Through history, as natural selection played its part in the development of modern man, many of the useful functions and parts of the human body become unnecessary. What is most fascinating is that many of these parts of the body still remain in some form so we can see the progress of evolution. This list covers the ten most significant evolutionary changes that have taken place – leaving signs behind them.
Humans get goose bumps when they are cold, frightened, angry, or in awe. Many other creatures get goose bumps for the same reason, for example this is why a cat or dog’s hair stands on end and the cause behind a porcupine’s quills raising. In cold situations, the rising hair traps air between the hairs and skin, creating insulation and warmth. In response to fear, goose bumps make an animal appear larger – hopefully scaring away the enemy. Humans no longer benefit from goose bumps and they are simply left over from our past when we were not clothed and needed to scare our own natural enemies. Natural selection removed the thick hair but left behind the mechanism for controlling it.
Jacobson’s organ is a fascinating part of animal anatomy and it tells us a lot about our own sexual history. The organ is in the nose and it is a special “smell” organ which detects pheromones (the chemical that triggers sexual desire, alarm, or information about food trails). It is this organ that allows some animals to track others for sex and to know of potential dangers. Humans are born with the Jacobson’s organ, but in early development its abilities dwindle to a point that it is useless. Once upon a time, humans would have used this organ to locate mates when communication was not possible. Single’s evenings, chat rooms, and bars have now taken its place in the process of human mate-seeking.
While many of the hangovers from our “devolved” past are visible or physical, this is not true for all. Humans have structures in their genetic make-up that were once used to produces enzymes to process vitamin C (it is called L-gulonolactone oxidase). Most other animals have this functioning DNA but at some point in our history, a mutation disbled the gene – whilst leaving behind its remnants as junk DNA. This particular junk DNA indicates a common ancestry with other species on earth, so it is particularly interesting.
Also known as the extrinsic ear muscles, the auriculares muscles are used by animals to swivel and manipulate their ears (independently of their head) in order to focus their hearing on particular sounds. Humans still have the muscles that we would once have used for the very same reason – but our muscles are now so feeble that all they can do is give our ears a little wiggle. The use of these muscles in cats is very visible (as they can nearly turn their ears completely backwards) – particularly when they are stalking a bird and need to make the smallest movements possible so as to not frighten its future meal.
The plantaris muscle is used by animals in gripping and manipulating objects with their feet – something you see with apes who seem to be able to use their feet as well as their hands. Humans have this muscle as well, but it is now so underdeveloped that it is often taken out by doctors when they need tissue for reconstruction in other parts of the body. The muscle is so unimportant to the human body that 9% of humans are now born without it.
Early humans ate a lot of plants – and they needed to eat them quickly enough that they could eat a sufficient amount in one day to get all of the nutrients they needed. For this reason, we had an extra set of molars to make the larger mouth more productive. This was particularly essential as the body lacked the ability to sufficiently digest cellulose. As evolution made its selections, our diets changed, our jaws grew appropriately smaller, and our third molars became unnecessary. Some human populations have now all but completely stopped growing wisdom teeth, while others have almost 100% likelihood of developing them.
If you watch a cat blink, you will see a white membrane cross its eye – that is called its third eyelid. It is quite a rare thing in mammals, but common in birds, reptiles, and fish. Humans have a remnant (but non-working) third eyelid (you can see it in the picture above). It has become quite small in humans, but some populations have more visible portions than others. There is only one known species of primate that still has a functioning third eyelid, and that is the Calabar angwantibo (closely related to lorises) which lives in West Africa.
Darwin’s point is found in the majority of mammals, and humans are no exception. It is most likely used to help focus sounds in animals, but it no longer has a function in humans. Only 10.4% of the human population still has this visible left-over mark of our past, but it is possible that a much larger number of people carry the gene that produces it as it does not always cause the ear tubercle to appear. The point (shown in the picture above) is a small thick nodule at the junction of the upper and middle sections of the ear.
