one kind of makes me cry because i almost drowned once because i can’t swim and its such an agonizing feeling so its hard when making decisions like that. my niece i know is definitely in more agony than my daughter
July 13th, 2009 at 5:07 pm
or also for number 5 save your niece and tell your daughter to float on her back. i read another comment that said that and said how it takes little effort to do that which is true so save the niece and let the daughter float until you get back
July 13th, 2009 at 5:11 pm
for number 3 that’s easy. i say the bag is mine. its better than living without my wife or son for the rest of my life.