The coccyx is the remnant of what was once a human tail. Over time we lost the need for a tail (as tree swinging was replaced by hanging out at the local water hole grunting neanderthal gossip), but we did not lose the need for the coccyx: it now functions as a support structure for various muscles and a support for a person when he sits down and leans back. The coccyx also supports the position of the anus.
The appendix has no known use in modern humans and is often removed when it becomes infected. While its original use is still speculated on, most scientists agree with Darwin’s suggestion that it once helped to process the cellulose found in the leaf-rich diet that we once had. Over the course of evolution, as our diet has changed, the appendix became less useful. What is particularly interesting is that many evolutionary theorists believe that natural selection (while removing all of the abilities of the appendix) selects larger appendices because they are less likely to become inflamed and diseased. So unlike the little toe, which may eventually vanish and is equally useless, the appendix is likely to stay with us for a long time – just hanging around doing nothing.
Contributor: JFrater
buc:
I know we aren’t supposed to carry things over from other lists/forums, but your perusal of juggs proves my prediction for you in 09 came true (I hope, for your sake)
..maybe I should take my show on the road
I hear what you say Skydiver, but it’s too funny LMAO, and why must i be ignorant becuz I dont believe what you believe??, when i said animals, i thought you were smart enough to know what i meant, but i guess not, anyway, moving on, what you consider evidence is just you desperatley searching for answers LMAO
Bravo Randall Bravo!
I think we should nominate Rolo for the “Highest Concentration of Ignorant Statements in an Electronic Media Award.”
well, i do tend to view animals often, and u missed my point…the dog got hit on the highway, cause he did not know better, so will die…and eventually they will learn not to go on the highway, however humans will put up signs and guardrails on the highway warning humans that they should not cross cause its dangerous, something we should know already…so the guy ignores the signs, gets hit, and wonders why society did not do more to protect him…and perhaps sues cause there wasn’t enough signs…lol then we give him an award…hehe
Rolo:
If you possess a Master’s from Rutgers then I’m the next United States Senator from New York–and last I checked, I ain’t Caroline Kennedy–though I used to fantasize about her quite a bit when she and I were both younger, and I had that paper route in Hyannisport.
Either that, or your Master’s is in “Marketing” or some other inane non-scholarly field—because you clearly don’t know what you’re talking about. So don’t try to “impress” me, clown.
And I don’t divulge personal details about myself on the internet, by the way—though clearly I could choose (if I wanted to) to simply make up a whole slew of credentials for myself. How would you know?
BUT suffice it to say that I graduated from AND currently work at institutes of higher learning that would kick Rutgers’ ass in a fight and send it home crying, you butthead. At least so says every ranking of national universities I’ve ever seen.
And yes, I possess a Master’s Degree myself–does that make you happy? What if I told you I had a degree that trumped yours? What if I told you I was a PhD and taught this *****? Would it make a difference to you? Clearly not. So get off the kick, jerk.
Now… since you chose to be disrespectful, you’ll suffer the consequences.
“Randall Thats great! thanks for your insult.”
Insults, Rolo. Insults. Plural. I didn’t serve you just one. Go back and check. And you deserved more than you got.
“But where is your proof dummy. “Microbiology alone gives us a big piece of the puzzle” which piece is that?? The one you didnt mention or too ignorant too know, or too lazy to look up?”
YOU are going to sit here and have the GALL to accuse me of being too lazy to look something up–or being too ignorant to KNOW something–when YOU are the cloudbrain that actually typed a comment stating that evolution was just a load of bull***** with zero proof underlying it? You’re going to have the gall to get at me for not GIVING you citations and links so you can go take a peek for yourself at what ANY goddamned FIRST YEAR BIOLOGY STUDENT KNOWS?
Here we have a well-supported and STRONGLY proven theory that has only grown MORE substantially obvious and correct over time, given both research and discoveries made since it was first formulated—a theory that is the MAINSTREAM of modern biology, the very backbone of it–and YOU are essentially saying that it’s nothing but a big conspiracy and a total lie. Sure. And I’m the one who’s “ignorant” here. Okay.
Take a look at Kreachure’s post up above–he was kind enough to supply a couple links for you, Rolo. But the fact is you’re capable of looking things up for yourself. Your PROBLEM is that you don’t do it. You want links and little written proofs from me or anyone else, go find them over on the thread where this was discussed by MANY of us ad nauseum, under “Your View–Should Creationism be Taught in Schools?”
Ah… but wait… you’ve since amended your foot-in-mouth statements to say that okay, maybe you’ll cop to evolution being real, but humans did NOT come from chimps or apes! Yeah, okay, Rolo.
“So I just made that up right? How about the Piltdown Man?? If you dont believe me here is the link, you piece of crap.”
That’s your only example, clearly. And thanks but no thanks, Rolo. I don’t need a Wikipedia link to Piltdown. Everybody and their grandmother has heard of it. Most famous hoax of its day or any day for that matter. Yup. And one of a number of scientific hoaxes that can be counted on ONE HAND. YOU had stated that scientists have been falsifying evidence for years, all over the place. YOU are the one who made the ridiculous statement here… an extraordinary claim if there ever WAS one. Since the rule is extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, I suggest you start coughing up more than just the lonely Piltdown Man.
“Do I need to paste more links or is this enough for you.”
No Rolo, it’s not enough. I need enough “links” and examples to call into question the veracity of modern biology and paleontology and about a dozen other disciplines–which is what you CLAIMED you had knowledge of.
So I suggest you get linking.
“Just because I choose to post a comment that is succinct doesn’t mean that I am talking out of my ass like you are. You are not fooling anyone with a fancy worded reply that is long and drawn out, but doesnt say a damn thing. Where are your facts? your empirical data?”
WHERE IS YOURS? YOU are the one attacking an established science, Rolo. It isn’t up to ME to sit here and offer you a parade of proofs. It’s up to YOU to offer up a parade of substantial challenges. THAT is how science works. And if you HAD in fact ever REALLY studied science, you’d KNOW that.
“No Im not religious, yes I have taken more than a few biology and anthropology courses.”
And obviously slept through all of them.
But in fact your swipes at me are–most likely–simply the redirected truth about yourself. You demand that I provide links, essays, proofs, etc. for the ESTABLISHED science that supports and in essence proves evolution and, in fact, the ascent of man biologically. Such information is available to any high school biology student. Now, it would of course be nothing for me to go around on the internet and find you a few links, moron. Would it shut you up and make a little light bulb go off in your head that would tell you you’re wrong about all this? Of course not, because if you haven’t figured that out by now, you won’t figure it out just because I did the work for you.
But since this seems to be a little sticking point for you, here–in all of five seconds, I did a quick search on the web and came up with two links. I could have easily given you dozens. I could easily send you to issues of Nature, and the New Scientist, or any number of other scholarly journals. Better still, I could send you back to the biology courses you claim to have attended and suggest that this time you pay attention.
http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/newton/askasci/1993/biology/bio039.htm
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/2437/hominid.htm
Doesn’t your ‘junk’ DNA imply something to do with your genitals?
Oops – sorry Callie, forgot your prediction. I just wished everyone on the bus would stop staring at me.
Rolo:
The Theory of Evolution does not state that man came from apes/monkeys/whatever, but that apes/monkeys/man shared a common ancestor in the distant past. As for our genetic similarity to a banana… well, we’re all just branches off the same tree, and if you go down in time far enough, you’ll find every living thing has a common ancestor.
oh and 113, sadtosee and sadpot whatever I’m delighted i makes you sick LOL, you should be even more sick at this list but instead you choose to believe that just becuz there are similarities that we come from them. oh yea, and trust me, you no nothing about me, im the last for that brainwash card.
Excellent!! Is there a list showing changes in other animals?
Excellent comments as well . . .
It’s a shame that every type of animal and plant that ever existed did not choose to die in a way that would enable it to be perfectly preserved for Rolo Tomasi as proof that evolution actually happened.
I myself find it perfectly acceptable that there are “holes” in evolution. I find it hard to believe that so many steps of human and animal evolution have survived this long anyway.
“If you want to tell that some animals have gained or lost features to adapt to their environment fine. I will give you that. I am not unreasonable”
Isn’t that a general definiton of evolution? Don’t contradict yourself in your own post, that’s just in bad taste.
And your banana arguement is invalid and just the type of thing people desperately throw out when they don’t have facts to back up. The DNA is similar, yes, because ALL DNA in living things is similar. Bananas, humans, monkeys, craygfish, it’s just rearranged per species. However, as I understand it (I admit I’m hopeless at science..I was an english major
) The human GENOMES make us, well…human. I assure you bananas have no human genomes, Rolo. However, chimps, apes, gorillas and even house cats do have some parts/variations of human genomes in their DNA.
Hey Guys!
jfrater- Thanks for the list and also calling it “signs” and not “facts”. More than one person has been convicted by a body of “signs” or “facts” or “evidence” or “proofs” and CONVICTED WRONGLY.
To my other Friends:
PLEASE do not confuse adaptive traits with evolution.
PLEASE remember that “facts” can point in a number of directions.
PLEASE be quick to listen- and slow to speak.
PLEASE remember that name calling is the last resort of the wrong. And we ALL might be wrong!
PLEASE Love one another!
Remember- LIFE is AMAZING!! Take more time to enjoy it!!!
All the degree posturing reminded me of the radio program Dr. Science – he’s not a real doctor, he has a master’s degree – in SCIENCE!
I had a Junior chemistry set when I was a kid and we used the magnifying glass to burn ants and other stuff. I also got pretty good grades in High School.
So it’s with that firm basis that I say evolution is wrong. Everyone who disagrees with me is going straight to Hell. So remember to eat your vegetables, take out the garbage and say your prayers.
I seem to remember reading that Will Rodgers, or perhaps Mark Twain, once said that he never let his schooling interfere with his education.
Rolo, I have forwarded your claim to have a Master’s Degree from Rutger’s University to the Dean of the School of Liberal Arts there along with a suggestion that he might want to review the school’s academic policies.
He has assured me that the school would be horribly embarressed if someone exhibiting the degree of ignorance shown in your two posts would even be allowed on campus never mind be granted any sort of degree.
There are several things you need to learn. (1) What a scientific Theory is. (2) The difference, in science, between a Theory and a Hypothesis. (3) That an exception, Piltdown Man (among others), does not represent the norm. (4) How the scientific method works.
Allow me to suggest that you make a tour of the great universities of the world, including your claimed alma mater of Rutgers, visit the science departments and see how many reputable scientists and academics you can find that do not accept the fundamental concepts of evolution.
This is not the ad popularum fallacy either. When the overwhelming majority (at last count something like 99.8%) of knowledgable, intelligent experts accept an explanation for the evidence as it is understood, then there’s a pretty darn good chance that explanation is valid.
By the way, that’s what a scientific Theory is. It is simply an explanation for some natural phenomenon based upon the evidence as we understand it. Evolution is simply an explanation for the variety of life found upon planet earth based upon the evidence we currently have.
Scientific Theories are NEVER proven. They are always tentative pending some new evidence or a better explanation for the current evidence.
There is currently lots and lots of speculation and argument within the Theory of Evolution among scientists about when, where, how and why, but there is no question about IF.
Allow me to clear up some of my previous statements. I do believe the human race has evolved over the years and I do acknowledge this to be nature’s doing. However, I believe that all existence, including nature, was created by a greater being… yes God. I also believe I have the right to believe this without being called an idiot. It’s a sad day when people get insulted for their beliefs on listverse.com. Please, all of you, show some respect to whatever an individual has chosen to believe in and leave it at that..
Can’t we all just… no I can’t say it.
Zigra #106 “Zigra #106 “I am going to challenge Rolo Tomasi to show some data that bananas and humans share 90% of their DNA, and remind him that humans did not evolve from apes, but that we share a common ancestor.”
Good point! An interesting fact about human evolution is that we share that common ancestor with chimps, but not Neanderthals. You have to go much further down the tree to find our common ancestor with them.
Here’s a question for which I’ve never had a satisfactory answer. Why do all living things have to evolve from a single source? Why couldn’t there have been multiple, slightly different simple organisms to emerge from inorganic chemicals that were somehow quickened at different locations or times?
YogiBarrister,
Current evolutionary theory hypothesises common decent from a single source or common ancestor.
I concur with Mr. Plow – this IS indeed one of the best lists I’ve seen on this site in quite a while.
I knew, immediately on reading the title of the list for the day, that this one would spark the old ‘creationism’ vs. ‘evolution’ debate. In that regard, I’d like to propose the following:
Let’s assert, for the sake of argument, that there exists (or existed) a power greater than any known to us at this time which created our earliest possible animal ancestors, whatever those ancestors may have been… and from that time to this day, our ancestors have evolved and branched in various ways (Kingdom, Phylum, Class, Order, Family, Genus, Species) to create, among all others, “homo sapiens sapiens” some 250,000+ years ago.
Okay, so I realized I have not read all the comments thus far, and suspect someone may have already made valid points of their own, so I’m more than willing to take a few clovis-pointed spears and broadhead arrows if I’m all out of line here.
Hemza3000 – listen pal, everyone has the right to believe what they want to believe. And it’s my right to make fun of it. OK? I’ve been called an idiot several times, and well, it’s because I’m an idiot.
But I believe that when a true idiot calls somebody smarter than he is an idiot, well it just lifts us all up to a higher plain of conscienceness.
Telling others to calm down and talk rationally in here is like telling AJ Foyt to slow down a bit.
See, I’ve just raised the bar here.
Yeah, you’ve raised it but we’re still sub-zero. You think it can’t get better than people making fun of eachother’s beliefs? I really don’t think it’s asking too much to respect eachother’s beliefs. Make fun all you want but do it with dignity.
90 jfrater
Thank you for the explanation
Out of curiosity, these are all examples of body parts that we still have but no longer really need. Right? Do we have any examples of body parts or things that we know without a doubt that early humans had that we no longer have?
I’m a Christian and I believe that evolution occurs on some level through ‘natural selection’. I don’t believe that we came from apes who were once fish who were once bacteria who came out of a bang from nowhere. But I do believe that through natural selection, we have adapted to our surroundings and needs. The above list to me supports my views in this sense: If humans no longer need it, why are we still born with it? Why hasn’t natural selection over the thousands or supposed hundreds of thousands of years simply bred these ‘needless’ items out of us?
Honestly I think that those people who refuse to believe in man’s ancestry are just to arrogant to believe that they are related to monkeys and instead come from God.
Honestly, that’s the most arrogant belief I’ve ever heard in my life, and IMO that just further proves our relation to apes.
Hemza3000,
You have every right to believe whatever you want to believe.
However, you most assuredly DO NOT have the right to be exempt from criticism for believing what you believe. Even if it’s somewhat coarse criticism.
“Why hasn’t natural selection over the thousands or supposed hundreds of thousands of years simply bred these ‘needless’ items out of us?”
Useless items take much longer to disappear than harmful ones. For example, if a squirrel is born white, it cannot camouflage itself against bark and a predator is more likely to see it, and thus its genes are totally swept off the gene pool before it can probably mate. Meanwhile, a person with an appendix is just as likely to have children as someone who doesn’t. Hence, the process is far more slower. In fact, such useless items ARE disappearing, but the human species is still in the process of doing so.
Henza3000, I don’t believe you are an idiot for believing in God. I think it may help people to adapt to a hostile environment. While I’ve seen ample evidence that proves evolution exists, proof of a god is scarcer. I choose to believe in God nevertheless, it helps me cope with the vastness of a freezing cold and nearly empty universe. Believing, or at least examining evolution scientifically, also helps people adapt. It’s more challenging to figure out how things work as opposed to blowing off the topic by saying, “God did it”.
another awesome list! what other signs of evolution are there?
Bluclism: Maybe you got goosebumps while you were peeing because you were ashamed at what your junk DNA had done to the size of your reproductive organs.
Hemza3000 – no I don’t think it can get better. Just go to the Black President or Global Warming or any other ‘our view’ section and take a look at how stupid some of the stupid arguments are. It’s a stupid avalanche of ingorance and an abundance of extra chromosomes and sloped foreheads.
Look, any jagov with a keyboard can hustle in here and say ‘YOU SUCKZERS – PWND!!’ then run back to ebaum’s world to watch the squirrel on waterskis. It takes a person with my background, talent and endless wit to truely bring some smarty pants back down to the slimey pit with the rest of us. And since I’m the smartest person in here, I rarely get any back talk.
Half the reason I come in here is to watch Randall disassemble someone’s argument while calling them a senseless turd. My feeling is people need to step it up a bit and fire up that weed whacker brain and give as good as you get!
Dre: One problem with evolution discussions is that everyone focuses on things we can easily see when really evolution is all about genetics (if you here the term “neo-Darwinism, that’s what their talking about. Darwin didn’t know about DNA per se.). See my post #38 (sorry about the self-promotion) about the gene causing sickle cell anemia. There is also a gene called CCR5delta32 that is found in about 7% of caucasians but not people of African descent. There is speculation that this gene mutation protected people against black death and was selected for and passed down. So even though you can’t see it with your eyes, that prevalence of that gene changed in the population, and that is evolution.
I love this
Nice list, very interesting!
Eeek – I meant “they’re talking about” not “their talking about”. I’m just lazy – not stupid!
I agree wholeheartedly with YogiBarrister.
“However, you most assuredly DO NOT have the right to be exempt from criticism for believing what you believe. Even if it’s somewhat coarse criticism.”
I believe I do, who do you think you are to get to say whatever comes to mind about my religion. There are some things that are off limits. The things I believe in are absolutely none of your business, nor should you think you have the right to say whatever you can think of just because of the fact that nothing is fact in my defense.
Take your time on that last sentence.
Thank you Rambo! Finally I have an answer to that 3 inches of angry blue steel. Only now I don’t have to pay a therapist anymore.
And in that last post of mine, truely should be truly.
Your’s Turely, bucslim
Dre,
Understand how Natural Selection supposedly works. It is most assuredly NOT intelligent. If a genetic change confers a reproductive benefit, then it will tend, over time, to allow organisms with that change to produce more offspring which have a higher probability of having that change, which in turn will produce more offspring and so on and so forth.
Eventually the “change” becomes the norm. If a change has an adverse affect upon reproductive probability, then it will tend to die out. If a change has no affect, it may or may not die out or become more common simply based upon random considerations or the luck of the draw.
Therefore a characteristic that is no longer needed, but also confers no particular reproductive disadvantage, may or may not eventually die out. There is certainly no Natural Selection imperative for it to disappear.
In other words, vestigal organs that hang around even though they have no particular function is precisely what the Theory of Evolution predicts will be the case.
I agree with Hemza, I also believed we were a;; created by God, although we have “evolved” in some ways bla bla.
But without getting into everything and regardless of whether I believe in whatever, interesting list! :0)
It is well documented (but altered for the sake of acceptance) that in the time of Christ approx 26% of humans did, in fact, have tails. Jesus was not crucified for his beliefs or his claim to be the holiest, but for the fact that he had not one, but two tails. All hail the Two-tailed Jesus!!
My degree is in Political Science. So you may ridicule that if you want. Im no expert, but i guess i will defer to everyone else. Since there are obviously so many scientists and experts in this thread.
I admit I am wrong, evolution and natural selection are very real. Unlike some of these other *&^% , I can admit when I misspeak.
But please.. I dont think that apes/chimps eventually turned into humans. Which is what I assume most of you are getting so worked up about
So I will ask a question. and I will, with an open mind, listen to any reasonalbe answer
How come there aren’t apes or chimps turning into human beings right this second? Where are the monkeys that are bipedal and losing their hair? Where are the half man half ape creatures? I’m not being sarcastic, this is a legitimate question I have.
If there is a clear answer than I will definitely consider joining the other side.
Hemza3000,
You said.
“The things I believe in are absolutely none of your business, nor should you think you have the right to say whatever you can think of just because of the fact that nothing is fact in my defense.
Take your time on that last sentence.”
I’m not even sure what that last sentence means. But I will say this. You’re 100% percent correct IF your beliefs are kept private.
But, and here’s the big but, as soon as you put them in the public square, they are open to criticism. As soon as you put them in the public square, especially if they are used as a justification for any of a number of things from limiting someones free speech (which you’re sort of attempting to do aren’t you) to outlawing gay marriage (which you may or may not care about, it’s just an example), then they become everyone’s business.
Dear sweet Rolo,
Thank you.
Anyone else here wondering why Rutgers University gives out Masters Degrees to someone who can’s spell or use punctuation worth a *****?
lol. good one. If you enjoy controversial topics check out my latest list:
http://listverse.com/crime/top-10-cases-of-human-cannibalism/
As usual. Its chock full of opinion and bias.
Guess I ruined my last post by f’n up my own spelling. . . guess that proves my earlier comment about me being an idiot.
from what i have read so far, it doesn’t seem possible to rationally disagree on this topic. for the “scientific” minds out there, is it possible for a person to disagree with the evolutionary theory and yet still be “rational”?
Rolo – I know you are not real and live only in the imagination of Sargeant Edmund Exley. But I will use my knowledge of you to trap my murderous lieutenant. Love, Jack Vincennes
why dont you give me a break. Im at work. I dont have time to correct all my punctuation. If I was some internet troll who has nothing better to do. Than maybe everything would be grammatically correct to the point of perfection. I guess that makes me some sort of ignoramus.
By the way you misspelled the word can’t. Fool.
#75 DC – I can do that too! Used to do it a lot when I was a kid and freaked everyone out.
All of your wonderfull comments are noted. Thank you for your participation. May the Two-tailed Jesus bless you all.
Rolo-
Political science is more politics than science. Go over to the “who should be the next president thread” and have a jolly time.
I see you’ve dropped your banana argument pretty quickly. First evolution is a silly concept. Then it may exist. Now it does exist. Why, Rolo…you’ve evolved! Imagine that.
Bah that posted without me being done.
Explain to me, if you now believe in evolution, and see the OBVIOUS similarities to humans and chimps, both physically and in our genetic makeup, where or what exactly you think humans evolved from?
Just doin my job here Rolo. No hard feelings.
Why are people giving Rolo a hard time simply for asking a question?
@ Zigra in post 152:
Although I never heard of that example, that still fits into my world view. Like I said, I do believe in evolution in that sense, that genes mutate for self-preservation and things like that. But I don’t see how that means God isn’t in the picture still. If I believe God was powerful and brilliant enough to design and create us and everything, then I also believe he was brilliant and omnipotent enough to have the foresight to give us the ability to naturally select and ‘mutate’ over time to adapt to our surroundings and environments. No?
@ Alencon in #157
When you say that natural selection is not ‘intelligent’, is that kind of a subtle way of saying intelligent design is faulty? I’m not a proponent of intelligent design or creationism because i’ve never really researched what their views are.
Thanks for your explanation though on natural selection. But to be honnest I find it kind of hard to follow/understand. Is there an example you can give to flesh out your explanation a bit more from an animal or from humans?
And to others, I’m still wondering if there are any muscles or bones that we know early human beings had wihtout a doubt that we don’t have anymore.
hemza. You and your question must leave at once.
Rolo Tomasi (160) – One thing I’ve learned is that evolving creatures tend to become more and more dissimilar than similar. Convergence of two separate species/Genuses is even more rare than parallel evolution from an earlier split.
Truth be told, there are certain ape/chimp species that DO act socially and/or ‘technically’ more like humans than their counterparts. There are a number of examples, but I don’t really have time to note them… you can search on social behavior and tool use among apes/chimps, and there should be plenty to glean. Some apes do in fact go prematurely bald… isn’t nature grand!?
honest. h-o-n-e-s-t. honest
Rolo Tomasi:
I’m sorry, but I just cannot believe anyone possesses a Master’s Degree in ANYTHING—even Poli Sci—and doesn’t know BY NOW that evolutionary biology has NEVER claimed that our species, homo sapiens, and its hominid ancestors evolved from CHIMPS or other currently existing species of great ape.
That is the kind of mistake that uneducated people have made since Darwin first published Origin of Species. It’s *somewhat* excusable when we’re talking about someone who’s uneducated–though again, by now, after this kind of thing has been covered in HIGH SCHOOL biology classes since god knows when–I’d hardly call it excusable–but at ANY rate…
For someone who claims to be educated–who claims to possess a Baccalaureate degree–LET ALONE a Master’s–well maybe it’s just because I work in higher education and have taught myself, but Jesus H. Christ…
If you’re telling the truth, Rolo, and you really did get that degree—then I’m telling you the god’s honest truth–you didn’t EARN it. And Rutgers should be ashamed for having it awarded it to you. And your high school should be ashamed of graduating you, and your college, wherever you got your Bachelor’s, should also be ashamed.
For someone to get that far in the educational system and NOT know this very basic thing–it just boggles my mind.
It would be one thing if you were some home-schooled religious nut who spent six hours in church every Sunday and was brought up to believe that every single word of the Bible is literally true—and you then went to some godawful “institution” like Liberty University…
Well never mind. I don’t know what more to say about all that.
Fine then. Listen.
Evolutionary theory does not claim that mankind and its ancestors descended from chimps, gorillas, bonobos, or orangutans, or any other currently-extant species of primate. Okay? It never has claimed that. RATHER what it says is that we primates share, FAR BACK in the family tree, a common ancestor. Current theory states, from the evidence gathered over decades, that OUR branch of the tree split from the chimpanzee branch (they are our closest living relatives) anywhere from 8-15 million years ago. Some scientists support the lower number, but my understanding is that a larger number, due to a stronger interpretation of the evidence, support the higher number.
At any rate, this does NOT mean that we “descended” from chimps. What it means is that we once had a common ancestor, and that ancestor gave birth to BOTH lines of specie–OURS and the chimps. Last I knew there was evidence that this common ancestor had even been firmly identified, but I’m not that in touch with the latest news on this.
Anyway, to DENY this is just silly. We share MORE genetic characteristics with chimps than ANY OTHER species on the planet. CLEARLY we are closely related, and by the theory of evolution, we therefore CLEARLY had a common ancestor at some point. The question is when and what that ancestor was. That’s all.
I frankly don’t understand what your problem with this could possibly be—or what anyone’s problem with it could be.
As for your other question… as to why there are no apes turning into human beings right now… good god. I’m still floored. But fine, again, I’ll answer it. The reason is, again, that NO ONE has ever claimed that the apes currently existing alongside our species developed into US. WE evolved on a separate line and are RELATED to the other primates on earth–but that again ONLY means that we share ancestry WITH them—NOT that we came FROM them.
Are other apes currently evolving? Maybe. Evolution is an achingly slow process brought on by adaptation, selection, and mutation. Most mutations don’t work. Occasionally one comes along that works as good or better than the original model, and if that mutation can successfully breed it may continue. In the case of the great apes, this does NOT mean that they would or could mutate into anything like “us.” OUR current make-up and appearance, etc. is due to chance (or, if religious folk prefer, god’s selective intervention into our evolution). Your question in regards to apes is no more sensible than if you asked it about lobsters–the reason there are no apes evolving into half-humans is the same that there are no lobsters evolving into lobster-men. Now, sure, if an ape were to evolve bipedalism and such, they might end up looking and acting a lot like us—but that’s because of our close physical construct and certain shared general traits. But the LIKELIHOOD that they would end up so isn’t much better than that lobster managing it.
Should apes evolve in some fashion, then it will be in ways that further them as a species–it might not necessarily mean greater intelligence or bipedalism or anything of that sort. It might simply mean that they became more successful at adapting to changing habitats, or they become stronger, or gain keener eyesight, or what have you.
Do you understand?
Randall. If I wanted to read a novel, I would just turn my sister and ask her what she is reading. Then throw her out of the bed.